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  1. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalman0880 View Post
    If I had a transcriber I’d put the whole conversation on here. But I don’t currently my son sitting in one arm and answering you in the other. I don’t pat myself on the back nor pretend to have all the answers. Anyone who works for us will tell you that I’ll get out there and grind alongside them. I run calls everyday. Work 12 hr days. That’s my choice. My crew is happy. They get treated beyond well and in turn give their all day after day. FYI he asked for $29/hr and I offered him $23.50/hr. That’s a generous and fair offer with the potential to go up another $5.50/hr in 30 days plus back pay. He and I talked and then I let him talk to a couple techs while he was there. No smoke and mirrors. Just problems that need to be fixed, people to fix them.
    I asked where he was currently and he didn’t want to say and out of respect I wasn’t pushing it. Asked why he wanted to leave and he said management and wanted to pick up commercial. I told him that was great and we would love to have him on our team. The problem remains that there is a learning curve. He had never even worked on a rtu. That’s fine we will train you and help you get up to speed. Send him to training, classes, ect. No big deal. But one has to realize you don’t walk in with very little knowledge and get top dollar. I’ll be more than happy to help you to that point but that requires work on your end. You agree?


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    I agree!

  2. #41
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    I Agree 200% i have had this happen to me and i say pay is based on experience and skills

  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalman0880 View Post
    If I had a transcriber Iíd put the whole conversation on here. But I donít currently my son sitting in one arm and answering you in the other. I donít pat myself on the back nor pretend to have all the answers. Anyone who works for us will tell you that Iíll get out there and grind alongside them. I run calls everyday. Work 12 hr days. Thatís my choice. My crew is happy. They get treated beyond well and in turn give their all day after day. FYI he asked for $29/hr and I offered him $23.50/hr. Thatís a generous and fair offer with the potential to go up another $5.50/hr in 30 days plus back pay. He and I talked and then I let him talk to a couple techs while he was there. No smoke and mirrors. Just problems that need to be fixed, people to fix them.
    I asked where he was currently and he didnít want to say and out of respect I wasnít pushing it. Asked why he wanted to leave and he said management and wanted to pick up commercial. I told him that was great and we would love to have him on our team. The problem remains that there is a learning curve. He had never even worked on a rtu. Thatís fine we will train you and help you get up to speed. Send him to training, classes, ect. No big deal. But one has to realize you donít walk in with very little knowledge and get top dollar. Iíll be more than happy to help you to that point but that requires work on your end. You agree?


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    The general feeling of this post is far different than the first post describing the same situation. If this was the first post I wouldn't have posted anything about it. That being said I agree in general. But where we are now I would say that it is just as hard to find a good employer as it is to find a good employee.

    If 29/hr is "top dollar" I would say he made the right choice. As it is you offered him a slightly lower than average job for 2018 let alone 2019.
    "Workers in the Buffalo-Cheektowaga-Niagara Falls Metropolitan Statistical Area had an average (mean) hourly wage of $23.76 in May 2018, about 5 percent below the nationwide average of $24.98, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics." And with the min wage set to go up to 15/hr in just over a year it will soon be a much less than average salary for the area. Of course salary alone is a partial story with vacation, health benefits and retirement etc being the remainder of the story.
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  4. #43
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    Aug 2015
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    Well right now it $15/hr isint the minimum. And last time I checked, they struggle at best to do their job remotely correct. So an extra $8.50/hr for having some tools and at the moment their ďpromise of knowledgeĒ isint a bad offer at all not the mention the opportunity for even more. 4.5 years is minimal experience. And to have zero experience in commercial, but an employer thatís willing to help show/teach/train you? The WNY area is polluted with HVAC contractors. Some good and more just looking to make a quick buck. Even less are fair and qualified to do the work required correctly. We can agree on this all day and thatís ok. Iím not looking to rain on your parade, or turn this into an issue.

    This area (assuming your not from around here) the economy is starting to pick up. Things are starting to change. But they are a long ways away. Probably like many other areas.

    The main topic of this thread may have changed and my original intent was to show the OP that in my opinion he was way under compensated and under appreciated for the work and time he was doing. As far as salary and benefits. If he is looking for a commission thatís something I canít speak to. My opinion is I donít agree with it in this trade. Forces bad work practices and frankly takes advantage of customers. Thatís MY opinion.

    Would you hire someone for top dollar that had never done the job description that you hired them for? Thats setting you and the them up for failure.


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  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalman0880 View Post
    Well right now it $15/hr isint the minimum. And last time I checked, they struggle at best to do their job remotely correct. So an extra $8.50/hr for having some tools and at the moment their ďpromise of knowledgeĒ isint a bad offer at all not the mention the opportunity for even more. 4.5 years is minimal experience. And to have zero experience in commercial, but an employer thatís willing to help show/teach/train you? The WNY area is polluted with HVAC contractors. Some good and more just looking to make a quick buck. Even less are fair and qualified to do the work required correctly. We can agree on this all day and thatís ok. Iím not looking to rain on your parade, or turn this into an issue.

    This area (assuming your not from around here) the economy is starting to pick up. Things are starting to change. But they are a long ways away. Probably like many other areas.

    The main topic of this thread may have changed and my original intent was to show the OP that in my opinion he was way under compensated and under appreciated for the work and time he was doing. As far as salary and benefits. If he is looking for a commission thatís something I canít speak to. My opinion is I donít agree with it in this trade. Forces bad work practices and frankly takes advantage of customers. Thatís MY opinion.

