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Thread: Who can solve this circuit design...latching relay???

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayMan7 View Post
    Yes exactly right! Thereís isolation so that G and Y being together doesnít cause any issues and yes thereís no fan on function with the way I have it set up.

    Ok let me see if I can do a better job explaining the issue and what I mean by latching. Looking at the first diagram I posted...the issue occurs when youíre output is connected to your signal. The trl07 takes a signal on B1 then it connects power from 15 to 18. After the signal ends it holds 15 to 18 for the set time (ie 15 minutes).

    So lets say I want Y and G held on for 15 minutes. I have the thermostat send Y to B1 to tell the relay Y is on. Well the Y signal will then never end. The relay is powering Y which is back feeding into its B1 terminal. The relay makes a signal loop feeding itself a signal from its own output. This condition is called latching and it can be a pain in the butt. See how the isolation relay I added prevents latching. It isolates the signal from the output. Does that make sense?

    Are you asking, would it work to feed Y straight in? Probably but Iím also using the relay for defrost and just wanted isolation to be on the safe side. I have to re look at my diagram but I believe if I do that itíll activate the oil heat.

    Iím still waiting on the fan delay diagram to see what the options are for using that. But I think the oneís Iíve seen solve the problem by directly powering the fan but we canít do that here because we need fan and hp. Or else it has isolation built in so itís just a circuit board version of what Iíve done. IDK weíll see.
    It sounds like you're assuming that when "Y" is activated through 18 on the TRL07 that it will tie to "Y" from the T-stat if it goes to B1.
    I'm thinking B1 is independent so the "Y" from the T-stat will never contact the "Y" connected anywhere else in the system.
    Anyways here's how I would wire it & if I wasn't worried about "G" & "Y" being tied together I wouldn't use any relay at all & just tie "Y" & "G" to 18.
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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by garyed View Post
    It sounds like you're assuming that when "Y" is activated through 18 on the TRL07 that it will tie to "Y" from the T-stat if it goes to B1.
    I'm thinking B1 is independent so the "Y" from the T-stat will never contact the "Y" connected anywhere else in the system.
    Anyways here's how I would wire it & if I wasn't worried about "G" & "Y" being tied together I wouldn't use any relay at all & just tie "Y" & "G" to 18.
    I will look at this! But did you happen to see my post number 20 I think I understood what you were saying at that point. Take a look at that and tell me if I understood you correctly.
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

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  3. #23
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    Who can solve this circuit design...latching relay???

    Quote Originally Posted by garyed View Post
    It sounds like you're assuming that when "Y" is activated through 18 on the TRL07 that it will tie to "Y" from the T-stat if it goes to B1.
    I'm thinking B1 is independent so the "Y" from the T-stat will never contact the "Y" connected anywhere else in the system.
    Anyways here's how I would wire it & if I wasn't worried about "G" & "Y" being tied together I wouldn't use any relay at all & just tie "Y" & "G" to 18.
    Nice diagram! Looks way better than my chicken scratch lol. Yes that would work nicely with nothing else involved! In the original post I should have mentioned the back feeding issue and that I wanted complete isolation. I should have also mentioned that the trl07 is a small snippet of the entire circuit which has quite a few other relays and other crap lol. Now I think it still might work to avoid Y isolation but I initially wanted complete signal isolation because there is quite a bit going on behind the scenes under different circumstances so I didnít want to worry about back feeding anything given the fact that Iím using multiple signals.
    Last edited by JayMan7; 07-19-2021 at 08:51 AM.
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

    "Call a technician for God's sake. Or we'll see you on the news or the Dark Side of the Moon."

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayMan7 View Post
    Hahahaha man we need better thermostats. Granted Iím looking for 15 minutes past satisfied rather than minimum run time but we need both settings!!! We also need all terminals to be 100% customizable. Like during heat 1 I should be able to change what runs versus when Aux runs. All of that should be totally customizable. Iím sure I could do it with commercial controls but I shouldnít have to go that far.
    In that case you could use the overcool settings it would only do so when there was too much humidity but that would be a good compromise. Just said it to 3į over cooling or something. I've done that in commercial buildings that couldn't maintain their humidity.

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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    In that case you could use the overcool settings it would only do so when there was too much humidity but that would be a good compromise. Just said it to 3į over cooling or something. I've done that in commercial buildings that couldn't maintain their humidity.

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    Yes thatís a useful option! I wasnít aware that there are thermostats with that option.
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

    "Call a technician for God's sake. Or we'll see you on the news or the Dark Side of the Moon."

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  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayMan7 View Post
    Yes thatís a useful option! I wasnít aware that there are thermostats with that option.
    Yeah if I get some time I'll look through my emails I actually wrote out a list of the exact ISU numbers and which setting to set them to for maximum dehumidification without reheat or any other energy wasting features. That is one of my all-time favorite thermostats.

