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  1. #118
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    every other modern country has socialized medicine, spends less on health care than we do, and has higher life expectancy. how can you argue with these facts?

  2. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by rschwartz33 View Post
    every other modern country has socialized medicine, spends less on health care than we do, and has higher life expectancy. how can you argue with these facts?
    Facts don't matter here unless they are facts from Fox News or conservative talk radio. From what I've learned here all my positive socialized medicine experience must have been the result of a fever dream as a result of the substandard care I received.

  3. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sooty View Post
    Facts don't matter here unless they are facts from Fox News or conservative talk radio. From what I've learned here all my positive socialized medicine experience must have been the result of a fever dream as a result of the substandard care I received.
    Yep. It is quite arrogant of Brian to claim he is more informed on Canadian healthcare than everyone in that country without ever speaking to a single Canadian. All of his information comes from his selective Google searches. And since he is not very good at math, they could tell him whatever he wanted to hear and he would suck it up and pass it on.

    What I have learned is when my opinion opposes that of an entire cross-section of a country, my opinion needs to be reevaluated. But not with Brian, he's just smarter than them.

    We have socialized medicine in this country that works fine and has satisfied customers. Its Medicare, where they pay less per procedure, do not compete to keep prices low, no not use a "free market" to keep prices low, prevent bankruptcies, kicked out the insurance companies, insure everyone equally, has one plan that fits all, do not require an informed customer to take advantage of it, etc. But somehow that is not an example of socialized medicine that our govt runs just fine. Amazing! It is pure dishonestly.

    So to Bian, all Canadians and everyone over 65 is this country are delusional.

  4. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Yep. It is quite arrogant of Brian to claim he is more informed on Canadian healthcare than everyone in that country without ever speaking to a single Canadian. All of his information comes from his selective Google searches. And since he is not very good at math, they could tell him whatever he wanted to hear and he would suck it up and pass it on.

    What I have learned is when my opinion opposes that of an entire cross-section of a country, my opinion needs to be reevaluated. But not with Brian, he's just smarter than them.

    We have socialized medicine in this country that works fine and has satisfied customers. Its Medicare, where they pay less per procedure, do not compete to keep prices low, no not use a "free market" to keep prices low, prevent bankruptcies, kicked out the insurance companies, insure everyone equally, has one plan that fits all, do not require an informed customer to take advantage of it, etc. But somehow that is not an example of socialized medicine that our govt runs just fine. Amazing! It is pure dishonestly.

    So to Bian, all Canadians and everyone over 65 is this country are delusional.
    Oh Canadian healthcare isn't perfect (I doubt any system is) by any means but the fact that it is instant career suicide for any politician thinking of tinkering with it is all you need to know about how satisfied people are with it. Really for as often as you see the topic discussed you would think everyone is spending their entire lives going in and out of hospitals when mercifully most people aren't. The Canadian system works well enough for what it is and while people will whine and complain about it they don't want it replaced and certainly not with the U.S system.

  5. Likes Lahrs liked this post.
  6. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sooty View Post
    Oh Canadian healthcare isn't perfect (I doubt any system is) by any means but the fact that it is instant career suicide for any politician thinking of tinkering with it is all you need to know about how satisfied people are with it. Really for as often as you see the topic discussed you would think everyone is spending their entire lives going in and out of hospitals when mercifully most people aren't. The Canadian system works well enough for what it is and while people will whine and complain about it they don't want it replaced and certainly not with the U.S system.
    i remember talking to a Canadian about your healthcare system. He said he was astonished how Americans can be bankrupted over healthcare costs. It was something Canadians would not allow in their country, but we are perfectly ok with it.

    Whatever it takes to keep our corrupt capitalism churning because we enjoy the trickle-down from it.

  7. #123
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    Does any one know what the government cost is per person to be on medicare ?

  8. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by 54885488 View Post
    Does any one know what the government cost is per person to be on medicare ?
    The US spends more public money than Canada on Healthcare. Weird.

    https://www.visualcapitalist.com/u-s...sweden-canada/

  9. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    The US spends more public money than Canada on Healthcare. Weird.

    https://www.visualcapitalist.com/u-s...sweden-canada/
    It could be because every working person contributed to healthcare in Canada. Not here.

  10. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    It could be because every working person contributed to healthcare in Canada. Not here.
    I don't follow your logic.

    Every person in the US who pays taxes is also contributing to government spending on Healthcare. No?

  11. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    i remember talking to a Canadian about your healthcare system. He said he was astonished how Americans can be bankrupted over healthcare costs. It was something Canadians would not allow in their country, but we are perfectly ok with it.

