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Thread: Civility

  1. #144
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    It has been my experience that eventually there is always someone bigger, or someone tougher, than I am. My point is that I don't think can always stay out of it on size alone.

    Which reminds me: a long time ago I had a friend who was a pretty big guy. One time I watched him get mad at some rigging equipment (we were using a tree) and pull a 350 short block out of a '32 Ford pickup just by bellowing, reaching in, and grabbing it out of there. It never touched the fender and he tossed it into the grass. I don't know what a small block weighs without the heads - but I'd have to guess 500 lbs. or so.

    When he was about 14-15 he had been in an accident in a 1953 Plymouth sedan (a Cranbrook maybe?) and had gone through the windshield. His face and chest had scars that looked like zippers. He was big and looked pretty darned scary.

    Anyway we used to drink together in various dive-y and biker bars and almost without fail some guy would come over to start shet with us. Both of us were as nice as pie - smiling, happy, just easing through a young life. It took me a good while to figure out that it was Bobby. He was always the toughest looking guy there - and there was always somebody with something to prove. So in that case anyway - being big and tough looking really worked against us.

    He was so funny too. He would always have the funniest lines to use. He would always ask if there were any rules? How long will this fight last? Can I keep wailing away on you After I knock you out? Or do I have to stop when you go down? Do you need a quarter to call the hospital? They usually take more than two minutes to get here - you better call them now.

    He would say all Kinds of shet to these guys. He eventually moved out to Seattle and had a stroke. Probably not related - although I've never actually been there. <g>

    PHM
    --------


    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Yes Glenn, but it was a bit of exaggeration. Cool is partially FOS. But what is your opinion? Do you think Cool could speak that way to a stranger and it not lead to a physical altercation? I say no way unless he is 6'5, pure muscle and obviously pack'n.
    PHM
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    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

  2. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey View Post
    It has been my experience that eventually there is always someone bigger, or someone tougher, than I am. My point is that I don't think can always stay out of it on size alone.

    Which reminds me: a long time ago I had a friend who was a pretty big guy. One time I watched him get mad at some rigging equipment (we were using a tree) and pull a 350 short block out of a '32 Ford pickup just by bellowing, reaching in, and grabbing it out of there. It never touched the fender and he tossed it into the grass. I don't know what a small block weighs without the heads - but I'd have to guess 500 lbs. or so.

    When he was about 14-15 he had been in an accident in a 1953 Plymouth sedan (a Cranbrook maybe?) and had gone through the windshield. His face and chest had scars that looked like zippers. He was big and looked pretty darned scary.

    Anyway we used to drink together in various dive-y and biker bars and almost without fail some guy would come over to start shet with us. Both of us were as nice as pie - smiling, happy, just easing through a young life. It took me a good while to figure out that it was Bobby. He was always the toughest looking guy there - and there was always somebody with something to prove. So in that case anyway - being big and tough looking really worked against us.

    He was so funny too. He would always have the funniest lines to use. He would always ask if there were any rules? How long will this fight last? Can I keep wailing away on you After I knock you out? Or do I have to stop when you go down? Do you need a quarter to call the hospital? They usually take more than two minutes to get here - you better call them now.

    He would say all Kinds of shet to these guys. He eventually moved out to Seattle and had a stroke. Probably not related - although I've never actually been there. <g>

    PHM
    --------
    I've heard the same thing would happen to Jean Claude Van Damme in his prime. People sorta forgot that he was the real deal and could hurt you real fast. But maybe they just wanted the lawsuit.

    To most people size is intimidating, but not always to idiots. That is why they are used as bouncers...even drunks will walk away.

  3. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    I've heard the same thing would happen to Jean Claude Van Damme in his prime. People sorta forgot that he was the real deal and could hurt you real fast. But maybe they just wanted the lawsuit.

    To most people size is intimidating, but not always to idiots. That is why they are used as bouncers...even drunks will walk away.
    Some of those small wirey guys can fight and enjoy taking on larger guys..
    ...

  4. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missouri Guy View Post
    Some of those small wirey guys can fight and enjoy taking on larger guys..
    Yeah but you better watch those wiry ones because many of them will pull out a knife. Happened to a buddy of mine. He left thinking he won after knocking him down and rode off on his MC then noticed the blood coming out his jacket.

    He was OK though after a few stiches. Thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."

    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Sen. Barry Goldwater

  5. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Brian, you have a weird obsession with me. I have never bantered with you with the expectation of convincing you of anything. You on the other hand think I should change my views because of your posts. What is so different about me not being swayed by you? Do you hear me complain, insult, ridicule and babble on about not convincing you of something? Nobody here is backing down on their core views, yet you think I should because of your posts? Get over yourself, you are not that convincing.
    My "obsession" is because I would LOVE to have a productive discussion on healthcare. And maybe come up with some doable ideas that will work better.

    But you(primarily) keep those threads stuck in the mud and they go no where.

    No matter howany times I post that our system stinks, you imply I'm stating our system is better than Canada's.

    No matter how many times I post the undisputed costs in Canada's system, you insist it will cost much less. When in fact a guy like you will pay more.

