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  1. #1
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    Cleveland Steam kettle age ? and advice

    Model KGL-60
    Serial # WT1778-08D-02

    Trying to find out manufacturing date of this steam kettle.
    Looking online for wiring diagram and see there is a change around 2004. This seasonal facility was rebuilt in 1996 and a lot of equipment is still original, so it could be that old.

    Rodents have nibbled at several points of the small wiring, no complete breaks but definitely compromised.

    Relay kicks in, inducer blows, ignitor glows, unit fires up then gas valve shuts off after three to five seconds.

    Rather than a fiddle with a bunch of splices looking at ordering a new harness and diagnose from there.

    Most of my experience is refrigeration but getting dragged into the greasy hot stuff lately.

  2. #2
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    In the serial number, the "08D" indicates the date of manufacture:

    08=2008
    D =April

    From your description, it sounds like it's not proving flame - for whatever reason -

    • Faulty ignition module
    • Improper gas pressure
    • Dirty burner or orifice
    • Improper airflow from the blower motor
    • Etc.


    FYI: The 120v hot surface ignitor performs the function of proving flame after it lights the burner. Although the ignition module requires 24vac input for control voltage to the gas valve, 120vac input is supplied to the module to operate the HSI and flame proof circuit.
    ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° °

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  3. #3
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    Gracias caballero!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECtofix View Post
    In the serial number, the "08D" indicates the date of manufacture:

    08=2008
    D =April

    From your description, it sounds like it's not proving flame - for whatever reason -

    • Faulty ignition module
    • Improper gas pressure
    • Dirty burner or orifice
    • Improper airflow from the blower motor
    • Etc.


    FYI: The 120v hot surface ignitor performs the function of proving flame after it lights the burner. Although the ignition module requires 24vac input for control voltage to the gas valve, 120vac input is supplied to the module to operate the HSI and flame proof circuit.
    Add poor ground to this list.

  5. #5
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    Thanks EBreeze!
    Harness should be in by Monday afternoon, my "weekend off" is typically Tues-Wed.
    We are off season so this project will likely be put off while others have more precedence.

  6. #6
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    I love and hate these kettles at the same time.

    Definetley a flame sensing problem, you are taking Ma signal on the flame monitor so if there is a wire that is damaged on that return from the igniter/flame sensor, it could be the problem.

    I think a new wire harness is a good idear!

  7. #7
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    Harness installed but I was incorrect in my original statement.

    "Relay kicks in, inducer blows, ignitor glows, unit fires up then gas valve shuts off after three to five seconds."

    Should read:Relay kicks in, inducer blows, ignitor glows, gas valve clicks open, but does NOT fire, ignitor glow then fades away after three to five seconds.

    Getting a faint whiff of gas from the flue vent.
    Any chance an ignitor will glow but not be hot enough to ignite fuel?

  8. #8
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    > Any chance an ignitor will glow but not be hot enough to ignite fuel?

    Yes, I've seen it, mostly on Southbend convection ovens, but unlikely- the ignition module will usually error out and refuse to do anything.

    When the gas valve clicks, is it getting the voltage it needs?

    Is manifold gas pressure ok when it clicks?

    Any chance a Dormont quick-connect is not fully inserted?

    Loosen the adjuster caps on any gas regulators in the line and the gas valve itself, just a turn or so. Does she fire off then?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by davejohnsonnola View Post
    Getting a faint whiff of gas from the flue vent.
    Any chance an ignitor will glow but not be hot enough to ignite fuel?
    Absolutely! Here's vid I did years ago about that:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDfEVt1rRJU

    That was a 24v HSI. It would glow, but wouldn't ignite the burner.

    I don't remember what a 120v ignitor resistance is -which is what I think that kettle uses. Maybe in the neighborhood of 60 to 80 ohms? Much like what Lincoln ovens use, I think that your kettle also employs the ignitor to prove flame along with ignition. So, a double duty which it might be miserably failing at either.

    Don't discount factors that badbozo has mentioned.
    However, if you put an ohmmeter to the ignitor and read HUNDREDS of ohms, that's probably the problem.
    ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° °

    "You never know what others don't know." -

    If I can't laugh at myself...then I'll laugh at YOU! -

  10. #10
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    Put your amp meter on the gas valve wires and see the amp draw, it should be o.75 or something like that, if it's below 0.50 or close to it, the gas valve won't stay open, I went though 5 or 6 gas valves that were faulty and doing that exact thing, would heat occasionally.

  11. #11
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    Thank you gents!

    Got hold of my hotside guy and he installed the harness. We ran out of time Friday afternoon to do much troubleshooting after that. Hate to second guess his diagnosis, but here I am.

    I'm in over the weekend. Will isolate the ignitor and ohm out. Will recheck the gas delivery to the valve. This is a large seasonal kitchen, we are still a month out from reopen. One range on the other end of the line has active pilots but the rest of the line has been gathering dust since May. This is a floor mount kettle but will recheck the Dormont quick connect as well as voltage to the gas valve.

    Surveilance and security procedures have put the kibosh on me taking personal tools in and out of the facility, still waiting for PO approval of Fieldpiece manometer/pressure switch tester from the bean counters.

  12. #12
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    Thread Starter
    My hot-side guy got to it before I did and changed the igniter.
    It definitely glows brighter than old one and fires away!
    Didn't get the chance to ohm out the new igniter but the old one is 410 ohms.

    As always thanks for your time and advice.

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