Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 14 to 26 of 37
  1. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Oklahoma home its in the name
    Posts
    1,284
    Post Likes
    That's funny I like it.
    That isn't quite how it works. That explanation of the different size molecules leaking at different rates that is so commonly quoted is a poor one.

    In a high glide refrigerant the vapor in a standing system will have different percentages of the components than the liquid has and if that vapor escapes you will be losing more of some components than others. It has to do with vapor pressures.
    410a according to the manufacturer can be charged as a vapor but it is considered poor practice and some manufacturers forbid it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Snapperhead View Post
    I never fell for that BS

    I seriously doubt the gasses separate going out a crack . I dunno I guess I don't picture one gas holding the door open for the other gas watching it escape
    Sent from mars using Tapatalk

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2,392
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by R600a
    My market is poorly managed rentals and usually they just want to keep topping it up until it gets really bad.
    ..and cheap azzed homeowners. Glad to know someone here has my kind of market.

  3. Likes R600a liked this post.
  4. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Kansas Flatlands
    Posts
    438
    Post Likes
    VTP99 points out the glide is too close to worry about leaking at different rates. As we were all told in the beginning.
    We as a company have the client sign a waiver/ release before we just top off any unit. If it don't last they know there is no warranty. This has completely eliminated the "You were just out"

  5. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Kansas Flatlands
    Posts
    438
    Post Likes
    Buy the way, Who the hell charges a system that is flat?

  6. Likes R600a, lions_lair liked this post.
  7. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2,392
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by theoldscroll View Post
    Buy the way, Who the hell charges a system that is flat?
    Not likely anybody we know...but it happens. I overheard a tech telling a counter guy he'd filled up a system the day before at a cost of something like $XXXX...all the while telling the HO it was a bad idea. The HO had $ to burn and wanted it done.
    Last edited by beenthere; 01-21-2020 at 05:31 AM.

  8. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    Portland Oregon
    Posts
    90
    Post Likes
    Thread Starter
    Man... The only thing Im putting in a flat system is Nitrogen, and thats if it is a 410a system. R22 more than 6lb & Im preparing good, better, best unit replacement quotes.

  9. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    78,530
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by EnergyOasis View Post
    Is there a point at which 410a leaking as a vapor can separate (fractionate) into a blend that doesnt have the properties of 410a anymore? If I recall 410a is a 3 component refrigerant blend. Ive never seen this, but knowing it is my decision for only topping off systems that have lost up to 20% of their charge.
    Before R410A was introduced. Honeywell and or Carrier did a top off test. They simulated a leak on the vapor side. And leaked out 50% of the systems charge. Then topped it off and tested the system. They repeated the test 50 times. No noticeable difference in operation after 50 times.

    There were many discussions on this site about R410A's glide in the past.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  10. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Oklahoma home its in the name
    Posts
    1,284
    Post Likes
    I just got to thinking and I don't think it has been mentioned. A 30 evaporator alone doesn't indicate low charge. You have to know at least superheat to eaven start diagnosis.
    Quote Originally Posted by EnergyOasis View Post
    I would like a little advice on what is best practices for coming upon a system that is moderately low (30degree evaporator) on 410a. My practices thus far for systems missing up to 20% of their charge is to soap Schraders/service valves, txv, inspect condenser coil & evaporator for signs of oil, and if nothing is apparent to let the customer know what a full leak test will cost & let them know that I can top off charge just one time. I try and prepare customer for the eventuality of having a full leak check performed & that topping off the charge is just a temporary solution.

    I am a 3rd year apprentice in Oregon state program and also have a 2yr degree from Walla Walla community college. Every day I learn something new & I want to do the right thing always. Appreciate the shared wisdom
    Sent from mars using Tapatalk

  11. #22
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    FLORIDA
    Posts
    303
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by EnergyOasis View Post
    Is there a point at which 410a leaking as a vapor can separate (fractionate) into a blend that doesn’t have the properties of 410a anymore? If I recall 410a is a 3 component refrigerant blend. I’ve never seen this, but knowing it is my decision for only topping off systems that have lost up to 20% of their charge.
    Not correct, R410A is a blend of 2 refrigerants, R32 and R125, i believe 50-50 %, R 32 is inflammable so they added R125 to keep the inflammable level very low, but, when you have a leak, you don't know which of the two went out the most, and you should recovery the refrigerant, fix the leak, and charge back the system with new refrigerant.
    Visit our website at www.airconcomfortcooling.com

  12. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    2,936
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by AIRCON8 View Post
    Not correct, R410A is a blend of 2 refrigerants, R32 and R125 i believe 50-50 % that's why when you have a leak you don't know which of the two went out the most, and you should recovery the refrigerant, fix the leak, and charge back the system with new refrigerant.
    Not correct, read post #20.

  13. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    US of A
    Posts
    5,696
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by AIRCON8 View Post
    Not correct, R410A is a blend of 2 refrigerants, R32 and R125, i believe 50-50 %, R 32 is inflammable so they added R125 to keep the inflammable level very low, but, when you have a leak, you don't know which of the two went out the most, and you should recovery the refrigerant, fix the leak, and charge back the system with new refrigerant.

    This thread isn't that long and there were several posts that cleared this up already. Surprised you did not see them.

    Newer-younger techs take notice of this and get used to reading if you want to learn and don't jump to conclusions.
    Signature removed Violated rule #15

  14. #25
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Bay Area California
    Posts
    26,596
    Post Likes
    410A is a near azeotropic blend. Fractionization (sp) has not been noticed.

    Do you know what a zeotropic blend is? Like R-502? Ever play with that stuff?


    Quote Originally Posted by AIRCON8 View Post
    Not correct, R410A is a blend of 2 refrigerants, R32 and R125, i believe 50-50 %, R 32 is inflammable so they added R125 to keep the inflammable level very low, but, when you have a leak, you don't know which of the two went out the most, and you should recovery the refrigerant, fix the leak, and charge back the system with new refrigerant.
    I do a triple evac with nitro to remove non condensables.

  15. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    19,281
    Post Likes
    [QUOTE=BBeerme;25837527]
    Like R-502? Ever play with that stuff?


    I have, in fact I still service some freezers and ice machines running the good stuff !

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Contracting Business
HPAC Engineering
EC&M
CONTRACTOR