    I don't care if one system might cost the average income family $100 more or less every year. I don't even care if one system or another costs $1000 more than the other per year. Because that Stat will change as you move up and down the economic ladder. The point was I dug up the numbers and showed the info you and Gary have been posting about Canada's costs for the individual and families was WAY off the mark. Not even close. That was it. And you insisted on trying to nail down nickels and dimes for the last 4 years. Both systems are expensive. Period. Sometimes ours is more money per family based on factors. Sometimes Canada's is. The valid point was costs per year should not hold as much weight in the discission because they are very close. As an example. I pay an average of $15k per year for my families personal healthcare. In Canada it would be no less than $20k. So your repeated question about my additional costs for the VA, Medicare, workers comp, lost time of work(would be the same as Canada's), etc isn't really relevant. Yes those will add to my costs per year above what I directly pay for my families healthcare. Does it equal the $5k a year MORE I would pay in Canada? Probably not. $5k is a lot of additional costs. But possibly. The point is, it's close enough to not be a determining factor in coming up with better ideas. YOU and Gary had been pushing the false claim for years that a guy like you would pay far less with a Candain style single payer system. That's just not true. But the costs for a guy like you is one of your main gripes about our system. So much of your "opinion" is based on a falsehood. It's time to admit you got it wrong and move on. Canada's system is not worth adopting and uprooting 1/6th of our economy, handing over a huge chunk of our liberty and privacy, and the other drawbacks when their are better choices that need to be explored. There are better ways than that system. Some already in place. Let's move on from a moot point.

    Another brick wall is the amazing benefits of a true consumer free market. Which is really weird to me because another obsession of yours is corporate gouging. There is no better weapon against that than leaving the consumer in charge and not allowing the government to restrict access. Yet you fight those two things no matter how much undeniable evidence is handed to you.

    It's time to move on from trying to convince everyone a Candian style system is superior. It's not. It's time to move on from trying to convince everyone a free market increase corporate gouging. It's the opposite. And proof has been provided.

    You said I am trying to change your opinion. No I'm not. I don't try to change Larhs' opinion. He would choose the Candian system over ours. But I expect a grown man would be able to accept facts, then form an opinion. Larhs accepts the costs and other drawbacks of their system. But if you still think a Candian style system is the better choice compared to ours after accepting the realities, then all is well in the universe. Cuz guess what..... That's my opinion also. But we are intelligent humans and humans have the God given gift of discernment. But descernment only takes place when we accept facts. We have the ability to analyze facts(some of us) and come up with better solutions.

    You keep the healthcare threads from exploring those solutions. Obsessing on minute differences in costs which is like obsessing on if a Ford truck is better than a Chevy. Seriously. That's a decent analogy. You have turned what I hoped on many occasions to be productive and enlightening threads analyzing and tossing out ideas, into a Chevy vs Ford debate. If those Chevy vs Ford debate bone heads accepted facts, they would determine they are on average about the same.

    I have no problem with someone's "core views" and opinion as you stated. As long as they are based in fact. And your "core view" is that Canada's system is far superior to ours is based in a couple key beliefs of yours that are not accurate. Your posts about costs per individual or family are about as meaningful to the discussuon as someone stating FORD stands for Found On Road Dead.

  6. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    I've been on liberal dominated forums, and never one time did I start crying about the UN-fairness. If you have an adverse point to make or a point to dispute, OK, but there is no value in crying about your opinion being in the minority.

    It's just the demographics here, nothing can be done to change that.
    Yep, the balance here is just the demographic of the HVAC industry. Most of us are white, blue (ish) collar, middle class Americans. People who tend to be mostly conservative to moderate in their politics.

    Go to a forum of computer IT people, gardeners, artists, etc; and the demographic will likely be just the opposite.

    We do not and would not make any attempt to influence the make-up here. It is what it is.

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  8. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian8383 View Post
    My "obsession" is because I would LOVE to have a productive discussion on healthcare.
    Well, maybe you should throw in the towel because I have given it my college try.

    But, maybe what you mean by 'productive' is to be persuasive.

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  10. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Do you think Cool could speak that way to a stranger and it not lead to a physical altercation? I say no way unless he is 6'5, pure muscle and obviously pack'n.
    Size doesn't mean anything these days, except to women. I'm always packing, my Glock 21c loaded with Winchester Supreme Elite ammo, 230 grain JHP with around 900 fps and around 450 ft/lb of energy, if you're big enough to withstand the emptying of this mag. just go ahead and kill me.
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  11. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    Size doesn't mean anything these days, except to women. I'm always packing, my Glock 21c loaded with Winchester Supreme Elite ammo, 230 grain JHP with around 900 fps and around 450 ft/lb of energy, if you're big enough to withstand the emptying of this mag. just go ahead and kill me.
    Most of the women I see today are more interested in the size of your bank account than anything else of yours. I feel sorry for ugly, poor, stupid guys, the only women going to be interested there are the high/drunk ones and that will wear off soon enough. Even those women won't be the attractive ones.

    Guess it's a good think I'm already married.

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  13. #153
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    Really? I've always thought is was: F-O-R-D - First On Race Day

    PHM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian8383 View Post
    . . . . Your posts about costs per individual or family are about as meaningful to the discussion as someone stating FORD stands for Found On Road Dead.
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

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  15. #154
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    I always heard "Found On Road Dead" and Fiat stood for "Fix It Again Tony"

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  17. #155
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    I would like to (I think anyway . . . <g>) talk about this idea:

    [QUOTE=Brian8383;25733263] . . . . the amazing benefits of a true consumer free market . . . . There is no better weapon against (corporate gouging) than leaving the consumer in charge and not allowing the government to restrict . . . . [QUOTE]


    I mention it because I see no evidence or historic precedent to substantiate this concept. Invariably all unfettered capitalism strives for a monopoly. As soon as they are financially able they beat, or bankrupt, or buy all their competition. Why wouldn't that happen with un-controlled healthcare?
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

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  19. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by BNME8EZ View Post
    I always heard "Found On Road Dead" and Fiat stood for "Fix It Again Tony"

    I have heard that about Fiat - but I always took as disparaging in regard to Italian auto mechanics. <g>
    PHM
    --------
    The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking.

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