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    Last edited by R600a; 07-19-2021 at 11:40 AM.

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    Yeah if I get some time I'll look through my emails I actually wrote out a list of the exact I ask you numbers and which setting to set them to for maximum dehumidification without reheat or any other energy wasting features. That is one of my all-time favorite thermostats.

    Sent from the Okie state usin Tapatalk
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    Is it the one you mentioned ?
    Honeywell prestige IQ 2.0?
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

    "Call a technician for God's sake. Or we'll see you on the news or the Dark Side of the Moon."

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  10. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayMan7 View Post
    I will look at this! But did you happen to see my post number 20 I think I understood what you were saying at that point. Take a look at that and tell me if I understood you correctly.
    I just read your post # 20 & now I see why you want to isolate the "Y" from the t-stat.
    What signal are you using for defrost to B1 ?
    I would think you could keep "Y" & defrost signals isolated with a single relay because I if I'm understanding what you are doing, both signals are accomplishing the same goal of keeping "Y" energized.
    I'm doing a little guessing but what you're doing sounds pretty interesting.
    Gary
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  11. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by garyed View Post
    I just read your post # 20 & now I see why you want to isolate the "Y" from the t-stat.
    What signal are you using for defrost to B1 ?
    I would think you could keep "Y" & defrost signals isolated with a single relay because I if I'm understanding what you are doing, both signals are accomplishing the same goal of keeping "Y" energized.
    I'm doing a little guessing but what you're doing sounds pretty interesting.
    Yeah I think youíre right about only needing to isolate defrost from Y. I think the real isolation I needed was in getting the Y from the thermostat isolated, which I did. Then I wanted to be on the cautious side concerning back feeding and had already mounted the relay. At the time I didnít want to think through possible scenarios I just wanted to play it safe...because lol...

    I have all kinds of shit on this system. For starters it has 2 thermostats in parallel I also built a fossil fuel kit for it with another delay on an aux call. Itís got a relay that prevents the hp from running with oil and will satisfy with oil once activated. Iíve got an outdoor thermostat and of course defrost delay and hp off delay now. I can manually defrost it from inside. Itís got relays to isolate the oil control for defrost versus E. Itís got a switch that enables hp and oil or just hp. Itís got all kinds of crazy safeties I added. An hour meter for oil because my tank is totally inaccessible. I got a dwyer manometer on there and some air cleaner accessories. Itís just really pretty crazy lol.

    Is it totally necessary no but itís kinda like having an old car that you constantly mess with. Itís kind of like a hobby and I love tweaking things and doing experiments
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

    "Call a technician for God's sake. Or we'll see you on the news or the Dark Side of the Moon."

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  13. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayMan7 View Post
    Is it the one you mentioned ?
    Honeywell prestige IQ 2.0?
    These were the settings I used for a particular light commercial application.
    You would need to go through the settings and figure out what really actually applies to your system but just to give you an idea of some of what it can do.

    ISU 9000 AC with high fan speed

    ISU 9010 thermostat internal sensor

    ISU 9080 high humidity Comfort reset with minimum on time

    ISU 9090 15 minute minimum on time

    ISU 9100 2 degree Comfort reset

    ISU 9180 dehumidification away mode allowed

    ISU 9190 dehumidification away mode fan control automatic

    ISU 9200 dehumidification away mode low temperature limmit 70 degrees temperature setting 80 degrees humidity setting 40%

    ISU 10000 passive

    ISU 10130 ventilation lockout above 80 degrees and ventilation lockout for high dew point



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  14. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    These were the settings I used for a particular light commercial application.
    You would need to go through the settings and figure out what really actually applies to your system but just to give you an idea of some of what it can do.

    ISU 9000 AC with high fan speed

    ISU 9010 thermostat internal sensor

    ISU 9080 high humidity Comfort reset with minimum on time

    ISU 9090 15 minute minimum on time

    ISU 9100 2 degree Comfort reset

    ISU 9180 dehumidification away mode allowed

    ISU 9190 dehumidification away mode fan control automatic

    ISU 9200 dehumidification away mode low temperature limmit 70 degrees temperature setting 80 degrees humidity setting 40%

    ISU 10000 passive

    ISU 10130 ventilation lockout above 80 degrees and ventilation lockout for high dew point



    Sent from the Okie state usin Tapatalk
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    Thatís awesome! Definitely a thermostat Iíd like to have if mine crap out!
    "I think Quantum tunneling would work great... "

    "Call a technician for God's sake. Or we'll see you on the news or the Dark Side of the Moon."

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