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Thread: Tenant Billing Options N4

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    Tenant Billing Options N4

    Have a possible job coming up that the customer is interested in tenant billing options. I watched a little youtube video on Tenanteye last night. Can't say either way because I don't have any really experience with any tenant billing. Something that plays with Niagara would be preferred. Any feedback would be appreciated.

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    I did Niagara Tenant billing. It is functional, and flexible. I set it up so the landlord can control when they provide free cooling as part of the terms of the lease, when the areas get billed for use, and varying rates for use as set by the landlord.
    I liked it as with anything Niagara there is a day or 2 of - 'what is going on!?!?' Then you get it and it comes together.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by numbawunfela View Post
    I did Niagara Tenant billing. It is functional, and flexible. I set it up so the landlord can control when they provide free cooling as part of the terms of the lease, when the areas get billed for use, and varying rates for use as set by the landlord.
    I liked it as with anything Niagara there is a day or 2 of - 'what is going on!?!?' Then you get it and it comes together.
    Ok is this an added niagara service? Something you have to license per tenant count or something? How was usage figured in your application? Meters? Occupancy overrides? Trying to get my mind wrapped around deploying this at the site were looking at. This site has over a 1000 field controllers and use to be one owner. Now its being sold, and having multiple tenant across 6 building on one large campus.

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    It is an added Service. you pay for it through your support channel.
    There are a variety of meter options - I am using a timed meter... so not a pulsed electrical meter, instead a trend pings every 15 minutes, and the overall usage is billed based on the time that the BV representing usage by that tenant stays high, in 15 min increments (like the trend period). So I can do electrical meters, and gas and such - but on this one I am using a timed meter. using nav files, you can direct each tenant to a splash page when they log in that they get to see their own scheduling page only to turn their stuff on and off.
    yes license per tenant count.
    It can be set to automatically email invoices to all the tenants every month - or auto dump them in a file folder for sorting by the landlord, or manual generation.
    invoices are Px pages that are editable in niagara. they use some funky linking in the invoice Pxs that was hard for me to sort out at first.
    Just like everything niagara, there is a help document that says 'Timed meters are for usage based on time' - thanks for that - sooooo helpful... So you should expect to beat your head against a wall a little.
    I have not done another tenant billing thing, so I cannot compare it to anything else, but I liked it. It was on a site with 3.8.401 - and Px graphics. So i cannot tell you that it will play nice with an N4 site's DGLux Graphics for example. it has some Landlord views to allow them to modify tenant names and contracts and such themselves - handy as I do not like to hafta do all of that.
    I grouped tnants by schedules - so one schedule ran that tenants 12 VAVs - the AHU looked at any area to be live looking for cooling and kicked on as a result. So this site is a plain old AHU and VAV building divided into maybe 20-23 tenants.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by numbawunfela View Post
    It is an added Service. you pay for it through your support channel.
    There are a variety of meter options - I am using a timed meter... so not a pulsed electrical meter, instead a trend pings every 15 minutes, and the overall usage is billed based on the time that the BV representing usage by that tenant stays high, in 15 min increments (like the trend period). So I can do electrical meters, and gas and such - but on this one I am using a timed meter. using nav files, you can direct each tenant to a splash page when they log in that they get to see their own scheduling page only to turn their stuff on and off.
    yes license per tenant count.
    It can be set to automatically email invoices to all the tenants every month - or auto dump them in a file folder for sorting by the landlord, or manual generation.
    invoices are Px pages that are editable in niagara. they use some funky linking in the invoice Pxs that was hard for me to sort out at first.
    Just like everything niagara, there is a help document that says 'Timed meters are for usage based on time' - thanks for that - sooooo helpful... So you should expect to beat your head against a wall a little.
    I have not done another tenant billing thing, so I cannot compare it to anything else, but I liked it. It was on a site with 3.8.401 - and Px graphics. So i cannot tell you that it will play nice with an N4 site's DGLux Graphics for example. it has some Landlord views to allow them to modify tenant names and contracts and such themselves - handy as I do not like to hafta do all of that.
    I grouped tnants by schedules - so one schedule ran that tenants 12 VAVs - the AHU looked at any area to be live looking for cooling and kicked on as a result. So this site is a plain old AHU and VAV building divided into maybe 20-23 tenants.
    Great! Thanks for all the info exactly what I was looking for. I'm kind of hoping we don't get the job! LOL just kidding kind of. 11 NCM's a couple of NCU's 7 MIG integrators. The only upside is its close to the house. I can put up with a lot of pooh, for a shorter drive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Norriski Tech View Post
    Have a possible job coming up that the customer is interested in tenant billing options. I watched a little youtube video on Tenanteye last night. Can't say either way because I don't have any really experience with any tenant billing. Something that plays with Niagara would be preferred. Any feedback would be appreciated.
    I've worked with both the CSI3 TenantEye for AX and OneSightSolutions Tenant Billing.

