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  1. #27
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    Gary, you keep acting like the US is Mad Max. Have you been listening to any REAL news? As far as unemployment, the stock market, household income. Not only do you have your head in the sand, you're blindfolded and wearing earmuffs to boot. People that make poor decisions should suffer the consequences. NO ONE should make a livable wage flipping burgers. What about their responsibility to society? What good are 40 year old people whose best skills are flipping burgers or stocking shelves?

  2. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by GorillaTight View Post
    We are already paying for roads through gasoline taxes, income taxes, sales taxes, etc. etc. Maryland came up with a rain tax...come on man.
    Roads and freeways were not really my point. There are large ticket items like our military, a war, our infrastructure, our Fed govt, the Pentagon, The White House, you name it. Those are too big of expenses for individuals to cough up out of their checking accounts. Healthcare for the elderly is another so we came up with Medicare. Well, health insurance is another. We need to get it out of the hands of the capitalists like we did with those other areas and let the govt deal with this 'capitalism gone wild.'

    Can you imagine what Blue Cross would charge an 85 year old man for a platinum health insurance plan? 99% of everyone over the age of 75 would be bankrupted without Medicare. That alone proves the effectiveness of it.

  3. #29
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    People... Everyone one of is going to die... Get used to it.
    People are wanting other people to fork over money so they can live longer... Since money equals life expectancy.. you are taking part of their life to increase your own... Be men for Pete's sake and stop acting like girls.. you are going to die.. get over it already...Geeze.
    They make pills to make you not give a crap about death...take em !!!
    ...

  4. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by GorillaTight View Post
    So people that are financially responsible need to cover for the guy buying drugs, or alcohol, or cigarettes, or a Big Mac every day, or a fancy car or house? SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST.
    Well said...if people want to live longer start saving money now
    ...

  5. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Roads and freeways were not really my point. There are large ticket items like our military, a war, our infrastructure, our Fed govt, the Pentagon, The White House, you name it. Those are too big of expenses for individuals to cough up out of their checking accounts. Healthcare for the elderly is another so we came up with Medicare. Well, health insurance is another. We need to get it out of the hands of the capitalists like we did with those other areas and let the govt deal with this 'capitalism gone wild.'

    Can you imagine what Blue Cross would charge an 85 year old man for a platinum health insurance plan? That alone proves the effectiveness of Medicare.
    It's not your point, but you made it anyway? Why do you keep coming back here after getting your hat handed to you? Medicare is headed for insolvency, just like Social Security and almost anything else the gov't. touches. The gubmint should provide for national defense and infrastructure, not people's poor life decisions.

  6. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by GorillaTight View Post
    It's not your point, but you made it anyway? Why do you keep coming back here after getting your hat handed to you? Medicare is headed for insolvency, just like Social Security and almost anything else the gov't. touches. The gubmint should provide for national defense and infrastructure, not people's poor life decisions.
    The govt does not pay for anything. We do. And why let them run national defense? We should hire private firms like Blackwater to defend us at $300,000 per soldier. That is the real capitalist way of running a country. Get those bastards out of everything, even Washington. And next time you want a war, be ready to raise your taxes for it. If a city wants a freeway, let them pay for it out of their vacation money. As for old people that need medical care, "F" em! Let them suffer and die. If you didn't put away a $2M IRA, "F" you too. Go live behind Walmart.

    Am I getting up to speed here?

  7. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    The govt does not pay for anything. We do. And why let them run national defense? We should hire private firms like Blackwater to defend us at $300,000 per soldier. That is the real capitalist way of running a country. Get those bastards out of everything, even Washington. And next time you want a war, be ready to raise your taxes for it. If a city wants a freeway, let them pay for it out of their vacation money. As for old people that need that medical care, "F" em! Let them suffer and die.
    No...it's not all or nothing. Nations shouldn't be guarded by mercenaries, that should be obvious to everyone. Second, nobody wants to die, yet it happens to us all. I'm sure you've heard the statistic of what age group spends the most on healthcare; for what though? To prolong life by a couple years or months? If they have the money, fine. A majority of outcomes are determined by peoples' life decisions and genetics. They should be aware of these and plan accordingly.

