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  1. #1
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    Carrier CCN/BACnet questions

    Hello all,

    I've been looking for answers for a project I'm working on, and Google has pointed me here enough that it's time to ask in person. My background with building controls has mainly been on the mechanical/electrical/instrument side, but now I'm into systems integration, and pretty green on the BACnet.

    A customer has 4 Carrier chillers, each with its own CCN --> BACnet translator (MS/TP). They would like to read and/or write 12 CCN tags to each chiller for control and monitoring through the translator to a new PLC. This gets done through another gateway (Red Lion, RTA, still deciding which to use) that converts BACnet to PLC code.

    I have a Carrier Network Points List that looks like a preprogrammed map of CCN to BACnet, with AV: and BV: IDs and corresponding Object tag names - a generic table it seems, which solves a lot of problems. My question is how are the individual CCN units addressed, or do they need to be? Or does the important addressing get done on the BACnet side of the translator? Basically, if the PLC gateway requests/sends info, it must talk to a BACnet unique address I assume. But does the individual object info that gets passed via the BACnet to/from the CCN also require unique addressing? In the Network Points List, the CCN POINT NAME is singular, but every corresponding BACnet OBJECT NAME ends in _1 (ALM --> alm_1, ALERT --> alert_1). Would chiller 4 require all BACnet tags to be unique _4s?

    The reason I am asking is that these are existing standalone chillers, and I am assuming they have factory default info - 'all look the same' _1 BACnet suffixes, so I'm not sure if that needs to get changed at the CCN level, or if I just need unique BACnet network addressing. Bacially let the same BACnet _1 OBJECT NAME be moved from all four chillers, but let the unique translator address allow the tags to be sorted. Or maybe I'm out to lunch on how I think this works....

  2. #2
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    Are they currently talking to something on MS/TP? Are the rotary addresses all the same?

  3. #3
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    Thread Starter
    I have not been able to get to site due to Covid-19 situation. But it is my understanding that they are not talking to anything external. I won't know about the rotary switches until I get to site, but I assume I can configure them anyway I want with them to get them to work.

  4. #4
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    They will each need a unique MAC (rotary switch) and device instance. After that you should be good to put it under some router to get it to the gateway.

  5. #5
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    Thread Starter
    The MAC addressing must be on the CCN somewhere? I only have the translator manual, and all addressing seems to be done through Network Service Tool or ComfortVIEW...

  6. #6
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    No, address on the secondary side (MS/TP) of the BACnet gateways needs to be unique. The CCN side can stay the same. That's assuming they are working in the first place.

  7. #7
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    Thread Starter
    I don't see any rotary switches on the translator (33CNTRAN485-01-R). Are they on the lower PCB?

  8. #8
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    I thought you had a portal, small plastic box and looks like a ALC eqportal. You'll need someone that knows more about carrier stuff.

    Also there's HVACRControl that has a CCN gateway that could replace that with something you might work with.

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  10. #9
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    The Bacnet addressing must be setup by accessing the Config tables which reside on the CCN side of the device.
    To achieve this you must use a proprietary tool such as NSTV or ComfortView, to modify the necessary tables.

    Another alternative is to use a device such as what Lin manufacturers, it works well and overcomes a lot of limitations the Carrier product has.

    http://www.hvacrcontrol.com/language/en/

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  12. #10
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    are you using the old translator or the UPC?
    I can send you the documents on whichever it is.

  13. #11
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    I was assuming the old translator, but I just received my requested info and it inclues the UPC, but that's for the 2 new chillers, as two are running. I'm basically trying to piece together what I've got to work with from emails, which isn't optimal, but it is all I've got for the time being. That non Carrier gateway looks interesting....

    Are the new UPC similar to the old translator in 60 tags over two tables for process data?

  14. #12
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    with the UPC its more then 60. the bacnet is addressed by the rotary switch. carriers are default 16101+ rotary or mac address The ref_name_1 or _2 or _3 is in relation to the program number on the controller. In this case there is just one program.

    If you want to send a point for control the microblock does need to be made to do so.

    In the setpoint pic thats our software showing the properties.
    The bacnet pic is of a upc showing how the bacnet is set up ( thats a rtu in the pic though)

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  16. #13
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    ccn address on the chillers comes as buss 0 element 1. as long as you're not connecting the ccn comms together you wont need to change addresses on the ccn side.

    You will need to change the rotary dials on the upc though.

    If you need points editable you may need someone to come in to check those settings for you. In the pic you can see set point editable is not checked editable by default.

    If you have something other then the UPC I have never used one. ( pre me in controls ) But I can send you the documentation on them.

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