Replytick, tick, tick.....BOOM!Originally Posted by numbawunfela
Glad I'm not you today.
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
I was here to change IP addresses and when I arrive there is a small crowd of guys all standing around looking at each other. After 3 minutes of debriefing, my mission is to revive a metasys server.... 'Good thing you showed up today'... Yeah - good thing.... Ugh.
This is an Old Metasys OWS that is the Archive Database for around 20 NCMs and has the GPL logic for the whole place in it.... So I need it back ASAP. I have chiller rotation logic for a 911 call center 30 miles away in this PC. Yes I have had the conversation about how this whole thing is a time bomb with the onsite staff REPEATEDLY.
The PC is a Dell Optiplex 280 that will not POST. I already pulled everything out of it except the HDD and a RAM stick borrowed from another Dell of a similar vintage and it still will not POST. So it looks like either the motherboard or the CPU are done. The CPU fan ramps up to full speed and stays there, and I can her the HDD start to turn. Other than the amber orange power button light and an LED on the motherboard, that is all I have for signs of life. I do not have any more Dell computers that are exactly the same, but I do have (2) Optiplex 260's.
Basically the old one is pretty much dead. I might try to Ebay another one for parts... but I am looking for options here.
As I see it these are my options:
1) Ebay another Dell of a matching model and try to revive the original PC
2) Move the HDD and peripheral cards to a similar PC and hope the OS, and Metasys are ok with it - I will be trying this next right now.
3) get a new PC and run a VM of the original server on it. I took that VM about a year ago, and I have a recent backup of the database I can restore to that VM. That VM barks at me to license windows XP, but I can break into it. I might be able to get windows licensed using a key off of the sticker on one of these PCs (or freely available pirated keys). I am also nervous as to what sort of PC cards the original had and whether I can get the VM to emulate that. VMWare is awesome, but this is 90's technology...
I am no slouch, but I know this is a combination of high priority and very obscure technology, so I wanted to get this out in front of the peanut gallery before I was too far into the hole. Thanks in advance for the responses.
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member*
tick, tick, tick.....BOOM!
Glad I'm not you today.
Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/
Professional Member
Are you talking about those old Dell GX 280, circa 2006? Infamous for death by bulging capacitors?
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
Well the Optiplex 260 has an IDE HDD conection but the HDD I got is a SATA drive. So that is out the window. I have a few more PCs to choose from...
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
Yes - and the capacitors are not bulging... that much.
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member
The fact it survived this long likely means it was from a later batch. I remember the GX270 and first batch of GX280 were affected the most.Yes - and the capacitors are not bulging... that much.
You can still get those motherboards, though not exactly an Amazon prime item...
Good luck!
Professional Member
Good day numbawunfela... well perhaps it is not such a good for you!
As for your HD issue... You could image your original Sata HD and then retarget the image to the IDE HD and try that. I have done that successfully on a number of old computers and this works well. In fact I have even imaged some IDE HD's and retargeted them to some larger IDE HD and this worked well too.
The software I used from from Macrium and at first I used the free version. This software worked so well and saved my can that I quickly bought licensed copies for myself and my customers.
The about would be a quick option (although the HD imaging can take a while) and if anything it would be something to try while you are awaiting a replacement unit.
That being said, if the replacement computer hardware is not really close to the original then the original HD O/S may have issues, as Windows O/S sets up Windows specifically to the target Hardware. However, it is worth a try.
Good luck!
Cheers,
Sam
Regular Guest
My hobby has become identifying of defective capacitors built in switch mode power supplies. They become extremely suspect when they have left behind the childhood age of ten years about and you switch off the unit for several hours. So they change the temperature, a very disliked operation and don't more start up.
To find them out you must apply an oscilloscope and of course an isolating transformer. Good luck!
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
As usual a very helpful post s2sam!
https://www.macrium.com/reflectfree
I just need to find a way to get that HDD installed in something that will spin it up so I can get an image...
Identical replacement motherboard... I need to get the CPU as well, as I dunno if that is good still...
https://www.amazon.com/Dell-Motherbo.../dp/B003EUUMV0
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member
For me step one is always make an image of the hard drive "as is" so you always have a fall back position. I second the Macrium suggestion. If the original hard drive is IDE there are combo USB to SATA/IDE adapters you can get in order to connect the original HD to your computer for imaging or cloning.
I would try #2 after imaging...but as you know Win XP is much tolerant of sudden hardware changes than later operating systems. What you can do is try the first start in safe mode which will attempt to boot up with minimal generic drivers. At that point you could try to uninstall any drivers that may not apply to your donor system, then reboot normal.
#3 is probably what I would actually try first myself...but that is because it is easier and faster to try things with a VM on newer hardware than trying physical restores on old hardware. Virtualbox is easy, also started using HyperV on Windows 10.
I don't envy you. I've been in your situation more than once!
Professional Member
I think it needs to be run against a running system but take a look at VMware Vsphere converter. It can turn a physical machine into a virtual machine, process is called P2V physical to virtual. Maybe you can stick the drive in a USB toaster and convert it offline? https://www.vmware.com/products/converter.html
Find a similar computer and see about a safe mode boot or maybe repair install if that doesn't work?
