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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Central Florida
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    79
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    new old guy here

    I ran across this forum the other day just goofing around looking for some pump curves . I guess I should start by saying hello to everyone and introduce myself . I started in HVAC in 1973 , by attending a technical school for HVAC . After graduation I worked as a fiberglass duct helper / mechanic for a year or so then moved over to the service side for about a year . Around 1976 I got lucky and got into testing and balancing , I have been doing it ever since . I have been in the field very little in the last 8 or 10 years so my knowledge on the latest control systems and / or how to operate the latest and greatest instruments is not my strong suit . However , I do have a fairly good grasp on trouble shooting and how to approach air and hydronic balancing . Cheers all .

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chicago area
    Posts
    8,453
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    Glad to have you.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    kansas
    Posts
    1,653
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    So you’re have been in tab 40+ years? That’s a lot of info that will be lost if you don’t share it welcome aboard. Please fill out your profile to include email and your updated situation
    Honeywell you can buy better but you cant pay more

    I told my wife when i die to sell my fishing stuff for what its worth not what i told her i paid for it

  4. Likes heatingman liked this post
  5. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Louisburg Kansas
    Posts
    3,511
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    You were in the field in the 90's when DDC was still in it's infancy. DDC has changed some since then but mostly for the better. The main thing with the instruments is you learned how to use them.
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chicago area
    Posts
    8,453
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    Brad please feel free to put in your 2 cents in any of the forums.

    A balancers perspective to the day to day troubleshooting problems is valuable.

    Im not a balancer, but happen to know a fair amount about it.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    79
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    Thread Starter
    I was going to reply to a few of the threads but the answers you guys gave were solid so I didn't post . I did update my profile to include more info . Is there any interest in discussing the business side and how to force the contractors to do their jobs ? Thanks again for the warm welcome ...cheers.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Louisburg Kansas
    Posts
    3,511
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    As a balancer the only way to force others to do their job is to tell them balance can't be done until the install is complete in accordance with the specs. If the spec includes NEBB or any other certifying agency it is your say when it is ready to balance.
    No balance means no retainer.
    I had them to try all kind of tricks but they never won. You are at the bottom of the food chain but the final say is yours.
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chicago area
    Posts
    8,453
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    Brad, you can create a post about anything that interests you. There are even forums for non trade related talk.

    Also post even when you don’t have a bunch to add, just to back up a point made, or to drive it home.

    If you get I think 15 or 30 posts, you can apply for Pro status, then the locked areas that are not open to the general public will become available once your approved, which is pretty simple.

    The benefit there is we can talk more openly about the business side of the the trades, and also be more technical and not have to worry about giving out too much how to info to the wrong people.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    26,471
    Post Likes
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by bradluke0 View Post
    . . . . Is there any interest in discussing the business side and how to force the contractors to do their jobs ? . . . .
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Louisburg Kansas
    Posts
    3,511
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    The problem with balance work is everyone knows how to do it even if they know nothing about it. There are hood holders and there are balancers. Sometimes you have to meet force with force. I had an engineer that got so intent in blaming me for his incompetence that to straighten him out I filed a complaint with the state board of technical professionals.
    Prior to doing so I talk to him and told him to meet me at the job and I would show him the problem. He refused and said he already knew what he needed to know. I told him if he wouldn't listen to me I would write letters to the people he would listen to and he wouldn't like the results. The smart ass said do whatever you're big enough to do so I did.
    After they got finished with him he was on the phone asking what it would take for me to drop the complaint.
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    79
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    Thread Starter
    What I do is develop a line of communication with the contractor and let them know that we expect them to do their job . If we arrive at the project and its not ready we punch the items that are outstanding and send a 1/2 day trip charge for a false start . We do the same with punch lists . We have them sign that all items are corrected and we make one trip back . After that one trip back its billed on a t & m basis . What it comes down to is that its business , its nothing personal against them . Once you hold your ground you will see their performance improve . Its hard for a lot of guys to make this stand but its your money and they are messing with it . If you save 3 hours per week for 1 guy it equates to $12,480 per year saved . Anyone have $12,480 they want to give away? Didn't think so .

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Louisburg Kansas
    Posts
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    That's a good way to handle it but where I'm at it took 6 months to get paid and extras were next to impossible to get. I didn't sign Pay If Paid contracts until all my competitors did. It was either except those terms or close the doors. Quality of work also meant nothing. All the contractors wanted was a certified report and they only wanted that because they couldn't get all their money without it. There were a couple of exceptions but not enough to make a living on.
    A line of communication meant nothing here. I was informed one job was ready to balance and the doors and windows hadn't even been installed.
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    79
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    Thread Starter
    I hear you Wayne and its too bad that's how the contractors were . In the beginning I had to work for anyone who would hire me and for really cheap too . All you can really do is keep pecking away at them and as time goes by drop the crappy contractors as you get jobs from better ones . I think the key to a successful service business is to always strive to get better customers . I also file a notice to owner on every job over $1500 . In Florida this ensures that you can lien the property if you don't get paid . BTW , Florida is a paid when paid state . If the contractor gets paid and doesn't pay me I threaten them with what we call "diversion of construction funds ." The state can suspend their license for non-payment . Hate to sound like a dick but don't mess with my money...lol.

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