    Whatever it takes to keep our corrupt capitalism churning because we enjoy the trickle-down from it.
    I'm sure it happens here as well because not everything is covered or can be covered but it certainly is the exception. When you do see news reports of somebody with some bizarre disease that isn't covered the reaction tends to be "well we should be able to pay for that" or "why isn't covered?!". A cruise missile costs $1.5 million and the U.S has no problem firing those by the dozen to vaporize a camel in the desert but it can't find the money for healthcare that is what I can't understand.

  12. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    I don't follow your logic.

    Every person in the US who pays taxes is also contributing to government spending on Healthcare. No?
    I contribute to govt spending on healthcare and not a dime of it goes toward my healthcare costs. In Canada those taxes will cover 80% of everybody's healthcare costs. They also all get the same policy. We don't.

    The two system are very difficult to compare because they are SO different. It is like trying to compare Social Security to a 401K. Or like comparing Medicare to regular health insurance. Or like comparing privately purchased health insurance to employer purchases/subsidized health insurance. Only a very sharp math whiz could do it...and that would not be Brian or any of the so called study groups he quotes because nobody reading the study would know if they are including ALL the components to make it a true comparison. I also don't believe them when they try to account for every dollar a Canadian spends on his healthcare. How do they account for every dollar we spend on our healthcare...impossible! There are too many ways to deceive the person you're talking to. Again, Brian being right up there on the list because they are telling him something he wants to hear.

    With Canada paying far less per procedure. Less and delayed medical treatment. 80% of their healthcare cost does not get marked up by health insurance companies. No 10-20% profit being charges by insurance companies. No overhead being charged for by insurance companies. No fat salaries being charged by insurance companies. No politicians or executives are getting rich of their healthcare coffers.

    Otoh, the US pays the rip off middleman/insurance companies, we pay far more per procedure, we get those procedures done tomorrow, we have the high-up in those companies getting HUGE salaries and bonuses, we have huge profits and overhead of those hospitals, insurance companies and big pharma, we see a doctor to pop every pimple...tomorrow. We run tons of unnecessary tests. And Brian says Canadians are paying something similar to what we pay? Well if they are, where is all that money going because it is not going to all the fat bastards in that industry that we are paying.

  13. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    I contribute to govt spending on healthcare and not a dime of it goes toward my healthcare costs. In Canada those taxes will cover 80% of everybody's healthcare costs. They also all get the same policy. We don't.

    The two system are very difficult to compare because they are SO different. It is like trying to compare Social Security to a 401K. Or like comparing Medicare to regular health insurance. Or like comparing privately purchased health insurance to employer purchases/subsidized health insurance. Only a very sharp math whiz could do it...and that would not be Brian or any of the so called study groups he quotes because nobody reading the study would know if they are including ALL the components to make it a true comparison. I also don't believe them when they try to account for every dollar a Canadian spends on his healthcare. How do they account for every dollar we spend on our healthcare...impossible! There are too many ways to deceive the person you're talking to. Again, Brian being right up there on the list because they are telling him something he wants to hear.

    With Canada paying far less per procedure. Less and delayed medical treatment. 80% of their healthcare cost does not get marked up by health insurance companies. No 10-20% profit being charges by insurance companies. No overhead being charged for by insurance companies. No fat salaries being charged by insurance companies. No politicians or executives are getting rich of their healthcare coffers.

    Otoh, the US pays the rip off middleman/insurance companies, we pay far more per procedure, we get those procedures done tomorrow, we have the high-up in those companies getting HUGE salaries and bonuses, we have huge profits and overhead of those hospitals, insurance companies and big pharma, we see a doctor to pop every pimple...tomorrow. We run tons of unnecessary tests. And Brian says Canadians are paying something similar to what we pay? Well if they are, where is all that money going because it is not going to all the fat bastards in that industry that we are paying.
    GC, the link I provided indicating the US spends more public money than Canada is Per capita! Not per recipient of government provided healthcare.

    The fact that 'not a dime' of your contribution benefits you is an entirely different conversation. You are getting bent over.

    My government spends less than yours, per capita, yet everyone here enjoys basic healthcare coverage. Crazy!!

    You guys aren't getting value for your money. I think you and Brian agree on this point. But you differ on what you think is the best solution. I offer no solution or judgment, I don't live there.

  14. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahrs View Post
    GC, the link I provided indicating the US spends more public money than Canada is Per capita! Not per recipient of government provided healthcare.

    The fact that 'not a dime' of your contribution benefits you is an entirely different conversation. You are getting bent over.

    My government spends less than yours, per capita, yet everyone here enjoys basic healthcare coverage. Crazy!!

    You guys aren't getting value for your money. I think you and Brian agree on this point. But you differ on what you think is the best solution. I offer no solution or judgment, I don't live there.
    How about this question. What would be the reason for your country to be so opposed to adopting our private healthcare system and our country being so opposed to adopting yours? I would assume both counties consist of intelligent people.

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