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Thread: BACRouter from China

  1. #201
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    Every time I end up on alldatasheet I have '90s website design flashbacks.

    Bit more direct link.
    https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/2...93v-467882.pdf

    COM20019I 3VLJP for 28 pin PLCC* package
    COM20019I 3V-HT for 48 pin TQFP Lead-Free RoHS Compliant package

    MC's website
    https://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/en/COM20019i

    Seems MC leaves a bit to be desired in the part # breakdown.

    Lin's pic is the 28pin PLCC package, can't read the numbers on it. Would guess its a 5v part being of that vintage.

    From what I can gather the V3 is likely a 3.3v part and the LJP is 5v PLCC package. The I after 20019 is for industrial temp range.

    If that's correct, would think part change to see online MACs is a bit smelly. Seems to be a few different revs of that IC so it might be true. At a glance it looks like the new kid on the block is the same old guy in a lower voltage option. Had the same 48 pin TQFP package in the older 5v part. 3v part still has the same interface options as the 5v. The 3v part looks to be even more of a unicorn and costly than the 5v part. Quite a contrast when you compare to standard 485 transceivers in the market. MC decides to last time buy that chip, things gonna get interesting right quick for ALC I suspect.
    Last edited by orion242; 07-15-2021 at 09:52 PM.
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  2. #202
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    The part number on my picture is COM20019I-DZD, datasheet: https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/268/20019-468130.pdf

    Maybe the ability to list online MAC is built in LGR which could use a more feature-rich ARCnet controller.

  3. #203
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    Being able to power this guy off 12vdc was another bonus this weekend.

    Had an issue with my remote solar setup taking a dump and monitoring solutions with the existing charge controller are aweful, but its modbus. Off grid app, only have 12vdc power and wanted Wifi connection back to the house for monitoring. Stewed on what I had here to get from 485 Modbus to Wifi and into a jace for a bit and this guy came to mind. Solves the 485 -> IP, and 12vdc supply issues. Paired with a cheap Wifi bridge dongle and 12->5v dc-dc supply, problem solved with stuff I had on hand.

    If someone needs the Bacrouter mappings for Epever MPPT charge controllers, let me know.

    Here is the register list I used - http://www.solar-elektro.cz/data/dok...s_protocol.pdf

    BACrouter draws about 55-60ma @ 12v after its booted. Peek seems about 80ma during bootup, in my case at least. Nothing burger to add to my system. The OEM crap monitoring it prior likely used about the same.

    Like the improved mapping setup in the webui. Copying points with the right register setup / units, much faster. Auto assignment of the BACnet object, another plus. Also sorted out most of the common scaling BS I ran into. Had no issues bringing a early unit (non-din rail mount) unit up to the current firmware. Nice work Lin!

    Guess I'll see how this guy holds up in a outbuilding that gets below freezing and 100F+.
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  4. #204
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    Doing server moves this weekend. I had one of these connected to an Edgerouter. Pushed new VPN keys to the edgerouter, reboot it and when it came back the backrouter was gone. As in the edgerouter ui didn’t even see the port linked up any more. I know it was an earlier version but we were happy up to this point, first problem I’ve had with one ever. So that’s a service call in the next state over.

  5. #205
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    Sounds like an odd one there.

    This guy is going into an fairly unconditioned space, small (tiny really) exhaust fan that starts when its over 95F. Outside that, its whatever the northeast climate can toss at it. Within the industrial IC temp range, but its going to spend time in both extremes and I hope to not touch the setup for another 5+ years.

    Least now I have an good monitoring setup. Epever's logging and Wifi monitoring solutions are total trash. Charge controller seems pretty good for the dollar, the addons and software just junk other than the controller setup software which requires direct connect via their 485 cable.
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  6. #206
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    Lin, I think I found a bug in 4.15.

    If configured for a BBMD there is a message in the BDT table saying it will add itself to the list, no problem there. This list even appears to accept BBMD download from ALC server fine and again correctly won't show itself in the list.

    But if option "interval to push BBMD second" is non zero it will write a BBMD entry to other BBMD routers BUT it will leave itself off of the list. That effectively removes itself from receiving BBMD broadcasts from other segments. I did not perform a capture to catch this in the act but I was troubleshooting binding problems and could NOT figure out why the BBMD lists in routers was changing until I turned this feature off. The other BBMD router was constantly dropping the BACRouter off the list.

    In addition to that I don't remember ever turning this "interval to push BBMD second" feature on. Could that have snuck in after doing a firmware upgrade? This was new old stock with a 4.0something and I upgraded straight to 4.15.

  7. #207
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    Thank you very much, MaxBurn
    The bug is confirmed, will be fixed in next release.

