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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Does climate change really happen?

    What is your opinion?

    I think yes, IF we can believe the data that is publicly available then it is getting warmer. Is human made CO2 the cause? Probably it is. It is just the rate of change that links it to our activity. The rise since we started burning hydrocarbons is the smoking gun in my opinion.

    Now what is really scaring me is the acceleration in the trends. Seems the CO2 rise follows some exponential curve now, it was growing 1ppm per year in the 60s, then 2ppm per year, now we cross 3ppm per year and growing. This suggests it has turned into some self-accelerating process and this is really scary.

    Do you believe the governments are able at all to address a problem of that scale? I doubt it. Their response is "tax it" LOL.

  2. #2
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    Of course the climate changes. Often and the climate change does not last long.
    Regards Teddy Bear
    Bear Rules: Keep our home <50% RH summer, controls mites/mold and very comfortable.
    Provide 60-100 cfm of fresh air when occupied to purge indoor pollutants and keep window dry during cold weather. T-stat setup/setback +8 hrs. saves energy
    Use +Merv 10 air filter. -Don't forget the "Golden Rule"

  3. #3
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    Does the climate change... yes...

    Does mankind affect it... probably...
    Specifically, what % of climate change is directly linked to mankind???
    THAT, IMO, is the question that needs to be answered!

    When one looks at a problem... one needs to look at ALL sides of the problem...
    And here is a side that does not get much attention:
    There is is evidence of two things that affect climate:
    *There is a direct relationship between sunspot activity and climate...
    *The planet Mars has similar climate changes to Earth, at the SAME time!

    So to say it is all mankinds fault...
    Is not really true...
    Unless BOTH of the above are false...
    Yet the two items above... are proven!

    So there is more going on than mankind...

    Wonder why the folks that promote climate change do not want to talk about sunspots or Mars???

    Perhaps because it does not support their agenda...
    Maybe it debunks their money trail (to their campaign donors)???
    Maybe it hurts their self designed and self-overinflated image???

    We have been told of the climate changing for almost a century... and we have been told doomsday stories repeatedly... yet it never happened...
    Anyone wanna explain WHY the predicted doomsday never happened???
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  4. #4
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    not sure about Mars... there is hardly anyone to ask.

    Another aspect of climate change is the deforestation and destruction of natural habitats, I think it has some substantial contribution to the climate change besides of co2.

  5. #5
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    The main event, and what should get the focus is New Technology and new energy sources. Poof! Man's contribution to CC solved. Putting all this expense, effort and legislation into limiting and eliminating current tech & energy usage is a waste of time and money. Let's find a solution instead. That solution will only come via new innovations. I love a problem that solves itself while providing new advantages for humanity and earth.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by vin lashon View Post
    The main event, and what should get the focus is New Technology and new energy sources. Poof! Man's contribution to CC solved. Putting all this expense, effort and legislation into limiting and eliminating current tech & energy usage is a waste of time and money. Let's find a solution instead. That solution will only come via new innovations. I love a problem that solves itself while providing new advantages for humanity and earth.
    I agree.... however they are trying to limit new energy instead! E.g. take a look at Spain, it had a developing solar market but then they made a law that if you put a solar panel on your property without all the new requirements for paperwork, there is a $50 million fine (yes million), this basically killed the PV in Spain because nobody wants to risk to have something not in order and become bancrupt due to to the fine.

  7. #7
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    Yes: the Earth's climate changes.

    But that's the end of what is actually known.

    There is
    -------------------

    ˜˜˜˜˜gggggmmmnm nnnn v.v vmmvmmvmvmmmmmmmvm

    m
    v
    mmv 999999zxzzzz

    kkkkkkkkkkkllok
    l

    o



    ooo
    ------------------

    OK; the above is what my two year contributed - which probably has as much value as anything.

    There is no way to establish what has caused the climate to change. Or at least: no known way. And the fact that the climate has changed while mankind was doing a certain thing does not mean that the change would not have happened anyway.

    Or even that worse changes were prevented by mankind's activities. <g>

    So: we start off with a really large potential error in our efforts to form a theory.

    Moving ahead: we have no idea what we can do to stop the climate from changing.

    And, as on any lengthy time-line the introduction variables is inevitable, aiming for virtually any target so far in the future becomes essentially random chance.

    The idea that anything based on the above is Science is delusional or ignorant of what Science is. I often hear the phrase stated: "A consensus of top scientists believes". And what I cannot understand is why every rational person does not laugh out loud at such a ridiculous comment. Science is not an agreed upon opinion.

    Although it's not an actual parallel - I am somehow reminded of Mark's (or maybe Mathew's) observations regarding Charity in Voice. It speaks of those who say only: The poor must be cared for, the sick must be healed, the naked must be clothed - but they have no way of accomplishing those things, nor do they take any viable actions towards making them occur.