At the moment I like clonezilla for full disk images; https://clonezilla.org/
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That is how I got the VM I listed in option 3.
This VM looks more and more like the route I will be taking. No old PCs matching the hardware handy. The new mother board I listed is at least a week out - not to mention the CPU and the labor to get it all put together.
I have a few USB to SATA and IDE adapters I picked up to work with the old HDD as a plan 'L' as I work with getting the old VM of the Metasys server licensed and running.
It is SUPER annoying when the customer does this. But at the same time they are over a barrel and it is a T&L ticket to get it fixed - I will be done when I am done, leave me alone.
It just adds to the fires I already got burning. THANKS for the replies guys - I appreciate it.
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member
This could help with the bare drive; https://communities.vmware.com/thread/144379
Yeah, once it's a VM the hardware doesn't matter. Once you have the VM you can stick it in Oracle virtualbox and auto start it with something like this; https://stackoverflow.com/questions/...n-windows-boot
Really only did that because it's a free solution, one machine isn't worth a ESXi license.
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
I looked at that thread - thanks A LOT by the way. The instructions were pretty crappy - at least for me. I did something almost exactly like this one:
https://superuser.com/questions/8250...s-vmware-image
I managed to get the VM made - I had a heck of a time with the HDD driver. It is physically a SATA, but the VM wanted it configured as a SCSI or it would BSOD on me... there you go. If it was easy we would not make so much.
But it wants XP to get re-licensed. It has resisted my attempts to get that done as of yet. Phone calls are of no use AT ALL, and online as well so far... But I am sure there are ways official and otherwise to get that done. Now it is a matter of getting the IT lackeys to recognize my new MAC(s) and getting them routed so the devices will see it and be happy. I ran a long CAT5 do bypass some of the routing issues from the new server to the Ethernet/N1 router to get the stuff still on coax back online. so that is a start. There is a 911 call center down the road that is still offline, so the chiller pumps will not rotate... they will be ok for now. Since there is nothing I can do, i am really zen about the misery that may be going on - nobody has bothered me just yet...
The IT guys says - "how long to just throw the rest of the machines on VMs?" I then had a fun time explaining to him that at least 2 of the PCs are on Coax ONLY.... I do not have a coax to USB adapter for VMWare to use... if it could. It is not the conversion - it is the rest of the ecosystem that is the problem.
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member*
Yep. Much better to chase this setup forward, than just pull things forward. How much will this call cost?
Sorry, its a nightmare. Been there done that, I get it. At some point its time to say move up or piss off, its not in anyone's interest at this point. Maybe someone else is better suited to fit your needs and it not us.
To think a 911 call center wants help (and not surprised if they are all the same) carrying an XP box on, sorry. We can't help, but here are some that might. When that gets owned and the local news catches it like the Target hack, we won't be Fazio. That worth a few bucks that's hard to account without a bit of vision.
Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
Honestly I LUV it - this is a job that is firmly in the realm of 'Are you going to o any better?!? How about calling someone else?!? EXACTLY!! Now leave me alone and let me do my thing.'
They are over a barrel, completely screwed and I get to charge them by the hour to learn a little more about VMWare and be the hero at the end of it. Win Win Win.
The weirder the better for me. SOOOOO MUCH FUUUUNNN!!!!
There IS something to be said for not having a 911 call center run on Ebayed parts though. I had direct and concise words for the managers there....
I will be here for at least another day.
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
Professional Member
Yes, I noticed that about SCSI. Seems most of the defaults like to go SCSI and I have no idea why but it works.
IT could be your internal advocate, they understand product life cycles and could push to modernize other stuff after the emergency is done.
Ethically I have zero problem cracking a license on a product you can't purchase any more but I'm genuinely afraid to even go looking for those tools anymore. Looking in my personal archive I've got a couple XP pro technet keys. Technically they went out when they ended the technet program but rumor is they treat them as standard on the licensing server. Next issue is somewhere in the era they were doing keys per channel so if you were working from a dell image you needed a dell key and a retail key wouldn't work so you might be dealing with that issue too.
If you want to shop for keys you could give a shout out over here in the for sale/trade sub. I bought 10 pro keys in the recent past ~$8. Someone likely has that around still.
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Also I believe if you do run into that issue with product channel you should be able to do a repair install from a known channel media and key. Don't quote me on that.
EFC Committee/Professional Member*
It looks like the issue is that the Microsoft underbelly to validate these on the internet is not working. I used the magical jellybean keyfinder to extract the key, but when I click validate it craps out. It says it is online in network connections, but that is hard to validate when the browser is too old to show me anything....
All the IT forums say they were able to call Microsoft and get it done as of 11/2019... but I did that and got a lot of nuthin from everyone.
I am sure I will get it. I will try installing the XP OS over the top. It requires a key, but it does not seem to need to validate it online when I build VMs...
I got ideas, and a server that works...
The machine never ever wins... the just pit up a struggle on the way down....
Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.
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