If I remember right phm has done some package units and some close coupled split systems. I know I’ve done some r12 to 134 conversions with no oil change the only one that went south was my old pickup, and it didn’t work when I started so no loss
Is there any ireal life ssues with R407c and not changing to POE oil? I haven't seen any
If I remember right phm has done some package units and some close coupled split systems. I know I’ve done some r12 to 134 conversions with no oil change the only one that went south was my old pickup, and it didn’t work when I started so no loss
Honeywell you can buy better but you cant pay more
I told my wife when i die to sell my fishing stuff for what its worth not what i told her i paid for it
407C needs POE
Non POE Pumps
For A/C NU-22
Med Temp MO-99
I haven't had any issues but I add 88.
I think on a long vertical rise, I would do the whole detailed conversion, simply so there's no reason to question the oil if theres an issue down the road.
Close-coupled systems , the velocity is so fast theres not a problem with oil return.
Having said that, if the system developed a leak and ran on low charge for a while, I don't know if the results would be more oil left in the evap or less or equal, due to misibility questions.
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A few years ago We had 1 pump fail after using 407 and SUPCO 88, (maybe 10 conversations altogether) after that never again.
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For mineral oil, 422B.
If you want 407C, wait for a compressor replacement with poe from the factory.
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2 Tim 3:16-17
RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
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There are additives that I have used for years on 407c conversions. As long as there is no acid in the system they work great Diversitech makes one. Diversitech 981 you do need to read and follow directions as well as purchase the tool for the can. I have never had any issues with it.
Someone mentioned Supco 88 how is it? That stuff showed up one day in my shop and was handwritten on my invoice from the supply house I figured they must want me to try it.
I have not tried the 88 or the diversitech, because there is too much on the line with these commercial customers. There is too frequent an opportunity to have an extra expense and a couple of guys tied up for several hours on a day when we're all out running service calls.
I have found it much easier to do what I detailed two posts above this, because after doing it that way for several years, I have not had a single issue.
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2 Tim 3:16-17
RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
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422B I believe is less efficient at higher ambient like the Mojave desert where I live. I do offer R22 still the cost exceeds the value of comfort IMO as the retrofits are not as efficient in this heat. If someone wants there house 72 no retrofit will get it there. But 78 407 works just fine
Supco 88 seems to help in 134a cap tube systems. Anytime I have to clear or replace a captube and dryer I add some. Have had good results so far as it seems to move the wax. To get it in the system I took an old zoom spout oiler cleaned well with acetone and stick the tube in the process stub and squeeze in a couple of ounces in a fractional hp compressor.
I should clarify, that as TB said, on bigger systems I would probably do everything exactly by the book. But for smaller ones it's worked just fine to convert with an/no additive.
The oil lubricates just fine. It's the return of that oil that can be a problem.
I like to add the 88 because then I'm not adding a scavenger like Poe to the mineral oil. So one can usually do without the suction filter then. (And the return trip to change that filter or remove it.)
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Only thing I ever saw that looked like a no go with MO and HFC was if there was a receiver.
Seen it put in with no oil change on more than a few though.
What about issues with topping off r22 with 407c when they are low on charge? Any issues yall know of?
Just legal issues, and calculating superheat issues
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2 Tim 3:16-17
RSES CMS, HVAC Electrical Specialist
Member, IAEI
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I am in full agreement that it is not a good practice but it seems to be a very common thing in my area and not many people here think there's a problem with it. Other than being mentioned in the IMC and by the EPA I dont know that there are any clear rules on if it's illegal or not since I dont hear much about anyone getting in legal trouble for it, mostly just their boss or a fellow tech telling them they should not do it. Seems to me mixing has been happening for a while with not much legal action to stop it. Opinions? And not trying to instigate a argument icy78, just asking questions that I can seem to find clear answers on anywhere else.
Theres legally allowed and morally allowed.
Seeing how there is no Freon Police forget legally. Same as dumping a charge. Not legit but fine all the time.
Mixing refrigerants just screws those of us that are trying to do the right thing. Especially when that mix winds up in my recovery tank!