    These days i am learning ARC156, it's interesting. Maybe we should start a new thread to discuss it.
    Carrier CCN Modbus/BACnet gateway
    BACnet router for BIP, MS/TP, Ethernet
    http://www.hvacrcontrol.com/?lang=en

  8. #208
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    Thanks.

    I started the ARC156 thread.

  9. #209
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    Lin; check your email, I've got a odd BACnet routing problem with the BACRouter.

    Also I discovered a handy undocumented feature; plugging a BACRouter straight into another controller with no switch works. No Crossover cable required.

  10. #210
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    Seems things seem are in motion. Wish any other product I touched got the same attention.

    Wish list feature.

    Ability to disable routing.

    Use case, install the BACrouter on an existing MS/TP trunk and IP network to capture MS/TP and still command the BACnet points that control the capture without creating circular networks in the BACnets.
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  11. #211
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    We are working on the problem MaxBurn found. I will report the result here.

    Orion,
    For your usecase, i suggest that:
    set all network number to 0 (Not configured), then BACRouter will act as non router when it startup, because it has no rout-able network on both side.
    set the MS/TP port in "Sniffer mode", then all the NPDU on the bus will not be processed by BACRouter. so BACRouter will not learn rout-able network on MS/TP side, so it will keep non router role on BIP side.
    Of course, BACRouter will not send packet to MS/TP in sniffer mode, the route info on BIP side will not pollute MS/TP side.

    On above setting, BACRouter will still respond to network layer messages on BIP, which will not conformant to requirement of a non router. but it usually not affect normal operation.
    Carrier CCN Modbus/BACnet gateway
    BACnet router for BIP, MS/TP, Ethernet
    http://www.hvacrcontrol.com/?lang=en

  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by lin View Post
    On above setting, BACRouter will still respond to network layer messages on BIP, which will not conformant to requirement of a non router. but it usually not affect normal operation.
    Will give that a try. Thank you.
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  13. #213
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    I just want to say that the support experience I received from Lin was extremely impressive and he has my thanks. In a single day he identified the problem in our diagnostic captures that was creating the problem and produced a new firmware correcting the issue. In contrast ALC support given almost a full week gave us one very basic response on a configuration check and nothing else in that time frame.

    Specifically the problem was the hop count for a "apparently" relayed IAM response, below. This capture is from the MSTP port of the G5CE. Captures from the BACRouter show the same thing. It shows an apparently "impossible" hop count of 255 when the packet obviously traversed a router. The packet was dropped as a result.

    Details on the problem are the "Home" network setting in the ALC router, this appears to control where the Application layer of that device resides. If I shift the home network to the MSTP port this issue goes away. I didn't test it but it probably moves to the other ports in that case. The BACnet standards question is; this appears from the capture that the response traversed a router and should have a lower hop count?


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  14. #214
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    @MaxBurn , thanks for posting the issue and description. Good meat to chew on.
    Lin, do you consult? Maybe ALC needs to bill you for a morning and get the lowdown on how you fixed this.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by numbawunfela View Post
    @MaxBurn , thanks for posting the issue and description. Good meat to chew on.
    Lin, do you consult? Maybe ALC needs to bill you for a morning and get the lowdown on how you fixed this.
    It's very happy to work with MaxBurn, he had done most tests to eliminate wrong direction before looking for support.
    As a technician, the right answer itself is the payment.

  16. #216
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    This is one of those bugs that seems obvious when pointed out but it might be a difference of opinion in the interpretation of the rules. Technically the reply came from that device and didn’t traverse a router even if that’s not what the capture shows. ALC has been BTL for decades, but maybe nobody is looking at this detail.

    Packets passed through the ALC router are handled correctly which made the problem wild to troubleshoot. For example; Modules on ARCnet could route through the G5CE and reach Trane fine but the G5CE itself could not.

  17. #217
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    I meant to give Lin a pat on the back, not smear ALC.
    You are probably right. Just a rule interpretation. Either way, good job Lin.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

  18. #218
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    We can call out ALC. I think Lin has already pointed out that there doesn't seem to be a test for this in certification, so it might not show up in BTL qualifications.

    This is also a level of data integrity checking that apparently no other router is doing. Replacing the BACRouter with a LGR or a BASRT works fine. We've done this network setup for years in many other locations.

  19. #219
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    Just scanning through the manual for this guy, I don’t see a wiring detail showing what to do if you pull a 3 wire comm trunk. Would you guys land the reference to ground at the bacrouter?


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  20. #220
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    I only land the 3rd wire if it measures significantly different than 24v common as measured with a voltmeter. Since the 3rd wire is the electrical reference for the rs485 comms on the 3 wire side, and so is the 24v common on the 2 wire side.
    If I land the 3rd wire, it is through a resistor. I use a 120ohm termination resistor. The rs485 spec calls for 100ohm, but the termination resistor is handy and works fine.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

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