Can you replace the Thermal Expansion Valve itself?

[pecmsg]

My unit was listed on the recall sheet as being one of the effected models. It (the recall) seemed like it was from 2014, and my unit was manufactured in 2010. I'm assuming the person who originally had the unit installed may have been unaware of the issue at the time and just never had it serviced?

I'll just see what the new HVAC tech says when he comes in a week or two. I figure worst case scenario they'd need to replace the entire evaporator coil based on what is going on. I do have the money set aside for a new unit, though, just in case.

After the original guy comes back today I'll give an update on what he says the problem is since he wanted to do more testing on the unit.

Then contact carrier and see what can be done!

[Makeitcold]

Did the guy who replaced the motor, also replace the run cap, check for correct voltage under load, perform an amp test on the motor? I think he’s trying to sell you parts, frankly. If the condenser fan motor isn’t working then you only have hot refrigerant gas getting to the txv, which is not going to freeze. Home warranty’s are a scam, unless you actually believe you can get quality work for free. Ask friends and family who they recommend

[NETWizz]

I would definitely check the cap and if bad go with a USA made cap. The motor should be checked for proper HP, RPM, and direction if you don’t go back OEM.

If the unit is impacted, Carrier might pay for at least the AC Renew or whatever additive they suggest. At any rate the indoor fan needs to be checked, and a real tech will have gauges and take temperatures of the lineset too.


Not only that if the TXV is acting up, a follow-up needs to be made to recheck in a few days. Indoor fan and filter should be checked too.

****


Hone warranty companies don’t work for the consumer most of the time. Say you pay $100/month for a warranty, you are better banking that money into an emergency repair fund. They cover only certain things and hey generally have poor contractors. He going back with a non-original motor doesn’t restore the unit to its pre-loss condition at least in value. They like to provide their own parts, too.

Then let’s say they want a $75 deductible each visit, yet they want to pay the contractor maybe $100. Their goal is that a claim costs $25 or with approval less than one monthly payment. You have to wait forever, you have to call and complain, it takes multiple technicians, they don’t cover refrigerant, and they try to deny claims for any reason asking stupid questions like, “is there water in the trap”?” Oh, “lack of maintenance.” If you file one larger claim and they pay, they will probably drop you.

If you save that money you are your own self-insurance adjuster! No denied claims, full coverage on everything, technicians you want, all parts covered, parts you choose!

[stallsworth]

I would definitely check the cap and if bad go with a USA made cap. The motor should be checked for proper HP, RPM, and direction if you don’t go back OEM.

If the unit is impacted, Carrier might pay for at least the AC Renew or whatever additive they suggest. At any rate the indoor fan needs to be checked, and a real tech will have gauges and take temperatures of the lineset too.


Not only that if the TXV is acting up, a follow-up needs to be made to recheck in a few days. Indoor fan and filter should be checked too.

****


Hone warranty companies don’t work for the consumer most of the time. Say you pay $100/month for a warranty, you are better banking that money into an emergency repair fund. They cover only certain things and hey generally have poor contractors. He going back with a non-original motor doesn’t restore the unit to its pre-loss condition at least in value. They like to provide their own parts, too.

Then let’s say they want a $75 deductible each visit, yet they want to pay the contractor maybe $100. Their goal is that a claim costs $25 or with approval less than one monthly payment. You have to wait forever, you have to call and complain, it takes multiple technicians, they don’t cover refrigerant, and they try to deny claims for any reason asking stupid questions like, “is there water in the trap”?” Oh, “lack of maintenance.” If you file one larger claim and they pay, they will probably drop you.

If you save that money you are your own self-insurance adjuster! No denied claims, full coverage on everything, technicians you want, all parts covered, parts you choose!

Yeah, I have two cheap plans: a home protection plan with my consumer energy company, and a home warranty plan and I pay $70 a month total for both. The guy that has been coming out is from the consumer energy company. The reason I have two is the consumer energy co. covers only cheap repairs, where-as the home warranty company covers everything from cheap repairs to the actual coils. I may try the Home Warranty Co when I get back and if they prove to be difficult to work with like you say, I may tell them to pound sand and just give a call to a local, reputable HVAC company. I just want to see if the home warranty co will actually do something. If they are a pain in the rear I just know not to renew with them and pay just pay for everything out of pocket.

I'm still waiting for the consumer energy guy to show up today.

Then contact carrier and see what can be done!

