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  1. #79
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    I am not shure what you mean by rates.
    Quote Originally Posted by timebuilder View Post
    Not for these rates you wouldn't.
    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk

  2. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    I am not shure what you mean by rates.

    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk
    A rate is what a contractor is allowed to charge in the world of third party service. This is substantially less than what you would be able to charge a direct bill customer. This is the USP of the third party broker...telling the corporate client that "we can get you the same quality of service for for (insert percentage value) of the typical cost."

    Of course, getting the same service for less money is an economic impossibility, because time is money, and experience adds to cost.

    This is why I am estimating that this year, I will go from two months of following up on other companies to three months. Of course, you could say that anytime we get a new client or site, we are following up on someone else, but there is a small percentage where the service was good, but the broker merely lost the contract, and when that happens, the company follows like the caboose of a train being diverted to another track.

    Basically, the broker and the client are not paying for tinning wires. If we included that in the quote, the job would be denied instead of approved, and someone else would be feeding those strands into the tiny holes of the wiring modules.

    HTH.
    [Avatar photo from a Florida training accident. Everyone walked away.]
    2 Tim 3:16-17

    RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
    Member, IAEI

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  3. #81
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    Jul 2019
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    Wow i am lost. I am glad we deal direct with our customers. I would put that as thermostat instalation. We are alotted 1 hour in our normal charge and can raise that if need be. It only takes 10 minutes which is mostly for warm-up time.
    Quote Originally Posted by timebuilder View Post
    A rate is what a contractor is allowed to charge in the world of third party service. This is substantially less than what you would be able to charge a direct bill customer. This is the USP of the third party broker...telling the corporate client that "we can get you the same quality of service for for (insert percentage value) of the typical cost."

    Of course, getting the same service for less money is an economic impossibility, because time is money, and experience adds to cost.

    This is why I am estimating that this year, I will go from two months of following up on other companies to three months. Of course, you could say that anytime we get a new client or site, we are following up on someone else, but there is a small percentage where the service was good, but the broker merely lost the contract, and when that happens, the company follows like the caboose of a train being diverted to another track.

    Basically, the broker and the client are not paying for tinning wires. If we included that in the quote, the job would be denied instead of approved, and someone else would be feeding those strands into the tiny holes of the wiring modules.

    HTH.
    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk

  4. #82
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
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    Sadly...
    These 'brokers' are selling something their customers really do not want...
    However the greed of the customers is not letting common sense prevail.

    We have a policy:
    We ONLY work for the owner of the property who signs the check (both must be there, or we do not do the job).
    Yes, we have a couple of long term property management co's that have always done us right... however if they screw up... they are GONE!

    Quality sells... one just has to accept it is harder and slower to build ones clientele...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  5. Likes R600a liked this post
  6. #83
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    Last place I worked started doing some of that third party work. The third party would only pay us eighty five bucks an hour. Which in the Bay Area, and Silicone Valley in particular, is pennies on the dollar. We charged everyone else well over a hundred bucks an hour. It was the beginning of the end for that company.
    If you were a real tech, you'd solder a relay on that board and call it good to go.

    I do a triple evac with nitro to remove non condensables.

    I use 56% silver on everything except steel.

    Did you really need the " If you were a real tech " ??

  7. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    Wow i am lost. I am glad we deal direct with our customers. I would put that as thermostat instalation. We are alotted 1 hour in our normal charge and can raise that if need be. It only takes 10 minutes which is mostly for warm-up time.

    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk
    Every procedure is enumerated and approved before it happens.

    Tinning wires is not a normal procedure during a thermostat installation. It is extra, and if the client does not want to pay for that step they are not going to receive that step...it is as clear and simple as that.

    Imagine for a moment that I have enough money in my pocket to go and buy a Kia, but what I really want to do is to buy a Cadillac STS.

    Now, I can walk into the Cadillac dealership in Philadelphia...a guy that I know... and I can say, "Frank, I'd like to buy a Cadillac STS....but I only have Kia money in my pocket." You know what Frank's going to do? He's going to start to chuckle....he's going to slap me on the shoulder and he's going to say, "Art...you know better than that!"
    [Avatar photo from a Florida training accident. Everyone walked away.]
    2 Tim 3:16-17

    RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
    Member, IAEI

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  8. #85
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    Oklahoma home its in the name
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    That is interesting. We are much more vague than that on our invoices. I like your analogy.
    Quote Originally Posted by timebuilder View Post
    Every procedure is enumerated and approved before it happens.

    Tinning wires is not a normal procedure during a thermostat installation. It is extra, and if the client does not want to pay for that step they are not going to receive that step...it is as clear and simple as that.

    Imagine for a moment that I have enough money in my pocket to go and buy a Kia, but what I really want to do is to buy a Cadillac STS.

    Now, I can walk into the Cadillac dealership in Philadelphia...a guy that I know... and I can say, "Frank, I'd like to buy a Cadillac STS....but I only have Kia money in my pocket." You know what Frank's going to do? He's going to start to chuckle....he's going to slap me on the shoulder and he's going to say, Art...you know better than that!"
    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk

  9. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBeerme View Post
    Last place I worked started doing some of that third party work. The third party would only pay us eighty five bucks an hour. Which in the Bay Area, and Silicone Valley in particular, is pennies on the dollar. We charged everyone else well over a hundred bucks an hour. It was the beginning of the end for that company.
    The reason that store managers tell their providers to send me and the company out using my name is because there are so few people in the world of third party that can find their backside using both hands and a road map.

    These are the guys that I refer to as "Joey's," whose previous job included asking the question, "would you like fries with that?"

    So as a result of this dynamic of the third party world, the only people in it who are any good are in terrific demand, and all the time.
    [Avatar photo from a Florida training accident. Everyone walked away.]
    2 Tim 3:16-17

    RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
    Member, IAEI

    AOP Forum Rules:







  10. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by R600a View Post
    That is interesting. We are much more vague than that on our invoices. I like your analogy.

    Sent in a state of increasing entropy using Tapatalk
    It's a truth that's unavoidable and I can tell you that if you do this for over a decade you figure out what you have to do to get paid for the work you're doing, because the people who are in charge of paying you don't want to pay you for the work you're doing.

    So...just like the Bible says, we have to be "wise as serpents, as and as gentle as doves."
    [Avatar photo from a Florida training accident. Everyone walked away.]
    2 Tim 3:16-17

    RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
    Member, IAEI

    AOP Forum Rules:







  11. #88
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    Sep 2003
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    Ocean County, N.J.
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    Found the T6s to be problematic.

  12. #89
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    Aug 2018
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    Piedmont Triad, NC
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    So, how petty does it make me that I heard a rival hvac guy (plumbing company that just became hvac too in the same business park as us) order a t6 at the supply house and I didn’t give him a heads up? I even noticed he had a new heat pump system loaded up in his truck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  13. #90
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    May 2014
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    Not petty at all. If he's not on this site, that's his problem. No need for you to sweat or lose sleep over it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Achso017 View Post
    So, how petty does it make me that I heard a rival hvac guy (plumbing company that just became hvac too in the same business park as us) order a t6 at the supply house and I didn’t give him a heads up? I even noticed he had a new heat pump system loaded up in his truck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    If you were a real tech, you'd solder a relay on that board and call it good to go.

    I do a triple evac with nitro to remove non condensables.

    I use 56% silver on everything except steel.

    Did you really need the " If you were a real tech " ??

  14. #91
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
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    Piedmont Triad, NC
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBeerme View Post
    Not petty at all. If he's not on this site, that's his problem. No need for you to sweat or lose sleep over it.
    Thanks man. Cheers! *clink*


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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