    CSI3 TenantEye - No N4, Sold/Acquired by Kodaro - I couldn't get any support from them - Non-Responsive

    OneSightSolutions Tenant Billing - Not their product, rebranded "Semsys" Product, barely functional on N4.7, have a bunch of unresolved problems, slow support with "OSS" being apparently the middleman as they aren't the developer of which I'm kinda pissed about. Had I known that, I wouldn't of bought their product. It's been months now and still can't get even some basic/simple functions working properly.

    Have a client that had to migrate from CSI3 TenantEye on an AX Jace to a N4.7 Supervisor. Biggest problem I had with the CSI3 product was that when a trend/history collection was captured as an invalid or erroneous value, there was no native way within the software to make a correction. You had to export into csv, recreate the pdf and manually change the values in excel or whatever. A royal and unnecessary pain in the ...

    Found the OSS Tenant Billing option and specifically chose that product because it allowed us to use standard history collections/extensions in N4 that were editable. If I had a tenant bill that was wrong due to a bad value, I could edit the history collection in workbench, save and then regenerate the bill in the OSS Tbs program. Easy for the most part. However, I have a laundry list of problems right now that these guys have been working on for months and I'm not really getting anywhere and its beyond aggravating.

  7. #7
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    I forgot to mention that Niagara tenant billing will let you edit the history trends to correct erroneous data.
    For what that is worth.
    Last edited by numbawunfela; 10-01-2020 at 04:21 PM.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

  8. #8
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    Wish I knew that. I presume your talking about the Vykon Tenant Billing Option?

    One of the other requests they had was that the replacement Tenant Billing also provided a daily running total details page like the CSI3 product did. But from what I can tell, not very many Tenant Billing options include that function. Seems like that would be a standard function. If I can't get anywhere with these guys, I'm going to look at trying to get a refund as the product is not usable/defective at this point. How much time, is a reasonable amount of time for a solution to be fixed? My client won't transition over fully until at least, some of the fundamental functions are working properly.

    BTW - The cost for the OSS Tenant Billing (Semsys) is based on Meter Count. Not tenants, users, buildings, etc. Just how many meter history trends are to be utilized.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by ems4ty View Post
    I presume your talking about the Vykon Tenant Billing Option?
    Yup
    I never needed to go to tech support on the product. It just took the usual head against wall approach. So I cannot say the tech support was any good, I just do not know.
    One thing that I would reccomend if someone wants to put this in is that you want to get your meters [in whatever form that may be] and trending on those meters in place asap. Then you have trend data to run your billing against to see how the whole thing works and bills look and so on.
    If you walk into it thinking 'my station is done, now time to start tenant billing' you will lrogram stuff like it seems it should run, then walk away for A MONTH to collect the proper trend data, then come back and wrap up the billing formats and such. Without the trend data there, there is a lot of stuff that will not populate out. And I am tye sort that likes to run it to be sure I know precisely what the customer is getting and that it works.
    So put your meters and trends in place early, build put the station, and when you are wrapping up the graphics, hopefully you have a bunch of trend data already available to test out the tenant billing with.
    Hmmmm....smells like numbatwo to me.

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