Called them. They said because it's a 2010 it's out of warranty and they aren't aware of any issues with a TXV, and I should call a local contractor to look at it (which I plan on doing anyway since I'm assuming my home warranty company will prove useless ((but I hope I am wrong)).

[pecmsg]

Yeah, I have two cheap plans: a home protection plan with my consumer energy company, and a home warranty plan. The guy that has been coming out is from the consumer energy company. I researched home warranty companies before I got one and the one I went with was highly rated. They cover stuff most don't, but I haven't tried using them yet. I may try when I get back and if they prove to be difficult to work with I may tell them to pound sand and just give a call to a local, reputable HVAC company. I just want to see if the home warranty co will actually do something. If they are a pain in the rear I just know not to renew with them and pay just pay for everything out of pocket.

I'm still waiting for the consumer energy guy to show up today.



Called them. They said because it's a 2010 it's out of warranty and they aren't aware of any issues with a TXV, and I should call a local contractor to look at it (which I plan on doing anyway).

Then yours was before the issue!

[NETWizz]

Did they run a leak search on the coil? TXV units can usually be changed without replacing the evaporator coil is why I am asking... but only after a proper diagnosis is it with doing because that repair involves dealing with refrigerant.

Regardless evap and TXV or TXV only you are looking at a lot of other tasks...
Pump down, Recovery, replacement, New Drier filter, evacuation, and either a full dry startup or release from pump down. Either way you would expect to pay for refrigerant unless your plan covers it, and that can be almost none all the way up to the full nameplate plus some for line-set length!

[stallsworth]

Did they run a leak search on the coil? TXV units can usually be changed without replacing the evaporator coil is why I am asking... but only after a proper diagnosis is it with doing because that repair involves dealing with refrigerant.

Regardless evap and TXV or TXV only you are looking at a lot of other tasks...
Pump down, Recovery, replacement, New Drier filter, evacuation, and either a full dry startup or release from pump down. Either way you would expect to pay for refrigerant unless your plan covers it, and that can be almost none all the way up to the full nameplate plus some for line-set length!

So the CE tech just left. He said the fan was spinning weird and shutting down because the unit has high and low pressure sensors in it. He said the copper line going into the outdoor unit was getting ice on it, and when the ice would form in it enough it'd freeze the line and trip the low pressure sensor because the line pressure was low and that would subsequently shut the fan down. I touched it and it was very cold. He said it was reading at 25F and it should be reading around 50F. He said a new unit including labor would be $ to replace the A-Coil (again, labor included). I asked about the TXV and he said you'd have to replace the entire evaporator coil and couldn't just do the TXV by itself.

He said I could keep running it but the line would eventually freeze again and I'd have to shut the unit down and let the line cool off because the pressure switch would trip.

I do plan on calling out a local HVAC company when I return from my vacation in a week so I can get a second opinion.

[pecmsg]

God
I need my waders!

[Bazooka Joe]

If it's a low SEER unit...why do you have to use a TXV if it's easily removal/install and not a simple troublefree piston metering device as another option?

Send a picture of your coil and metering device..

[stallsworth]

If it's a low SEER unit...why do you have to use a TXV if it's easily removal/install and not a simple troublefree piston metering device as another option?

Send a picture of your coil and metering device..

I'm assuming the condenser coil? The evaporator coil is unfortunately closed off. There's no access door so I can't see the coil or metering device.

[Makeitcold]

I can smell the BS from here. Danger Will Robinson! Hacks have infiltrated your home! FYI there’s a number of other things besides a txv that will freeze up a evap coil

[knave]

I can smell the BS from here. Danger Will Robinson! Hacks have infiltrated your home! FYI there’s a number of other things besides a txv that will freeze up a evap coil

Lol. Yes I agree it is likely something other than expansion valve.

[stallsworth]

Well, I had a guy from a reputable A/C company come out today to check the system. As most of you had said, the original guy from the consumer energy company was BS'ing me. The guy who came out today was awesome and explained everything to me as he was doing it, and explained what the issue was. He said the guy from the CE company had undercharged our system with only the factory amount listed on the unit. He said more refrigerant needed to be added to level out the superheat and pressure levels because the refrigerant lines ran pretty far, and that they were unbalanced from the amount the guy had put in. He said because the system was undercharged it caused the line to freeze and shut the unit down, and that the issue was not the coil or TXV. He measured the distance from the line to the outdoor unit and put in the correct amount of refrigerant in until everything was balanced then let it run for a half hour to make sure the balance stayed consistent.

