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  1. #443
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    IMO... that is easy to do... and PHM had a solution:

    NOBODY who is there now, gets to stay, NO exceptions!

    Easy-peasy... just start over with folks that are new, and as few old timers to pollute the waters!
    And as SOON as they are there... DEMAND a term limits law!
    My family and I are very involved with local politics and issues. We have helped get local folks elected, people who are conservative but never held office before. It is amazing to watch. They go in representing those of us who elected them and as time goes on they morph left. Something or somebody gets to them.

    So, you are right GA. Term limits are necessary. After all, we have term limits on the president.
    "No matter how thirsty your imagination, mirages contain no water"

  2. #444
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    IMO... a HUGE 'retiring' may be necessary to shift the norm away from 'business as usual' (corruption).

    Seems if enough of the 'good old boys (and girls) were retired at the SAME TIME...

    A new crowd may well move to the right... and the movement towards the middle or left, that Hugh mentioned above, may take a lot longer to happen!
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  3. #445
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    Am I better off? Of course, in fact everybody is better off. That includes the liberals or progressives or left wingers or whatever you want to call them. you see, if the progressives or democrats get power we will all lose our ability to make choices. In fact, we will move so far left that we can kiss the Bill of Rights goodbye. That applies to everybody including the very progressives who placed other progressives in power.

    Go ahead, vote away your republic, vote democratic party line. Oh what fools!
    "No matter how thirsty your imagination, mirages contain no water"

  4. #446
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    Almost every thread gets highjacked Lahrs at some point. It doesn't bother me because lively and informative debates result that are usually informative and interesting. I am sometimes amazed at where the conversations end up but that happens when you stir the minds of thinking people.
    The last subject above (term limits) is near and dear to me. Term limits should have part of the original constitution. Past time to make it happen!!!!!
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

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  6. #447
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    If Congress ran as the Founding Fathers intended there would be no need for term limits. The FF looked at being in Congress I’m much the same light as serving in the military. They saw the position as serving the needs of their district. Today’s stuffed suits have the attitude that they are overlords and we need to cater to their wishes.

  7. #448
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    Quote Originally Posted by BNME8EZ View Post
    If Congress ran as the Founding Fathers intended there would be no need for term limits. The FF looked at being in Congress I’m much the same light as serving in the military. They saw the position as serving the needs of their district. Today’s stuffed suits have the attitude that they are overlords and we need to cater to their wishes.
    What makes term Limits so elusive is that it will have to be forced on them. They don't want to let go of that golden goose. Same with the Lobbying system. Corruption is tough to root out. Certainly, they won't correct course themselves. I guess it's up to us to vote in new blood, letting them know what we expect. The long road.

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  9. #449
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    A constitutional convention of the states is the only way term limits will become law.
    No man can be both ignorant and free.
    Thomas Jefferson

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  11. #450
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    On a brighter note, the Dem Majority House is set to hold Slavery Reparations hearings next week.

    https://www.google.com/search?q=hous...w=1765&bih=946

  12. #451
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidadavis View Post
    83, what mistakes do you think I need to confess? I didn’t advocate for the Canadian system, nor have I ever claimed to know enough about it to make a fair comparison.

    My problem with you is that you keep hitting a screw with a hammer. Stop shouting the same numbers, even if they are correct it should be obvious I don’t get into the exact numbers (nor have I ever disputed yours, other than to say they are more complicated/integrated). It also wouldn’t hurt if you admitted a truly free market system would be a hard pill for the nation (average joes) to swallow. We are so far removed from it that it would be a massive colossal change... requiring a painful transition.

    And great, you admit healthcare is more complicated than what you have represented here... but saying it to GC/Gary in the past isn’t saying it to me.

    I guess in a nutshell... take a chill pill, lol.
    I hit a screw with a hammer? The cost of the Candian system is the fundamental building block after which other facts must be weighed against.

    I repeat these numbers over and over because ANY discussion afterwards is pointless unless that fact is understood.

    And all of that wasted time could have been avoided if GC and Gary clicked on links proving these fundamental facts.

    You came around at the end of me being pissed at GC again. And you think I need to chill because if it.

    These threads go no where productive because he keeps pulling us back to the starting gate.

    You trust Lahrs? You think he's an honest, informed guy with an open mind? You've seen him say several times in this thread, and others, the numbers are correct. He's looked at what I posted and did his own research. Something GC should have done years ago. I told GC on several occasions yo look at the links and search to find anything disputing these numbers. I've looked and can't find anything. If there is, I want to see them. He hasn't even looked. Maybe out of fear he'd have to admit he's wrong? Not sure.

    Good thing Lahrs did look and found nothing disputing the numbers as I have.

    Now GC is stuck on our system with me. See the above post. He wants to know about additional costs on our system due to the VA, Medicare, Medicaid, etc. All things I've acknowledged add into it.

    But nickle and diming down to the penny is the pointless muck and mire we are stuck in.

