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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Billington Heights, NY
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beltit View Post
    Since I'm hyper-sensitive, creating a magnetic field in my home kinda worries me.
    Better stop the Earth and get off. You're living in the strongest one around... the Earth itself. Plus, every wire, light, phone - corded or not, computer, etc. creates a field. You should be more afraid of the marketing and "ions" this thing supposedly creates.

    If this thing was so great, there'd be people on here raving about it.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
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    1,357
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    Dunno how well it does/doesn't work, but GPS plasma systems are being spec'ed in a commercial job that we are installing right now on a school. They seem to believe in them.

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Northern NV
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjk_cmh View Post
    Dunno how well it does/doesn't work, but GPS plasma systems are being spec'ed in a commercial job that we are installing right now on a school. They seem to believe in them.
    Be very interesting to have some feedback from the school install once the school is in operation for a few months.... Being the "adopted okie" I am, I need a "show me" on these.

  4. Likes HVAC_Marc liked this post
  5. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjk_cmh View Post
    Dunno how well it does/doesn't work, but GPS plasma systems are being spec'ed in a commercial job that we are installing right now on a school. They seem to believe in them.
    I installed one of the gps units, the iwave-r right before Christmas. I had a 8' tall Christmas tree in my living room, after installing the iwave i couldn't smell it anymore. I run my fan in the on position through the heating season, but in cooling i run it in circulate mode for humidity reasons. When it cycles off i start smelling my house again. When it cycles on i can't smell anything. I love it!

    There's a video online of it dissipating a jar full of smoke in seconds, i have done it to with a demo model we have on hand. Pretty impressive...

    Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

  6. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    8,200
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    I hope there is new technology that will clean up indoor air. In certain seasons if I bring in outside air my allergies go nuts. Juniper, mulberry season. Fresh isn't always the answer if it's contaminated.
    When electronic air cleaners were new the sales people had a small box that they would blow cigarette smoke into ( seems everyone smoked). They would plug the box cord in the wall, push a button and the smoke would disappear. There were wires in the box that would have high voltage on them and act like an EAC. A big WOW when people saw that happen.
    I know science isn't done with this yet.

    When I did the controls at a casino way back there were what looked like large electron tubes. I wasn't able to find out much at the time but they were supposed to get rid or smoke. As I don't gamble I never got to see if they did much.
    They were marketed by Trane I think.
    I should have played the g'tar on the MTV. MK

    You can be anything you want......As long as you don't suck at it.

    USAF 98 Bomb Wing 1960-66 SMW Lu49

  7. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Madison, WI/Cape Coral, FL
    Posts
    8,723
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    Primary basics for indoor air quality are:
    1. A filtered fresh air change in 4-5 hours depending the indoor pollutant and quality outdoor air. This purges indoor pollutants and renew oxygen.
    2. Maintain 50-55% RH inside the occupied space to control biological growth of mold/dust mites and etc.
    3. Wet or near spots indoors can not be continuous for more than 24 hour at with potiential growth of mold. This inculdes ducts interior/exterior/drywall/grills/attic space. After wetting these surfaces for 24 hour, thy need to be dried periodically for several hours every day to mold growth accumulation which will adversely most sensitive occupants. Cooling coil/condensate pans may be the exception to this if the condesing surfaces has condensate flow high enough to flush fine organic dust and mold/bacteria spores down the drain. Also maintaing <50-60^F in these wet areas slows biological growth.
    These are basics before going to the more advance concepts of cleaning air which have their own unique challenges.
    Many suggest a medium single speed a/c installed/setup to provide the optimum %RH, 45-5%RH during extend runs and design conditions, inculding fresh air and occupants. During times of less than the design load conditions, expect the indoor %RH to rise depending latent load. Latent coolings tend to remain at design conditions during evenings and rainy days. When the indoor %RH approaches 60%RH, supplement dehumidification is needed. Slowing air flow more and removing more latent and less sensible improves maintaining humidity control depending on actual latent loads.
    Most actual latent loads of fresh air infiltration/ require +40% sensible load conditons to remove the typical 4-6 lbs per hour latent/moisture to maintain near 50%RH neaded for ideal conditions of 75%RH, 50%RH for comfort.
    Supplemental dehumidification by whole house dehumidifier connected the is simplest and most cost effective method when added correctly to properly setup a/c. Controls and ducting are critical.
    This post is max at length for most. More information check out the
    Utra-Aire.com and other info web sites indoor air quality. Sort out the real info from the pitch.
    Looking more discussion.
    Regards Teddy Bear
    Bear Rules: Keep our home <50% RH summer, controls mites/mold and very comfortable.
    Provide 60-100 cfm of fresh air when occupied to purge indoor pollutants and keep window dry during cold weather. T-stat setup/setback +8 hrs. saves energy
    Use +Merv 10 air filter. -Don't forget the "Golden Rule"

  8. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Tyler, TX
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    5
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    Works well

    Quote Originally Posted by Brand0ndparris View Post
    I had a 8' tall Christmas tree in my living room, after installing the iwave i couldn't smell it anymore.
    I had similar results with a Cold Plasma Purifier. My wife no longer buys expensive Scensy wax products, because she can't smell them anymore!

    I've also noticed that my child, that has worst problems with allergies, does much better when we have the purifier installed.

