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Thread: Do you guys test for substances in your employees? (talking about weed obviously)

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    Terminate/Discipline employees for having poor work performance, not for having a substance in their system. See the difference?
    Yeah, one way lets the employee drive down the highway in 3 to 4 tons of vehicle endangering the lives of other people. Risking the company being sued.
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  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    Yeah, one way lets the employee drive down the highway in 3 to 4 tons of vehicle endangering the lives of other people. Risking the company being sued.
    I agree. Need to be as proactive as possible.


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  4. #43
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    This whole thread makes me sad.


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  6. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    Terminate/Discipline employees for having poor work performance, not for having a substance in their system. See the difference?
    Often related.

    In high school during 69-72 always wondered about "what's happening" until getting high ONCE years later. Never tried again.

    Went dove hunting once with a stoner, lit up in his blind, bet he went thru 6 boxes of shells to get 8-10 doves. I was just glad to be a couple hundred of yards away. Some of the hard core stoners overtime developed paranoia.

  7. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by ehsx View Post
    Often related.

    In high school during 69-72 always wondered about "what's happening" until getting high ONCE years later. Never tried again.

    Went dove hunting once with a stoner, lit up in his blind, bet he went thru 6 boxes of shells to get 8-10 doves. I was just glad to be a couple hundred of yards away. Some of the hard core stoners overtime developed paranoia.

    I remember a study (no link) way back that said a person who's under the influence of alcohol (not sure how much) can lift more weight but an archer will miss more targets. That's fairly easy to understand.
    Most employers don't want the problems with substance abuse. Zero tolerance. Can't blame them because insurance insists for coverage they demand a drug free work place and a drug free employee. Including their private time. Next hurdle is legalization of not just pot but mushrooms might very follow. Both these substances have demonstrated to be safer than alcohol or tobacco. People have been drunk or affected by alcohol on the job forever but because it was socially acceptable to drink little was said. The three martini lunch it was called. I have no idea where this is going or what can be done about it.
    Little is being said about prescription drugs that can have similar or the same effects as street drugs but will be excused and allowed. There are way too many to list. It's easier to just list the effects.
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  8. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    Terminate/Discipline employees for having poor work performance, not for having a substance in their system. See the difference?
    You work for me & come to work high or drunk it's AMF ( adios mother F'er ) . I gave him a chance , explained if he had a problem it could be fixed BUT he chose to not work under my rules. I have no tolerance for any non-med drug use or drunkenness. I'm a drummer and in my early years out in the big world saw a lot of cause & effect of weed, acid, speed, cocaine etc on some really talented people & I chose a different path.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldguy1949 View Post
    You work for me & come to work high or drunk it's AMF ( adios mother F'er ) . I gave him a chance , explained if he had a problem it could be fixed BUT he chose to not work under my rules. I have no tolerance for any non-med drug use or drunkenness. I'm a drummer and in my early years out in the big world saw a lot of cause & effect of weed, acid, speed, cocaine etc on some really talented people & I chose a different path.
    Yes i respect that but i think you missed what i was saying. If johnnyboy is grinding it out at work, happy customers, quality craftsmanship, etc, then why does he need to piss in a cup? If johnnyboy's quality is slipping, angry customers, showing up late, why does he need to piss in a cup? Just discipline him for slipping, or fire him. The whole drug test part is unnecessary. We have all seen people fall to pieces from drugs and alcohol, but i also have seen equally as many people who were partying up with weed on the weekends but were holding down high dollar, technical jobs with finesse. Its just not right to lob everyone together into one group of "undesirables"

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  11. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by heatingman View Post
    This whole thread makes me sad.


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    I was thinking that earlier.

    How miserable do you have to be to need to get high, stoned, drunk. buzzed, or what ever other term you want to apply, just to cope. If you say it is not coping but just for enjoyment then why does it need to be from Friday night to Sunday afternoon? I see life as it is amazing and don't see a reason to have to be in an altered state to enjoy it.

    Life has it's ups and downs. If you don't face the defeats you can't enjoy the wins. It is through the depths of the valley that we gain understanding of the view from the heights. It is from enduring the darkness that you can appreciate the light. If you artificially cut off the bottom you never gain the strength to make it to the top.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldguy1949 View Post
    You work for me & come to work high or drunk it's AMF ( adios mother F'er ) . I gave him a chance , explained if he had a problem it could be fixed BUT he chose to not work under my rules. I have no tolerance for any non-med drug use or drunkenness. I'm a drummer and in my early years out in the big world saw a lot of cause & effect of weed, acid, speed, cocaine etc on some really talented people & I chose a different path.
    Quote Originally Posted by BNME8EZ View Post
    I was thinking that earlier.

    How miserable do you have to be to need to get high, stoned, drunk. buzzed, or what ever other term you want to apply, just to cope. If you say it is not coping but just for enjoyment then why does it need to be from Friday night to Sunday afternoon? I see life as it is amazing and don't see a reason to have to be in an altered state to enjoy it.

