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  1. #1
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    Trane vs other furnaces.

    I just got a quote from an HVAC installer. His bid included a Trane SX91. I was told "The new S9X1 is more efficient with a ECM motor and it is also a few dollars less than the older model."

    The Trane website shows other better models one that is more quiet and one that is higher efficiency. When I called Trane to clarify the info I felt the people answering the phone knew nothing about the product but were just there to get my contact info for marketing purposes.

    Should I insist on an American Standard furnace instead or another brand? I would like a two stage option or modulating.

  2. #2
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    May 2000
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    The S9X1 is the new version of the XT90. No idea on price, that varies by dealer. You gotta watch the installer on the S8 and S9 line as they have a small return air opening in the side of the furnace which means if the dealer slaps an air cleaner right on the furnace only about 1/2 of it will get air flow thus restricting your air. Need a transitioned side return on smaller units and bottom return on all units.

    If you want modulating, Look at Rheem's R98 line. Entire line is 98% AFUE. Rheem was original modulating furnace well before anybody else. The prices aren't bad, the new Econet WiFi touchscreen is affordable and works with Alexa.

  3. #3
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    Aug 2009
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    Beatrice, NE
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photobug View Post
    I just got a quote from an HVAC installer. His bid included a Trane SX91. I was told "The new S9X1 is more efficient with a ECM motor and it is also a few dollars less than the older model."

    The Trane website shows other better models one that is more quiet and one that is higher efficiency. When I called Trane to clarify the info I felt the people answering the phone knew nothing about the product but were just there to get my contact info for marketing purposes.

    Should I insist on an American Standard furnace instead or another brand? I would like a two stage option or modulating.
    Am Std and Trane are twins, they share the same DNA but have different clothes. I believe they still make the TUHM which is modulating or the S9V2 would be 2 stg.

  4. #4
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    Mar 2018
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    Chico, Ca #StateofJefferson
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    None of the manufacturers will deal directly with the public, that's what the licensed hvac contractor is for, so save yourself some time with that in the future. Usually a salesman that stops by has just a few minutes to size up what he thinks would be a good couple options for you, a good/better/best kind of choice but that by no means is every model available so you need to tell the sales guy what technology you would be interested in, any hot/cold zones in the house, noisy ducting, etc. Every manufacturer has the same technology in their equipment so dont worry about the name on the box, the hardest part is going to be finding the contractor that properly sizes the unit to the load of the house(manual J) and ensures the ducting can support the airflow and deliver the appropriate cfm to each rooms individual needs(manual D). Oversized equipment on undersized ducting is the bane of this industry, contractors dont spend the time to measure the house and do the math, instead just slap in units that will roast or freeze you out. This isn't particularly comfortable or efficient and causes excessive on-off cycling. Then it gets attached to horrible duct design that cant handle the airflow and you get noise, capacity loss and excessive wear and tear and frequent breakdowns. My advice would be to find the best contractor you can and let them get the equipment from whatever parts distributor they have a good relationship with.

  5. #5
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    Mar 2018
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    Chico, Ca #StateofJefferson
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    What is the model number of your current furnace and what was the model number of the proposed equipment? If your old furnace wasn't 96% like the S9X1, it will put out more heat requiring more airflow than your old furnace if they put in the same btu size

  6. #6
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    Sep 2019
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    Jackson, Wyoming
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    Thread Starter
    Quote Originally Posted by Makeitcold View Post
    My advice would be to find the best contractor you can and let them get the equipment from whatever parts distributor they have a good relationship with.
    My problem is while there is no lack of contractors here there I am competing with multimillion dollar homes being built. The contractors are all busy and the ones that show up often inflate their bid significantly. It is somewhat understandable because of the cost of living here and a labor shortage resulting from that but there are also opportunities by finding the right person to save significantly. This HVAC install will be the only thing I have not done myself on this house or at least helped the contractor out with.

    https://www.zillow.com/jackson-wy/

    Quote Originally Posted by Makeitcold View Post
    Oversized equipment on undersized ducting is the bane of this industry, contractors dont spend the time to measure the house and do the math, instead just slap in units that will roast or freeze you out. This isn't particularly comfortable or efficient and causes excessive on-off cycling. Then it gets attached to horrible duct design that cant handle the airflow and you get noise, capacity loss and excessive wear and tear and frequent breakdowns.
    My current furnace dead for two winters now is 100k BTU. The guy who came by looked at the duct work and was impressed. He said it looked substantial and well installed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Makeitcold View Post
    None of the manufacturers will deal directly with the public, that's what the licensed hvac contractor is for, so save yourself some time with that in the future. Usually a salesman that stops by has just a few minutes to size up what he thinks would be a good couple options for you, a good/better/best kind of choice but that by no means is every model available so you need to tell the sales guy what technology you would be interested in, any hot/cold zones in the house, noisy ducting, etc.
    I let them choose the model and they suggested the S9V1, I asked about the other model and they seemed to be set on installing the S9V1 model in my home and offered no other options. So I contacted Trane to get info on the models. First person made sure to collect all my contact info then put me on hold to find out the answers to my questions. After being on hold for 10 minutes I hung up. When I called back later I was once again forced to give all my personal info before moving on. The person was only willing to recommend another Trane authorized dealer and refused to answer any questions. I told her I would not consider using Trane unless I could get some answers on the different models. She hung up on me.