Afterwards he checked every vent in the house to make sure it was blowing cold air sufficiently. Everything seems to be working great now!

[Bazooka Joe]

Where did he measure the distance from the line to the OD unit? starting at the indoor coil? As typically the factory charge in the OD unit initially is good for a matching indoor coil and a set footage of correctly sized line set, every foot over that initial footage you add a predetermined amount, then due to having a TXV, the tendency is to charge to manufacture subcooling. Certainly the superheat can be a factor in charging.

What did the invoice say in regards to how much refrigerant was added and the total line set run, was that part mentioned in the invoice?

[NETWizz]

How many pounds low were you? Did the tech use a scale? Did the tech check the line temperatures in addition to pressures?


It’s great it was such a simple fix. Recharging a unit is about the easiest thing in the world to do. It’s crazy the ace guy didn’t gas it up.

********

Your first post said line froze up, which can happen when low on charge or low airflow over the indoor coil. Somewhere above someone was talking about liquid coming back... this would generally require an overcharge condition.

An undercharge as you describe would have low sub-cooling, and high-superheat being the TXV cannot maintain superheat without liquid refrigerant begins it. Pressures all around would be low as would he respective saturated temperatures. It’s a lot of technobabble where I am saying, “I don’t see how a simple under-charge could be missed.”

Did the tech provide you with any metrics?

At any rate, send he bill to the CE or HW company... See if they will reimburse you.

[stallsworth]

Where did he measure the distance from the line to the OD unit? starting at the indoor coil? As typically the factory charge in the OD unit initially is good for a matching indoor coil and a set footage of correctly sized line set, every foot over that initial footage you add a predetermined amount, then due to having a TXV, the tendency is to charge to manufacture subcooling. Certainly the superheat can be a factor in charging.

Yes he measured starting from the coil to the outdoor unit.

How many pounds low were you? Did the tech use a scale? Did the tech check the line temperatures in addition to pressures?


It’s great it was such a simple fix. Recharging a unit is about the easiest thing in the world to do. It’s crazy the ace guy didn’t gas it up.

********

Your first post said line froze up, which can happen when low on charge or low airflow over the indoor coil. Somewhere above someone was talking about liquid coming back... this would generally require an overcharge condition.

An undercharge as you describe would have low sub-cooling, and high-superheat being the TXV cannot maintain superheat without liquid refrigerant begins it. Pressures all around would be low as would he respective saturated temperatures. It’s a lot of technobabble where I am saying, “I don’t see how a simple under-charge could be missed.”

Did the tech provide you with any metrics?

At any rate, send he bill to the CE or HW company... See if they will reimburse you.

He added 1lb of refrigerant to the unit. And yes, he checked the temperature and the pressures for the unit. He monitored them for about 30 minutes to make sure everything stayed balanced.

He also explained everything to me as he was doing it and was showing me the meters and pressure gauges he was using, as well as explaining what the levels should appear as on it. When he first measured it he said the pressures were coming back low and that the superheat was high. He said the exact same thing as you basically, that he didn't understand how the last guy didn't realize the system was undercharged.

[Bazooka Joe]

I come up with approx 40’ total line set give or take if he actually added 1 lb. that one lb could be what he charged you and not actually what was added. Sounds like he got the charge pretty close thou. Hopefully all is well with your system moving forward. It’s not like your going to bill a customer for 12.5 ounces that was actually added as an example. It gets rounded off.

[stallsworth]

I come up with approx 40’ total line set give or take if he actually added 1 lb. that one lb could be what he charged you and not actually what was added. Sounds like he got the charge pretty close thou. Hopefully all is well with your system moving forward. It’s not like your going to bill a customer for 12.5 ounces that was actually added as an example. It gets rounded off.

Yep, you got it exactly! He measured it to about 40 feet. It seems to be running great for now and I was really happy with the guy and the work he did. The price was extremely reasonable too.

[Dad]

Pricing has been removed from this thread twice.

OP... New Member. We have pricing rules here. Please re-read our site rules.



Thx

[stallsworth]

Pricing has been removed from this thread twice.

OP... New Member. We have pricing rules here. Please re-read our site rules.



Thx

My apologies. I saw you removed them from my OP. I thought I had kept the price out of everything since, but my apologies if I accidentally put it in.