    Here's a quick answer to his latest inquiry. Which he's asked and I've answered a dozen times, BTW. The Candian system costs the average family $12k give or take based on some minor variables. I would pay about $16. That's for the single payer system alone. Add on top of that $3600 a year for a suplimental plan. 70% of Candians have one because it's needed. Add on top of that out of pocket expenses not covered by either. That can be $0 per year or a few thousand. Ask Lahrs about that reality. If I lived in Canada, this year I would be paying several thousand out of pocket. Canada says this number is 20% of all medical expenses are out of pocket. So if we add up what I would pay on average on Canada, it would be $16k plus the $3600 for the suplimental. That is $19600 per year. Every year at the bare miminum. Add on top of that any costs not covered by single payer or my suplimental. That number would be an average of something, but it's a highly individualized cost that would likely change from year to year. So let's just say I'm at $20k a year. That's a low estimate IMHO, but close enogh to be in the ballpark. Each year. Every year. Here is the USA my premium is $13200 a year. I also have a $1500 HSA wich I usually use 100% of. But it's a good estimate of out of pocket expenses. It's possible I could have a MAX out of pocket of $6k with my plan. So my average per year is around $14700. Let's say it's $15k on average per year to make it easy. So now Brian is asking about the additional money needed to fund the VA and Medicare, etc. Yup. There's that. Does it add up to the approx $5k additional Canada's system would cost me. Who knows. I'd guess no, but maybe.

    But that's not the point of me bringing up the numbers. To nickel and dime the numbers. First off, it's impossible to do so. It's an average calculation. It was a rough calculation to show both our systems are in the same ballpark. That's it. To get us away from the misinformation Gary and GC base all their opinions on. That Canada's system costs the average guy $300-800. Those are numbers they have been tossing out for years.

    And all they had to do was look.

    GC posts his circular insanity trying to disprove points I've never made. You came in on the tail end of the latest round of it, and tossed in your two cents that I've been unreasonable.

    Sorry, but getting pissed a grown man can't click a link and pull off his blinders for a second isn't unreasonable.

    A few months ago you had a tiff with another member. I caught in on the action after you both were well into it. And the first posts I read, you were a bit pissed. I could have jumped to conclusions not knowing the back story. I didn't. I went back to the beginning of your tiff with said member, and it became clear why your temper elevated.

    You jumped in when I gave an answer that possibly didn't make sense to you. Your question wasn't very clear. I may have answered a question you weren't asking. I actually wasn't even entirely sure if you were asking about our system or Canada's. But I took my best guess as to what you asked and gave an answer also based on that and the point GC and I were stuck on, again: The actual price of Canada's system. As usual. Because he refuses to look at the actual facts and listen to an honest guy like Lahrs(a genuine Candian).

    My frustration as to where he has dragged every healthcare debate is warrented. He's arguing nickels and dimes and points that I've not made. When my only point was, the costs in Canada are no where even close to what he and Gary were claiming. But admitting when wrong is not his strong suit.

    Yes, GC. Our system stinks and its expensive.

    Watch, he will still go on and on about "What about X?" in our system or "What about Y?" when that was never the point. The point was to clear the lie that Canada's system in only a few hundred dollars per month.

    Both systems stink. Why would we dump our system for a system that might stink slightly less? Let's come up with a better idea. But we can't even begin that conversation.

    Lahrs brought up Australia's system. I looked into it. Seems like the better choice. PHM brought up a national co-op separate from congress. That's an intriguing idea to chat about. But here we are again talking about $100 bucks here and $100 bucks there compared to Canada's system. He still won't stop even after Lahrs has tried to straighten him out a few times now.

    So I apologize for any frustration that went your way. I try to keep it directed towards the deserving party. If it went your way before your snarky comment yesterday, I didn't mean for that to happen.



    Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk
    “Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.”
    -Possibly said by Thomas Jefferson(but true even if he didn't)


    “What one generation tolerates, the next generation will embrace.”
    ― Definitely said by John Wesley


    "One out of 3 Democrat voters is just as stupid as the other two"
    -Said by me

  13. #452
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    Quote Originally Posted by WAYNE3298 View Post
    Almost every thread gets highjacked Lahrs at some point. It doesn't bother me because lively and informative debates result that are usually informative and interesting. I am sometimes amazed at where the conversations end up but that happens when you stir the minds of thinking people.
    The last subject above (term limits) is near and dear to me. Term limits should have part of the original constitution. Past time to make it happen!!!!!
    Agreed to all of the above. But I understand how some people don't like the way theads go sideways. I was a big part of that happening. So for those who hate when it happens.....my apologies. But I'm not sure how to prevent it. It seems to happen to most threads.

    Now back to the term limits topic. Oops, I mean "Are you doing better now than 4 years ago?" topic.

    Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk
    “Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.”
    -Possibly said by Thomas Jefferson(but true even if he didn't)


    “What one generation tolerates, the next generation will embrace.”
    ― Definitely said by John Wesley


    "One out of 3 Democrat voters is just as stupid as the other two"
    -Said by me

  14. #453
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    Quote Originally Posted by vin lashon View Post
    On a brighter note, the Dem Majority House is set to hold Slavery Reparations hearings next week.

    https://www.google.com/search?q=hous...w=1765&bih=946
    DOA in the senate...

    NO WAY Trump will even read it.

    Noise to pander to the base...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  15. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    DOA in the senate...

    NO WAY Trump will even read it.

    Noise to pander to the base...
    Agreed. And they will use that 'noise' to inflame their base against the Right. "we wanted it, but the Repubs killed it". This is what they spend our money on.

  16. #455
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    Quote Originally Posted by vin lashon View Post
    Agreed. And they will use that 'noise' to inflame their base against the Right. "we wanted it, but the Repubs killed it". This is what they spend our money on.
    Yeah, however after Trump baited them with the thing about:
    If I received information from a foreign government about my opponent...

    The left crawled all over that... stating that would be horrible if someone in politics did that!

    Yet they forgot Trump has irrefutable evidence THEY did it in the last election!

    Gonna be fun when the sparks start flying!
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

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