  9. Likes Frank10 liked this post
  10. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    New Mexico
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjk_cmh View Post
    Dunno how well it does/doesn't work, but GPS plasma systems are being spec'ed in a commercial job that we are installing right now on a school. They seem to believe in them.

    A school might be a poor example of a product's value because mostly just the school board needs to want it. They often are not professionals in the air quality field. Here it's mostly political.
    Someone up the ladder just needs to be sold on the hype.
    I would like to know if any white papers are out there from a neutral party that has shown value.
    I should have played the g'tar on the MTV. MK

    You can be anything you want......As long as you don't suck at it.

    USAF 98 Bomb Wing 1960-66 SMW Lu49

  11. Likes HVAC_Marc liked this post
  12. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    44
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    Quote Originally Posted by energy_rater_La View Post
    very timely for me, that this old thread surfaced.
    SO's brother was talking about installing the cold plasma
    purifier @ their mother's house.

    thanks for the link!
    Was the cold plasma purifier ever installed? If so, what were the results?

  13. #23
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    2
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    Phenomenal Aire Bipolar Needlepoint Ionizer Just Installed in Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Beltit View Post
    Was the cold plasma purifier ever installed? If so, what were the results?
    Less than 24 hours ago, we installed a Phenomenal Aire bipolar needlepoint ionizer in our heatpump cabinet. The unit is located in the airflow: Media Filter -> Phenomenal Aire -> coils -> blower.

    Background in Brief

    Location: Southeastern US
    We installed this after exhausting other options to eliminate the source of my wife’s mold allergies. After crawlspace mold remediation (from storm damage), encapsulation and installing a Santa Fe dehumidifier in the crawl, things were fine in the house in heating mode during winter. Then the heatpump changed to cooling mode. The damp coils must have created the perfect environment for organic matter to start growing again. Cleaning the coils was risky because during mold remediation one company might have used Sporicidin on the coils, which, according to the company that manufactures Sporicidin, should not be mixed with anything containing chlorine bleach, which at least some coil cleaners might contain.

    We’d tried a UV light, but no matter where the light was placed, it reacted with something in air handler cabinet creating the odor of a hot beach ball.

    After a lot of online research, we decided to avoid the PCO devices citing *possible* implications in creating formaldehyde, ozone, and ultrafine particles produced as the titanium dioxide catalyst breaks down. We decided to try a bipolar ionization device. The other option was to replace this 5-year-old HVAC, though we couldn’t confirm that the air handler was the source of the problem. (We had also had our 50-year-old metal ducts cleaned and the insulation removed during the mold remediation & encapsulation.)

    Results
    Though only anecdotal, in under 24 hours the Phenomenal Aire seems to have reduced household odors, so much so that I thought it had effected my sense of smell. When I opened a couple of windows I didn’t notice an immediate “fresh air” sensation but could smell the fragrant flowers of honey suckle.

    My wife says there is a slight improvement in the odor coming from the vents. It’s probably too early to tell if this will work. (I would describe the odor from the vents that we’re trying to eliminate as a little like a sharpie marker, slightly medicinal, slightly sour. It’s very faint, so much so that most HVAC techs shake their head and say they don’t smell anything.)

    Our Dylos 1100 Pro particle counter was giving very low particle counts this morning until I opened the windows. I don’t have a VOC detector, so I’ve got no clue there.

    The Phenomenal Aire didn’t add any discernible odor to the airstream—no ozone-like odors.

    Concerns

    Calibration
    How are these things tested to ensure the negative and positive ions generated are approximately the same?
    Long-term Health Effects

    Cons
    Price. This thing is expensive and nothing about it looks expensive. There is something to be said for research and development, and for quality control, but I have no idea how many ions this produces or how balanced the productions of negative vs. positive ions is. My guess is that these are a really money maker for HVAC companies.

    Warranty. The Phenomenal Aire has a 2-year warranty. This seems very short for a device that is so expensive and so new on the market.

    Pros
    The only maintenance required is to have a tech clean the needles (which actually look more like small wire artists paintbrushes).

    Low energy draw.

    Generates no noise.

    If this works, I’ll scream its benefits from the mountain tops or just report back here.

    Disclaimer

    It’s probably apparent, but I’m not a scientist, health professional, or HVAC pro and some of the info I’ve posted here might be erroneous, in particular the info I’ve read about PCO devices.

    I’ll report back here after this thing has had more time to run and any placebo effect has at least diminished.

    Frank

    PS
    Might also be of interest to people trying to avoid producing ozone in their homes:
    PCO to Glass & Needlepoint Ionization Ozone and Ion Output Comparison on YouTube. Test conducted by Global Plasma Solutions. (They sell needlepoint ionizers.)
    Search YouTube for Global Plasma Solutions / PCO to Glass & Needlepoint Ionization Ozone and Ion Output Comparison. If the audio is very buzzy, you've got the right one.
    Last edited by Frank10; 05-24-2018 at 11:06 AM. Reason: Addtional Content

  14. #24
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    2
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    Using a TriField Meter (Model 100XE), magnetic and electrical fields drop off to nothing (or no more than ambient fields) at around 15 inches from the back of the Phenomenal Aire Series R 6.0.

    If you are concerned about the ions or changes to the air stream, I can only tell you that my wife is very sensitive to fragrance and odors and the Phenomenal Aire, in the 24 hours we've been running it, seems to improve things.

    A good HVAC company might let you try the Phenomenal Aire and remove it if you have issues. Ours offered to.

    Good luck!

    Frank

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