    Life has it's ups and downs. If you don't face the defeats you can't enjoy the wins. It is through the depths of the valley that we gain understanding of the view from the heights. It is from enduring the darkness that you can appreciate the light. If you artificially cut off the bottom you never gain the strength to make it to the top.
    There are tons of countries where weed is fully legal. They arent falling to pieces. Also what about people with chronic pain or terminal illness? You can choose not to partake, since you arent "miserable", but why does that mean nobody else can either? This is 2020, not 1960. The studies have been published for years and years on positive effects of marijuana. There is no excuse for ignorance anymore.

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  14. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    There are tons of countries where weed is fully legal.

    But the USA is not one o those countries, so that doesn't really matter.

    They arent falling to pieces.

    Actually, only 4 countries have legalized it. A few have made it a non criminal offense.

    Also what about people with chronic pain or terminal illness? You can choose not to partake, since you arent "miserable", but why does that mean nobody else can either? This is 2020, not 1960. The studies have been published for years and years on positive effects of marijuana. There is no excuse for ignorance anymore.
    Chronic pain and terminal illness patients can get a medical card.
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    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    Chronic pain and terminal illness patients can get a medical card.
    Yes of course, medical card. And it works wonders. The problem is, these people can't get jobs because they pee dirty even though this is discriminatory based on health/medical conditions. This is an issue in many states currently.

  16. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    Yes of course, medical card. And it works wonders. The problem is, these people can't get jobs because they pee dirty even though this is discriminatory based on health/medical conditions. This is an issue in many states currently.
    Wouldn't want to hire one of them anyways. They might claim that their injury/pain was made worse by the work I had them do, and sue me.

    Its not the dirty test that prevents many of them from getting hired. Its the concealing of using.
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  17. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    There are tons of countries where weed is fully legal. They arent falling to pieces. Also what about people with chronic pain or terminal illness? You can choose not to partake, since you arent "miserable", but why does that mean nobody else can either? This is 2020, not 1960. The studies have been published for years and years on positive effects of marijuana. There is no excuse for ignorance anymore.
    You do realize there has not been a study in the past 50 years that was not bought and paid for, right. Now if you were paying big money for a study do you want the truth or do you want 'your" truth. The study that said tobacco has some medical benefits was paid for by the tobacco lobby. The study that said Bacon was good was paid for by the pork industry. The study that said coffee was good for you was paid for by the Starbucks (coffee related industry). If you dig into almost every study you will find it is funded by an agenda. That does not mean the study is wrong it just means the study was developed to achieve X result and that is what it did. If you watch arguments on this site for every study that supports one side someone will bring up a study that supports the other. There is very little true research done anymore. research for a specific result is much more lucrative than true research where you don't know where it will lead and there are very few groups that will fund such research. I am not saying there are not positive properties to weed or other drugs. What I am saying is it is a party balloon. If you blow up a long balloon and then squeeze it in the middle you get this nice pretty bulge that you want on the top of your hand. But then you have to consider the ugly bulge that is hanging below your hand. All I am saying is take a good unbiased look at both sides (hard to do) and make the best decision you can. Often times if you look not at how that ugly bulge affects you but how it affects those around you the decision is pretty clear.

  18. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    There are tons of countries where weed is fully legal. They arent falling to pieces. Also what about people with chronic pain or terminal illness? You can choose not to partake, since you arent "miserable", but why does that mean nobody else can either? This is 2020, not 1960. The studies have been published for years and years on positive effects of marijuana. There is no excuse for ignorance anymore.
    Hardly...

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...eed-is-illegal

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  20. #55
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    On a bit of a tangent, do you know where that term came from? It has to do with taxes. For example, let's say you have a business lunch, you're gonna save the receipt with notes on who it was with and the topics discussed. The lunch is something you can write off, correct?

    Well, sort of. If you each have five drinks, you can only write off three of them. Hence the term, Three Martini Lunch.


    Quote Originally Posted by hvacker View Post
    I remember a study (no link) way back that said a person who's under the influence of alcohol (not sure how much) can lift more weight but an archer will miss more targets. That's fairly easy to understand.
    Most employers don't want the problems with substance abuse. Zero tolerance. Can't blame them because insurance insists for coverage they demand a drug free work place and a drug free employee. Including their private time. Next hurdle is legalization of not just pot but mushrooms might very follow. Both these substances have demonstrated to be safer than alcohol or tobacco. People have been drunk or affected by alcohol on the job forever but because it was socially acceptable to drink little was said. The three martini lunch it was called. I have no idea where this is going or what can be done about it.
    Little is being said about prescription drugs that can have similar or the same effects as street drugs but will be excused and allowed. There are way too many to list. It's easier to just list the effects.
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  21. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by BNME8EZ View Post
    I was thinking that earlier.

