Deciding Between Lennox Heat Pumps - XP25 and XP20

[buirechain]

Hi all

I'm trying to make a decision on which Lennox Heat Pump to buy as part of a duel fuel system, but I'm running into trouble because most of what I'm finding to differentiate my top choices, Lennox's XP25 and XP20 is vague. Lennox offers (pdfs) of glossy brochure that sound nice but say nothing. The XP25 is part of there high end Signature Line and XP20 is part of the mid range Elite line, so I'm supposed to believe that the XP25 is the way to go if I've got the money, and I (mostly) believe XP25 is but I really want to know if it's worth the money. As far as I've been able to Google, the XP25 is a bit quieter (but the XP20 is not much louder) and the XP25 is easier to hook up to solar (which is nice since I'll probably add solar soon-ish, but hardly a deal breaker), and of course there's the SEER and HSPF where the XP25 is theoretically better.

Well, I've found a bunch of different SEER ratings for the XP25. Lennox.com website says "Up to 23.50 SEER", lennoxpros.com (which I'm guess is for selling the equipments to pros--I just found it on Google trying to look for more details) calls it 21.5 (though they have multiple numbers) which is the max AHRIdirectory.org lists for any matchup I could find, but only 19 SEER for the matchup my contractor wants me to get. And that last number actually puts it at lower SEER than the XP20 which is SEER 20 across the board, including the matchup with the same equipment (I'll put the full details of those at the bottom). I asked my contractor why the XP25's AHRI SEER is lower and he said (and I'll probably mangle this so don't blame the contractor) that the AHRI doesn't really capture the way that the XP25 is efficient, and that because of the way the communication is handled it's actually significantly better. I'd be much happier with that explanation if I could find any information about what's so exceptional with the communication, or how it works, instead of the fancy adjectives lennox uses to sell to most people. Or, really, any explanation of how the communication, modulation, etc makes the XP25 better. Because on paper the XP20 system actually looks both more efficient and cheaper. Is the indoor unit or the furnace really dragging down the XP25 in a way that it isn't doing to the XP20?

I'd appreciate any opinions any of you have on what differentiates the efficiency of these, though I'd also really love if anyone knows of a trove of information Lennox (or anyone else) has about these issues that isn't in sales speak. As I said, I don't want to just know if it's really better, but if it's enough better to be worth it.

The details of the full systems my contractor is suggesting:

XP25-036-230
CHX35-48B-6F
SLP99UH070XV36B
AHRI # : 206366305
Cooling Capacity : 34000
Heating Capacity : 32800
SEER : 19
EER : 12.5
HSPF : 9.4

XP20-036-230
CHX35-48B-6F
SLP99UH070XV36B
AHRI # : 206322089
Cooling Capacity : 34200
Heating Capacity : 31200
SEER : 20
EER : 12.5
HSPF : 9.8

Thanks in advance,
Stephen

[Bazooka Joe]

This is the Bible when it comes to AHRI ratings just a partial model number of the outdoor unit in the correct area, nothing more ( xp-25-036 nothing more ) no brand names over 300 combo come up, if you want a higher efficiency XP-25 find a furnace combo and coil.

To view and print certificate ( if you want to ) hit sections in blue to bring you to the certificate page.

https://www.ahridirectory.org/Search...3&ProgramId=69

To compare features

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...kh-ukf1pvIta5-

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...RENTUN3kuRoH1E

Both should easily apply for any rebates your state or local utility company may offer. There is also the Federal Tax Credits

https://www.energystar.gov/about/fed...ty_tax_credits

One source for rebates: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...iQc0GVu13UMfK_

Don’t believe the Signature line of Lennox need to be registered in order to receive the maximum manufacturers warranty, whereas the Elite series do. If you reside in California or Quebec registration is not required to receive the manufacturers maximum warranty.

[Adlerberts-Protege]

Neither.

[pecmsg]

Concentrate more on the installing contractors name then the name on the box’s.

[buirechain]

This is the Bible when it comes to AHRI ratings just a partial model number of the outdoor unit in the correct area, nothing more ( xp-25-036 nothing more ) no brand names over 300 combo come up, if you want a higher efficiency XP-25 find a furnace combo and coil.

To view and print certificate ( if you want to ) hit sections in blue to bring you to the certificate page.

[redacted b/c forum rules]

To compare features

[redacted b/c forum rules]

Thanks. Those documents are definitely more details than I had before and it really makes them look almost the same except for the fan. And maybe some other things but I'm not sure how much of a difference there actually is in minor variations (I was reading carefully enough to see differences in paragraph breaks). Ultimately, I'm really wanting something that helps me understand how much better--but I'm not sure if that's actually out there. My contractor had mentioned that it all depends ont he communication system--but those manuals don't make any clear distinctions in that, at least not that I can see/understand.

I have looked around AHRI and see XP25 combos with furnace and coil that have higher SEER than what my contractor is suggesting but I don't know enough to second guess the coil--which is where the variation lies. It looks like Lennox has different types or configurations or whatever of coils, so if I am guessing correctly, the theoretically best coil for the XP25 wouldn't fit in my house somehow. Also, I just find it weird that the XP20 with the same coil and furnace has better ratings than the XP 25 with those items. I just don't know what to make of that.

Concentrate more on the installing contractors name then the name on the box’s.

That's how I started. After talking to a few contractors I found one I trust most and he gave me 4 Lennox options. I've eliminated 2 of those and I'm trying to decide between the other two the contractor has suggested. I've talked with the contractor since receiving his proposal and he's said that most people are going with the XP25 over the XP20 but it really depends and basically he can't decide for me. Which is fair (I don't want pushy contractors) but leaves me a little uncertain in this case having done the research.

I'm leaning toward the XP20, but I feel like the XP25 could actually be better for me, but the information available, or the information I'm finding, just isn't sufficient to show off the capabilities of the XP25.

[Bazooka Joe]

Punch in the XR-20-36 shows 340+ matches from a low of 18 SEER on up, so nothing different than the XP-25. Homeowners tend to look at the rating of the outdoor unit only as that’s the SEER they are paying for and telling their friends/relative that’s what the ratings are. Far from the truth.

I would not try to find a slightly higher SEER rating than what was offered as it may cost you a small fortune to change coil or furnaces for a minimum jump.

You may want to ask them to put in the contract that what they bid is actually what they are going to install, as have seen here that sections where substituted ( many times without telling homeowners ) because they could not get the parts. Can’t take credit for that line, another Professional Contractor/Technician here mentioned that…in another post.


Many systems are non matched ( system still works ) and there are no rating numbers for those systems so your only guessing at the ratings. Those matched rating numbers are not real world as they are computer generated or if they actually test a system, it’s in a environment chamber under controlled condition from from a real world situation but it’s a selling point.

You also need AHRI number for rebates, as when you submit documentation they ask for that number. IMO, what your Contractor told you is a smoke screen to a degree, they may not be very fimiliar with AHRI web-site or just don’t care to a degree….again just my opinion.

Hopefully this company has install/start up Technicains that have specialized training on these models as they are much more complicated than a bare bone single stage 14 SEER system.