    Would you hire someone for top dollar that had never done the job description that you hired them for? Thats setting you and the them up for failure.


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    It will be the min in just over a year. As I said it is a slightly less than average job for the area now and will be far less than that in a year. I admit I was surprised that he hadn't even worked on an RTU as you said in your second post. The best part of your offer imo was the promise of training. If he wanted to make the jump to commercial you may have been a good stepping stone. If 29/hr is considered "top dollar" it couldn't be much more than than a stepping stone to better things.

    I think the real topic of the thread was a worker being fairly compensated. The OP imo was just slightly inartful in his presentation of what he was getting at and we are right on topic. I don't think incentives work too well in commercial outside of getting new maintenance agreements probably. I believe as some others do here that wages in our trade should be better than what they are and without incentives in residential they would be even worse than they are by a large margin. The tech's get the bad rep on incentives when it should be the owners. I believe in 99% of the cases the employees are doing what they are trained to do and what is expected of them when it comes to incentives. An employer could easily spot an offender if they wanted to.
    I believe for the good of the industry wages should be raised and incentives tuned down a bit. Our industry doesn't get the respect it deserves compared to an electrician or even a plumber when we do much more than the two of them put together.

    I would easily hire a person with 4 1/2 years experience to a slightly less than average wage if I felt they were the right person in the long run. I didn't meet him but I can tell he values himself when too many people do not it seems. I feel if a person values himself they are on the right step in realizing what it takes for a tech to become a valuable member of a company. Too many people in this trade don't seem to realize what that takes. As I said previously the chances are he would be better than many of your commercial techs on residential and would make everybody more efficient. If he has the capability of being proficient at both he would be a rare bird and even more valuable.
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  6. #45
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    It absolutely is 100% the culture of the employer that dictates how a comission system will be or will not be abused. It's a simple choice however it is indeed one that is not disclosed to the techs in the beginning or the customer ever.

    The title of technician doesn't mean technical abilities regarding equipment anymore. Now it is defined better in two quite different disciplines. SERVICE TECHNICIANS and SALES TECHNICIANS with many companies shooting to find that middle ground, however, a lot are pushing for the sales techs as they have converted from a service company to an equipment sales company almost exclusively.

  7. #46
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    This is a big topic at Honeywell HBS. A possible scenario, a guy from one of the local non-union OEM Branches comes to HBS. Letís say that A MM $ follows him, not thru soliciting, but from the clientís confidence in the Tech. What would be fair for the Tech, if the $1MM becomes contractual?
    In the current structure, the Service Sales person would get all of the commission. How would that be fair? The Sales person would be eating - because the Tech would have fed him.


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  8. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by pctech View Post
    I Agree 200% i have had this happen to me and i say pay is based on experience and skills

    Educating homeowners and getting people to renew and upgrade is also a skill. Any tech that can't be both this and technically proficient are still one dimensional.
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  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechmanTerry View Post
    "EVERYONE of my customers are here because of MY abilities and my relationship between the customer and myself."
    Have you ever thought of making posters of this quote of yours? I think you ought to do so and put them up all over the shop and office. Most companies seem to believe in synergy. I bet you could corner the market on dysergy posters and make a killing.
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  10. #49
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    Mar 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by pageyjim View Post
    Have you ever thought of making posters of this quote of yours? I think you ought to do so and put them up all over the shop and office. Most companies seem to believe in synergy. I bet you could corner the market on dysergy posters and make a killing.
    Now,keep in mind that I am a very small Co. I went into my own Business based on my Quality of Work. I did not advertise or have writing/ads painted on my truck or even uniforms. It was just me ,my toolbox and a set of gauges and a bunch of HVACR BOOKS. I do not have to get along w/ everybody/customers that I have worked for, as compared to "they"have to get along w/ me based on one thing. And that is that their HVACR Equipment is running well,very well,very very well. So,to have a "silent partner" because of he/she finding a dead comp or finding a bad furnace gives me pause to think.

  11. #50
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    Dec 2012
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    Sales commission

    I think alot of companies use commision as a way to pay better when the getting is good and then are able to back off when sales are not good.

    Reason being is any resi company with a large maintenance agreement customer base will be working with little revenue in the off season. All the maintenance calls have been bought in advance. Noone wants to pay a tech 35 an hour with little to no incoming revenue. So they have a lower base pay and then when sales pick up so does compensation. Makes sense to me.

    On one hand a commission based pay scale can promote selling unneeded parts and accessories. On the other hand hourly pay can also be manipulated by a tech to better suit themselves.

    In one example a tech could recommend a repair when a replacement may be a better option if he feels he needs the hours. If they feel they are over worked they could not recommend solutions that may benefit a customer and the company when they want to go home.

    One would be much less likely to sell a job that would be an inconvenience to themselves if he gets a piece of the pie.

    In any case a tech is capable of putting themself first over customer or company. Integrity on the front line is needed with any pay scale.


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  12. #51
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    Dec 2019
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    As a tech person, the first focused work is the customer experience, the work to maintain and improve our companies reputation. But at the same time, you still can educate the homeowners, let them know the useful tips to maintain the machine, leave phone numbers, yes it can not work every time, but in long run your work will be rewarded. Another skill is, talk with your boss, if your work is really great

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