  8. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by GorillaTight View Post
    No...it's not all or nothing. Nations shouldn't be guarded by mercenaries, that should be obvious to everyone. Second, nobody wants to die, yet it happens to us all. I'm sure you've heard the statistic of what age group spends the most on healthcare; for what though? To prolong life by a couple years or months? If they have the money, fine. A majority of outcomes are determined by peoples' life decisions and genetics. They should be aware of these and plan accordingly.
    Like I said, do a blood test and check the bank balance. If they don't check out, then well the cyanid and dumpster are out back.

  9. #35
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    And to think just a few years ago all these folks were getting their panties in a twist over supposed death panels. Now they want to base an individual's health and well being on genetics, lifestyle and available dollars.

    My how times have changed.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you in trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.

  10. #36
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    Thread Starter
    Given that the US government spends more than Canada per person now, why can't the US have basic cover for all? Then have a private sector for those that choose to have better care?

    Whether it medicare for the poor/old, VA, what have you, you guys are paying for something you can't use right now. This is in part why I choose universal over what you guys have. At least I'm getting something for my money.

    Yeah, basic cover isn't the best in the world. So have a private sector that operates alongside the public. You choose the level of care you want! This is how it works in Oz. Plus if you buy private insurance in Oz you pay less into the public system. Win win.

    I don't have much to complain about with the Canadian system, but Oz's is better. Cheaper and more choice.

    You are already getting taxed the money required, so why not?

  11. Likes Brian8383 liked this post
  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    Given that the US government spends more than Canada per person now, why can't the US have basic cover for all? Then have a private sector for those that choose to have better care?

    Whether it medicare for the poor/old, VA, what have you, you guys are paying for something you can't use right now. This is in part why I choose universal over what you guys have. At least I'm getting something for my money.

    Yeah, basic cover isn't the best in the world. So have a private sector that operates alongside the public. You choose the level of care you want! This is how it works in Oz. Plus if you buy private insurance in Oz you pay less into the public system. Win win.

    I don't have much to complain about with the Canadian system, but Oz's is better. Cheaper and more choice.

    You are already getting taxed the money required, so why not?
    Absolutely. I have always argued for a system of basic care provided universally with additional coverage available on the open market even before the ACA. Health care in the US was an even more fragmented mish-mash of federal,state,local government plans along side the private systems of PPO, HMO, high/low deductible, high/low copay, in network,out of network, HSA eligible/ineligible etc. before the ACA. The ACA attempted to consolidate and simplify it all and failed.

    The main reason for people not wanting universal health care is not financial it is philosophical. We are all rugged individuals who lift ourselves up by our own boot straps while singing yippee kyay here in the US and we don't want no guvment socialized medicine in the land of the free and the brave.

    Even if such a system makes sense and would be a better use of our tax and private insurance dollars.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you in trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    Given that the US government spends more than Canada per person now, why can't the US have basic cover for all? Then have a private sector for those that choose to have better care?

    Whether it medicare for the poor/old, VA, what have you, you guys are paying for something you can't use right now. This is in part why I choose universal over what you guys have. At least I'm getting something for my money.

    Yeah, basic cover isn't the best in the world. So have a private sector that operates alongside the public. You choose the level of care you want! This is how it works in Oz. Plus if you buy private insurance in Oz you pay less into the public system. Win win.

    I don't have much to complain about with the Canadian system, but Oz's is better. Cheaper and more choice.

    You are already getting taxed the money required, so why not?
    There are many solutions like you mentioned, but healthcare providers, health insurance and big pharma are running the show now. They will have no part of universal healthcare for all because they know that would be the end of their scam.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    Given that the US government spends more than Canada per person now, why can't the US have basic cover for all? Then have a private sector for those that choose to have better care?

    Whether it medicare for the poor/old, VA, what have you, you guys are paying for something you can't use right now. This is in part why I choose universal over what you guys have. At least I'm getting something for my money.

    Yeah, basic cover isn't the best in the world. So have a private sector that operates alongside the public. You choose the level of care you want! This is how it works in Oz. Plus if you buy private insurance in Oz you pay less into the public system. Win win.

    I don't have much to complain about with the Canadian system, but Oz's is better. Cheaper and more choice.

    You are already getting taxed the money required, so why not?
    That's close to what I'm saying. Amazing how I get argued with by some that should be cheering on a great idea and expanding from it. I think its definitely workable.

    But, alas the crippling emotions of the left get in the way of listening and thinking.
    “Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.”
    -Possibly said by Thomas Jefferson(but true even if he didn't)


    “What one generation tolerates, the next generation will embrace.”
    ― Definitely said by John Wesley

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