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  1. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by crab master View Post
    "Better" all in the eyes of the beholder, like "Friends don't let friends Lon." Just saying...

    A good coder/programmer in their 'familiar' language will almost always do a better job than using an unfamiliar language. Issue at hand comes into 'higher' level security and such challenges. Popularity is also a problem, recall early Apple adopters claims of never being hacked, no $ as not enough base for it to be worthwhile, then...

    Proprietary has it's place...just awaiting the day BACnet gets a bigger black eye due to lack of security and in turn some thing else comes into play. But hey Modbus same story, yet it's still strong. Recall years ago, likley a decade plus watching a generator get destroyed at I think at an INL test, when a hacker got into it (Modbus control) and let it over run, disable sensors/whatever so the engine blew.
    The generator thing you refer to was an intentional demonstration put on by Department of Homeland Security. They had a generator tech 'dial in' an intentionally blow up the generator, and filmed it all as a scare tactic. Pretty expensive video. That being said, BACnet has nothing to do with security. It's all up to the IT department that operates the network. I can put a BACnet system in a building with default passwords, and if the IT department is worth a crap, it will never have an issue, because access to teh system will be restricted by the owners network.d As a controls installer, you will walk away from this building for years, maybe forever. No one should rely on you, yrru system, or anything you do for security; hackers find new ways in every day, so updates are critical. Security should be laid in the hands of the IT department. Even simple Vlans, and VPNs will provide formidable security. IT will maintain these, update these, and that's the key to security.


    P.S. - Google "Stuxnet worm" - a bit of malware that destroyed a bunch of Iranian Nuclear Centrifuges - that were run by a proprietary system. Interesting read.

  2. #41
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Aware of details on both (all old news) and would bet Struxnet was designed by likes of CIA/SIS once they knew what system IRAN had, or even where in on all upfront sales for product to make sure they had a line on the proprietary end, but how many end users/integrator's even take 'basic' steps to protect?

    BACnet (whatever that better thing is) makes things easy to a fault for system protection. When you can bring things in with plain English/local language with a simple scan for anyone to read what point it is, makes deviants lives much easier. Just like the border wall, agree or disagree, every roadblock/wall put up, minimizes those who are willing to challenge. Just like an open door vs a closed door, more people will readily walk thru an open door vs. a closed door, even if it's glass and they can see thru. We can all make excuses, it was intentional, the normal hacker doesn't look for/know that, not worth the cost, hackers are coming up with new ways every day...heard a great comment by a high school computer teacher "Among the most dangerous of hackers on easy systems, a bored high school kid(s) with decent computer knowledge."
    "How it can be considered "Open" is beyond me. Calling it "voyeur-ed" would be more accurate." pka LeroyMac, SkyIsBlue, fka Freddy-B, Mongo, IndyBlue
    BIG Government = More Dependents
    "Any 'standard' would be great if it didn't get bastardised by corporate self interest." MatrixTransform
    My 5 yr old son "Dad, Siri is not very smart when there's no internet."


  3. #42
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
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    Milwaukee, Wi
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    The reality is, none of this technology matters until it gets wide scale adoption in the spec. The spec will continue to rule whether technology gets adopted or not. That's why on the Macro level we are still putting in the exact same systems we always have.

  4. #43
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    923
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    Thread Starter
    There’s a control co. In British Columbia who’s building a demo site using this.
    https://developer.ibm.com/recipes/author/watson-8/

  5. #44
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
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    USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dilp172 View Post
    There’s a control co. In British Columbia who’s building a demo site using this.
    https://developer.ibm.com/recipes/author/watson-8/
    More good PR for cloud services, including IBM's.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...-idUSKCN1TR1DK
    Propagating the formula. http://www.noagendashow.com/

  6. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    Just like the web, there'll be a "dark" cloud and it'll bring a downpour with it.

    kontrol out
    "Good" - Jocko
    "Open is as open does." - Forrest Gump
    "Can't we all just get a Lon?" - Garry Jack
    "BACnet: integration or interrogation?" - The Janitor
    "Interoperability? You can't handle interoperability!" - Nathan R. Jessup
    “What’s that? Aaa… open protocols? Don’t talk about…. open protocols? Are you kidding me? Open protocols? I just hope we can hardwire an interface!” - Jim Mora Watch it here!

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