    I have done a work up of my heat needs and determined I need about 54k BTUs to heat the whole house so looking at a 60k furnace. Can anyone suggest a Rheem or American Standard furnace that is 2 stage?
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  7. #7
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    Just google Trane residential furnaces, it will take you to their homepage and show you every model they make- this works on all brands too. I'm not really a fan of condensing furnaces but it would probably be stupid not to use it in your location. The XV95 was a good furnace that has been replaced by the S9V2 which hasn't been out long enough for me to have an opinion on. If gas is dirt cheap the XV80 maybe worth looking at, they've been making that model for a long time because it's a bestseller and pretty dang reliable

  8. #8
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    May 2000
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    Both Rheem & AS/Trane have 60K 90+ furnaces in single, 2 stage and modulating. Output would be above 54K your heat loss.

  9. #9
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    Sep 2019
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    Jackson, Wyoming
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    Thread Starter
    Quote Originally Posted by Makeitcold View Post
    Just google Trane residential furnaces, it will take you to their homepage and show you every model they make- this works on all brands too. I'm not really a fan of condensing furnaces but it would probably be stupid not to use it in your location. The XV95 was a good furnace that has been replaced by the S9V2 which hasn't been out long enough for me to have an opinion on. If gas is dirt cheap the XV80 maybe worth looking at, they've been making that model for a long time because it's a bestseller and pretty dang reliable
    Yep that's what got me started the Trane has a huge selection, which was overwhelming a day ago but now understanding the different motors and older models. It is a bit overhwelming. My old Goodman lasted about 19 years which was lucky because it apparently was a lemon with a history of premature failure of heat exchanger. It makes me want to choose a known model that has proved itself.

  10. #10
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    Sep 2019
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    Jackson, Wyoming
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    Thread Starter
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    The S9X1 is the new version of the XT90. No idea on price, that varies by dealer. You gotta watch the installer on the S8 and S9 line as they have a small return air opening in the side of the furnace which means if the dealer slaps an air cleaner right on the furnace only about 1/2 of it will get air flow thus restricting your air. Need a transitioned side return on smaller units and bottom return on all units.

    If you want modulating, Look at Rheem's R98 line. Entire line is 98% AFUE. Rheem was original modulating furnace well before anybody else. The prices aren't bad, the new Econet WiFi touchscreen is affordable and works with Alexa.
    I have had good luck with my Rheem water heater. I had installed the NEST thermostat before my old furnace stopped working. I like the Alexa compatibility. I am under the impression most modulating furnaces needs a compatible thermostat to work to its its full capacity. Looking at the Rheem 98 it appears to be an updraft model only. I am looking to put this in my 55" crawl space with a horizontal flow with an exhaust and input out the side of my crawlspace.

    So after all I have learned thanks to all your guy's help I realize what I want:

    60k BTU
    Horizontal draft (multi poise?)
    Direct vent and intake out the side of the house.
    Two phase or modulating,
    Nest or Alexa compatible.

    The current downdraft furnace goes straight down to the ducting and goes 180 degrees left and right. Is there one model that would make this easy to install so i can use this same return air or will the current ducting need to be moved to fit this current return air?Name:  20181105_111252.jpg
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  11. #11
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    The R97 line has a down/horizontal model. Moving any furnace from downflow to horizontal in the crawl will take a lot of metal work.

    The Econet control system is Alexa compatible.

  12. #12
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    Mar 2018
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    Chico, Ca #StateofJefferson
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    Nest is a junk product with a well earned reputation for causing operational errors and destroying control boards, stay away! Is your crawl sealed and stays above freezing all winter? All condensing furnaces create condensation while operating, just like a/c does and it must be dumped somewhere. If your crawl gets below freezing for good stretches extra precautions must be used to prevent furnace shutdown from condensate freeze-up. This condensate is also acidic so you dont want it to drain onto your roofing or sidewalks or other areas that it will cause damage. The exhaust flue for every condensing furnace MUST slope back to the furnace at a minimum angle or it will not work so something the contractor will have to measure to see if moving it into the crawl is doable

  13. #13
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    Sep 2019
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    Jackson, Wyoming
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makeitcold View Post
    Nest is a junk product with a well earned reputation for causing operational errors and destroying control boards, stay away! Is your crawl sealed and stays above freezing all winter? All condensing furnaces create condensation while operating, just like a/c does and it must be dumped somewhere. If your crawl gets below freezing for good stretches extra precautions must be used to prevent furnace shutdown from condensate freeze-up. This condensate is also acidic so you dont want it to drain onto your roofing or sidewalks or other areas that it will cause damage. The exhaust flue for every condensing furnace MUST slope back to the furnace at a minimum angle or it will not work so something the contractor will have to measure to see if moving it into the crawl is doable
    My last furnace only lasted a little while after installing the Nest. Having trouble shooted other parts of the system, I am going to say its the control board at fault. No nest on the future furnace.

    The crawl space has R-20 and is mostly sealed in winter and does not freeze. The slope should be easy at least through my west wall that does not have any duct in the way. I think on the other sides the exhaust flue could be sloping and be routed above the duct into the sill.

    My current exhaust plumbing is ABS so if I do not put the heater in the crawl space, I will need to change out the chimney to PVC so the cost to redo the duct for the crawl space is offset by not having to replumb the current exhaust.

    Do you know the needed slope for exhaust? I could go measure the potential slope today.

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