    How miserable do you have to be to need to get high, stoned, drunk. buzzed, or what ever other term you want to apply, just to cope. If you say it is not coping but just for enjoyment then why does it need to be from Friday night to Sunday afternoon? I see life as it is amazing and don't see a reason to have to be in an altered state to enjoy it.

    Life has it's ups and downs. If you don't face the defeats you can't enjoy the wins. It is through the depths of the valley that we gain understanding of the view from the heights. It is from enduring the darkness that you can appreciate the light. If you artificially cut off the bottom you never gain the strength to make it to the top.
    Well said.

    Youngfrosty,
    Do what you want. But, I think your getting hung up on this for no reason.

    I imagine there are plenty of guys that do this work who do drugs. However I dont think any of them are better for it. And I am confident not one of them are the best of the trade. They may perform okay in spite of it.

    I know plenty of people that get high, and some I knew before they got involved with it. None of them are better because of it. All of them are average at best. Some have lost all real drive and simply coast through existence.

    If your hell bent on getting high, forgo it until you hire on somewhere, then proceed at your own risk. Only union shops and large non union shops will regularly see random drug tests.

    So that will limit your options for employment.

    I also dont care for those who drink to excess after hours. They are mediocre also. Im not talking about a beer or 2 with dinner or whatever, im talking about getting fall over drunk. Then showing up to work then next morning 1/2 in the bag.

    Weed is in no way going to improve your performance at anything, or unlock some hidden potential thought in an abstract corner of your brain. Maybe thats true of some psychedelic drugs, but thats arguable to.

    It may make your feel better somehow, so do what you want. But your only fooling yourself, and bolstering similar minds.

    But the secret to happiness and contentment is having purpose in life. Personal purpose, and purpose to something bigger - typically community, or society. Has to be both. Not just one or the other. Too much of one, and the other suffers.

    Remember what I said about having a hard look at yourself and what contributed to your being fired?

    This may be a bit harsh, but some things are becoming a bit more clear as to what may have gone wrong for you.


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  22. #57
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    I'm for the legalization of all drugs, do with your life as you wish, what you smoke or drink is none of my business in the other hand employers have the right to discriminate against drug users.
    There are trades where using drugs is almost a requirement, roofers and painters for example, anyone that has worked construction knows, not uncommon to see roofers sharing a blunt first thing in the morning and they go up there and get the job done baked out their minds, how they do it without falling is beyond comprehension.
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    There are tons of countries where weed is fully legal. They arent falling to pieces. Also what about people with chronic pain or terminal illness? You can choose not to partake, since you arent "miserable", but why does that mean nobody else can either? This is 2020, not 1960. The studies have been published for years and years on positive effects of marijuana. There is no excuse for ignorance anymore.
    go to Seattle, tons of homeless living on the sides of the interstates, high crime, ladies of the evening.....yes, legalizing drugs really has an improved effect on the living lifestyles..lol..drugs are fine but you cannot have any alcohol in the clubs..

    there is no way in hell i would live there, i saw too much as it is on the very expensive month just on hotels and food i spent there for work fixing complete screwups...

  24. #59
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    That's not a problem any more. In any state. First let me say, I don't want to be on a site or a job with a stoner. To many things go wrong, and I don't want my name attached to those mistakes and/or problems. That being said, I was one of the biggest stoners you would have ever seen back in the 70's. Started this trade in something like 1982, smoked a little, but nothing like before I went to trade school. Then I began smoking less and less.

    I wasn't trying to quit, it's just that the job was requiring more and more brain power and memory. Then as I began smoking less and less, I realized it took a whole week to get completely sober again. So, what really happened is, I just out grew the dope. Career and other goals in life became more important. After five years in the trade, there just wasn't any more room for the dope in my life.

    Now, back to your absurd discriminatory comment. THC has no medical benefit. But the oils in the dope plant do. Those oils have some rather miraculous results, potentially anecdotal, but regardless, if they take away pain and make other things in life more tolerable, more power to those people.

    That's why your comment is so absurd. If you are a doper because you think you are receiving health or medical benefits from smoking a plant, just buy the CBD oil. No THC in the oil, it's been extracted. So you can pee clean and still receive the health benefits from the dope plant.

    Not to mention your lungs will thank you!!


    Quote Originally Posted by YOUNG FROSTY View Post
    Yes of course, medical card. And it works wonders. The problem is, these people can't get jobs because they pee dirty even though this is discriminatory based on health/medical conditions. This is an issue in many states currently.
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  25. #60
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    Guys I don't even smoke weed I'm just not in support of making a harmless drug illegal and taboo. We can go in circles all day about how it affects your productivity but I will still firmly maintain that there are many people out there using substances and you'd be none the wiser. The only failures, screw ups, etc you're aware of come from confirmation bias. I had some top level managers before and later down the road I found out they were huge stoners. I would have never guessed, and found it quite impressive they were able to run a tight ship like that.

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