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Thread: R32 is the green alternative, but I canít source it in the US

  1. #1
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    R32 is the green alternative, but I canít source it in the US

    Howdy all, Iíve been researching all evening for my most recent project and it keeps leading me back to these forums. That being said here is my issue.

    Iím modifying a complete AC unit and I canít find the original refrigerant anywhere.

    Does anyone know where to source some R32 in the US?

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    It's going in Amana PTACs and other small units. Daikin, #1 in the world, is pushing hard.

    Carrier is pushing R454b (I think Trane too) for the future and it is also A2L.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    It's going in Amana PTACs and other small units. Daikin, #1 in the world, is pushing hard.

    Carrier is pushing R454b (I think Trane too) for the future and it is also A2L.
    Only allowed a few Oz (8 i believe) total charge unless the rules have changed again.

  5. #5
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    Installed a Cooper Hunter air conditioner a couple of days ago so it already came with the R32. Although frankly speaking I don't see any difference with R410A

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    Looks like A2Ls are coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by pecmsg View Post
    Only allowed a few Oz (8 i believe) total charge unless the rules have changed again.
    R-32 has been used by Daikin since 2012. They have over 25 million R-32 units in operation in other countries. Yes it is an A2L. Yes we will have to learn about it, but if you quit learning in this industry, you soon fall behind.
    It has been difficult to find in the USA, but that will change.
    The difference when compared to R-410a is that R-32 has 2/3 less Global Warming Potential and has a slightly high COP.
    R-32 also requires less of it to do the same job as R-410a.
    So, we need less of it. It is slightly more efficient. It has zero Ozone Depletion Potential (ODP). It has 2/3 less (GWP).
    Other companies are trying to come up with their own replacements for R-410a. One of those is YF1234, also an A2L.
    I think we better get ready to learn all about A2Ls.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by outdoor junkie View Post
    R-32 has been used by Daikin since 2012. They have over 25 million R-32 units in operation in other countries. Yes it is an A2L. Yes we will have to learn about it, but if you quit learning in this industry, you soon fall behind.
    It has been difficult to find in the USA, but that will change.
    The difference when compared to R-410a is that R-32 has 2/3 less Global Warming Potential and has a slightly high COP.
    R-32 also requires less of it to do the same job as R-410a.
    So, we need less of it. It is slightly more efficient. It has zero Ozone Depletion Potential (ODP). It has 2/3 less (GWP).
    Other companies are trying to come up with their own replacements for R-410a. One of those is YF1234, also an A2L.
    I think we better get ready to learn all about A2Ls.
    Thank you very much for the detailed explanation!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pietro8 View Post
    Thank you very much for the detailed explanation!
    for Jimship.
    I have sent a request to Daikin about the availability of R-32 in the USA.
    I don't know how or if they will reply.
    If I get any information from them, I will reply to the forum.

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    following

  10. #10
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    Just pulled it up online on my Johnstone account. Itís listed and has a price. Just wonít list a lead time.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #11
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    To go a little further, R410a is a 50/50 blend of R32 and R125. The R125 gave it the higher GWP, lower COP, but also lowered the flammability rating.

    Thank you Dupont.

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    When they installed my air conditioner, I was told that for me as a user there is no special difference between R32 and R410a

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pietro8 View Post
    When they installed my air conditioner, I was told that for me as a user there is no special difference between R32 and R410a
    Unless you developed a leak.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VTP99 View Post
    Unless you developed a leak.

    Hmmm...

    Has my sense of caution gotten out of balance???

    I just do NOT think potentially flammable refrigerants in split systems in folks homes... is a good idea.
    And all one has to do, to verify that leaks DO happen... is look at the shoddy quality of coil construction and failure rates in residential equipment.

    OTOH... if potentially flammable refrigerants are what it takes to FORCE the industry to fix the coil leak problem (as in use thicker wall tubing and stop rifling the inside)... then maybe there is a silver lining in this dark cloud...

    Strange ways the industry is heading... (rolling eyes)...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

    GA's basic rules of home heating and AC upgrades:
    *Installation is more important than the brand of equipment
    *The duct system keeps the house comfortable; the equipment only heats and cools (and dehumidifies)
    *The value of comfort, over the long term; leave economic choices behind!
    Choose your contractor wisely!

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by VTP99 View Post
    Unless you developed a leak.
    Yes, but nobody seems to think much about this case!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pietro8 View Post
    Installed a Cooper Hunter air conditioner a couple of days ago so it already came with the R32. Although frankly speaking I don't see any difference with R410A

    r32 refrigerant better performance 410

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by duchung87 View Post
    r32 refrigerant better performance 410
    I guess, although as a user, I don't really feel it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Hmmm...

    Has my sense of caution gotten out of balance???

    I just do NOT think potentially flammable refrigerants in split systems in folks homes... is a good idea.
    And all one has to do, to verify that leaks DO happen... is look at the shoddy quality of coil construction and failure rates in residential equipment.

    OTOH... if potentially flammable refrigerants are what it takes to FORCE the industry to fix the coil leak problem (as in use thicker wall tubing and stop rifling the inside)... then maybe there is a silver lining in this dark cloud...

    Strange ways the industry is heading... (rolling eyes)...
    A2L refrigerants are so "barely" flammable that it's simply not a problem. Their ignition energy is too high to be set off by a simple spark or pilot light. Even an A2 refrigerant (R-152A), which is allegedly more flammable than an A2L, will put out a turbo torch flame and not ignite. Do the same trick with an A3 like 290 or 600a and stand back! It's a shame that R-152A got "branded" as an A2 rather than A2L since it's a spectacularly good refrigerant with R-12 operating pressures and runs rings around R-134a and the GWP of R-152A is only 124! But, because it's dirt cheap and widely available, there's no money in it. Therefore we got stuck with HFO-1234yf which isn't bad, but it is $$$$.

  19. #19
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    What was the original refrigerant?

    PHM
    -------


    Quote Originally Posted by Thejimshep View Post
    Howdy all, I’ve been researching all evening for my most recent project and it keeps leading me back to these forums. That being said here is my issue.

    I’m modifying a complete AC unit and I can’t find the original refrigerant anywhere.

    Does anyone know where to source some R32 in the US?
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of Thinking

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  21. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viewsaver View Post
    A2L refrigerants are so "barely" flammable that it's simply not a problem. Their ignition energy is too high to be set off by a simple spark or pilot light. Even an A2 refrigerant (R-152A), which is allegedly more flammable than an A2L, will put out a turbo torch flame and not ignite. Do the same trick with an A3 like 290 or 600a and stand back! It's a shame that R-152A got "branded" as an A2 rather than A2L since it's a spectacularly good refrigerant with R-12 operating pressures and runs rings around R-134a and the GWP of R-152A is only 124! But, because it's dirt cheap and widely available, there's no money in it. Therefore we got stuck with HFO-1234yf which isn't bad, but it is $$$$.
    Are you with Intracon ?

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