    I think the Save The Climate people are exactly like that - although certainly are more justified in saying so (<g>) - as those who speak of the need for charity Are able to perform it if they so choose - whereas those who speak of the need to prevent and reverse climate change have no viable idea of how to make that happen.

    They speak mere conjecture as being somehow concrete - apparently solely by virtue of their strict and authoritative tone of voice. <g>

    PHM
    ------------



    Quote Originally Posted by gustavhorna View Post
    What is your opinion?

    I think yes, IF we can believe the data that is publicly available then it is getting warmer. Is human made CO2 the cause? Probably it is. It is just the rate of change that links it to our activity. The rise since we started burning hydrocarbons is the smoking gun in my opinion.

    Now what is really scaring me is the acceleration in the trends. Seems the CO2 rise follows some exponential curve now, it was growing 1ppm per year in the 60s, then 2ppm per year, now we cross 3ppm per year and growing. This suggests it has turned into some self-accelerating process and this is really scary.

    Do you believe the governments are able at all to address a problem of that scale? I doubt it. Their response is "tax it" LOL.
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

  8. #8
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    Clearly there is climate change. Obviously there was an ice age and now there is no ice age. Nature has all sorts of cycles, some short term like weather; evaporation, condensation, rain, hail, snow, seasons, etc.. Others like climate are longer term. Has always been like this, nothing new here.

    What some have done is tried to cry wolf and use natural change to a political advantage by turning what is normal change into a crises and then raise taxes in an effort to study it (studies are a special interest group), blame mankind for causing it, and tax the population some more for the so called solutions. At the same time, those promoting all of this are gaining personal power and control over the very population they are making pay for this control grab.

    Chipping away at our republic and slowly replacing it with socialism. The same thing has been going on in our educational system since John Dewey.
    "No matter how thirsty your imagination, mirages contain no water"

  9. Likes ChuckDe liked this post
  10. #9
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    Plot idea: 97% of the world's scientists contrive an environmental crisis, but are exposed by a plucky band of billionaires & oil companies.

  11. Likes Guyinfield liked this post
  12. #10
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    Alaska 90F... is this normal

  13. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gustavhorna View Post
    not sure about Mars... there is hardly anyone to ask.

    Another aspect of climate change is the deforestation and destruction of natural habitats, I think it has some substantial contribution to the climate change besides of co2.
    There is definitely a traceable relationship between sunspots and earth's climate... and there is documented proof that Mars follows that relationship right in step with Earth!
    Whether Google will admit it... well try searching with DuckDuckGo...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  14. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey View Post
    Yes: the Earth's climate changes.

    But that's the end of what is actually known.

    There is
    -------------------

    ˜˜˜˜˜gggggmmmnm nnnn v.v vmmvmmvmvmmmmmmmvm

    m
    v
    mmv 999999zxzzzz

    kkkkkkkkkkkllok
    l

    o



    ooo
    ------------------

    OK; the above is what my two year contributed - which probably has as much value as anything.

    There is no way to establish what has caused the climate to change. Or at least: no known way. And the fact that the climate has changed while mankind was doing a certain thing does not mean that the change would not have happened anyway.

    Or even that worse changes were prevented by mankind's activities. <g>

    So: we start off with a really large potential error in our efforts to form a theory.


    Moving ahead: we have no idea what we can do to stop the climate from changing.

    And, as on any lengthy time-line the introduction variables is inevitable, aiming for virtually any target so far in the future becomes essentially random chance.

    The idea that anything based on the above is Science is delusional or ignorant of what Science is. I often hear the phrase stated: "A consensus of top scientists believes". And what I cannot understand is why every rational person does not laugh out loud at such a ridiculous comment. Science is not an agreed upon opinion.

    Although it's not an actual parallel - I am somehow reminded of Mark's (or maybe Mathew's) observations regarding Charity in Voice. It speaks of those who say only: The poor must be cared for, the sick must be healed, the naked must be clothed - but they have no way of accomplishing those things, nor do they take any viable actions towards making them occur.

    I think the Save The Climate people are exactly like that - although certainly are more justified in saying so (<g>) - as those who speak of the need for charity Are able to perform it if they so choose - whereas those who speak of the need to prevent and reverse climate change have no viable idea of how to make that happen.

    They speak mere conjecture as being somehow concrete - apparently solely by virtue of their strict and authoritative tone of voice. <g>

    PHM
    ------------
    Reading the part in bold above...

    IMO what the left has done... is ASSume something... then scream it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...
    Until folks believe it just because they heard it hundreds (no thousands) of times.

    Even if one hears something 100 thousand times... it can still be a bold faced lie.

    And in the case of science...
    Until it is proven (not assumed) by the scientific method...
    It is NOT fact!
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  15. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gustavhorna View Post
    Alaska 90F... is this normal
    WHAT... is normal???

    There is a continent up north called Greenland, that used to be farmed... now it is all ice!
    So what is normal for that land???
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

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