Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 29

Thread: Solx energy

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Newbury Berkshire
    Posts
    493
    Post Likes

    Solx energy

    Chaps


    has anyone got any real world experience of these solar systems which appear to be making great energy savings

    https://www.solxenergy.com/

    I'm not associated with them as yet but could become a dealer so I'm not pushing it!

    I live in a sunny island so if it works then I'm on a winner

    Richard
    Tenerife

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    167
    Post Likes
    This system is a fraud. Adding heat to compressed refrigerant before the refrigerant enters the condenser would only reduce the cooling performance. Any heat added to the gas would only increase the superheat, which would have to be rejected by the condenser coil. Between this, and the fact that there will be some undesired pressure drop from the added piping length, will actually reduce subcooling.

    The only good news is that unless this is a very large solar collector, the amount of heat added to the gas would be very small. The gas moves at very high velocity, so would not be able to collect many additional btu's unless the collector were to be extremely large.

    I can see where their faulty hypothesis may have originated. There is a direct relationship between the pressure to which a compressor raises a gas and the discharge temperature of the compressor. However, adding heat to the gas after the fact does not add pressure to the gas in a circulating system. It would only do so in a closed container. Even if it did add any pressure, that pressure would still have to be overcome by the compressor, so no work load removed from the compressor.

    I guarantee that they will not be able to show you any testing done to the requirements of a recognized testing standard that back up their claims.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes

    Two units installed

    Purchased two Solx units with two new variable speed 4 ton ac units and installed. Units ran two months. Comparable electric bills from a year ago (2018 vs 2019). Usage is the same. Hence the bill is the same.

    Contacted Solx they blame the installer and new AC units. They claim no responsibility and offered no assistance. These Solx thermo condensers do not reduce the electric bill 40% to 60% as claimed.

    Keep in mind, Both AC units that were replaced were single stage. One ran with a hard start for 7 years. The other unit ran with an leaky evaporator for 2 summers. The performance is the same compared to the new installation and electric bill is the same.

    I am happy to share the experience and documents with anyone. So far, it appears the tactic is to use a (30%) government tax credit to sell something that does not perform. Someone belongs in jail. I have secured an attorney and contacts the local television station.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    2
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by Needcoldair View Post
    Purchased two Solx units with two new variable speed 4 ton ac units and installed. Units ran two months. Comparable electric bills from a year ago (2018 vs 2019). Usage is the same. Hence the bill is the same.

    Contacted Solx they blame the installer and new AC units. They claim no responsibility and offered no assistance. These Solx thermo condensers do not reduce the electric bill 40% to 60% as claimed.

    Keep in mind, Both AC units that were replaced were single stage. One ran with a hard start for 7 years. The other unit ran with an leaky evaporator for 2 summers. The performance is the same compared to the new installation and electric bill is the same.

    I am happy to share the experience and documents with anyone. So far, it appears the tactic is to use a (30%) government tax credit to sell something that does not perform. Someone belongs in jail. I have secured an attorney and contacts the local television station.
    Hello,
    this is disappointing to hear. I am from the Solx group, however based in Europe. It is surprising, because we have plenty of installations running and delivering the results. But i am also honest to have encountered also "bad" installations having your problem been mentioned. From the terminology i assume you are based in the US. Can you please forward me more about that installation ? The savings require a proper unit, sizing (not too large and no too small) and perfect installation. If problems arise, they are often due to insufficient charging of refrigerant. But there can be also other reasons. We would like to find out why it does not work at your site. Or have you already contacted your installer and a SolX sales person ?
    Please forward us the information (info@solxenergy.com) and we would want to proceed with the correction.

    I want to comment on coolcoil: The secret of ThermX lies in a quicker phasechange from gas to liquid. It has nothing to do with pressure, as the measurements indicate clearly. Of course the condenser has to remove more heat, because the refrigerant gots hotter after the panel. The measurements show definitely an increase of 20K and more, despite the fears of "coolcoil". Of course the number of panels must match with the size of A/C or refrigeration. The condenser can easily remove the larger heat, as for a radiator: the hotter the water in the more heat is transferred without any loss. The formula is very easy and relates only to the delta T water in - water out or refrigerant in - refrigerant out. And now an effect takes place, the so called Mpemba effect, whcih accelerates the speed of phase change. This has to do with the Van-der-Waals forces between the atoms of the molecule. Water and much more refrigerant act as Dipoles and are heavily subject to the Van-der Waals forces. As a result the subcooling is larger, yielding to less flash gas after the expansion valve in the evaporator and subsequently to more liquid content in the "refrigerant spray" in the evaporator - rising the cooling capacity in the evaporator or reducing the compressor's speed/consumption at original cooling capacity.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    2
    Post Likes
    Hello Needcoldair,

    You and I spoke at length about this situation. We both agreed that there needed to be extenuating circumstances that were to be explored. ThermX is not, under any circumstances, responsible for making a new 20 SEER inverter A/C unit, run similar to a 12 SEER unit like your previous systems were. With or without ThermX, your new units should be providing relief. We did not blame the installers. However, you did state that you had several challenges with them, and were quite perturbed with the sales and install process (of which we had nothing to do with.) You were supposed to get new duct work, which you stated was only partially done. You had problems with the thermostats, etc. It was and still is my recommendation that the installer put energy monitoring on the systems, to verify their actual kWh consumption. I reached out to them and told them you were agreeable to this. This will allow a separation of their consumption from your overall bill. As you stated, at the time of installation, an amp meter registered a very low reading. You also stated that your house is getting colder than it ever did. I do not doubt that your bill has not changed, but I also have no doubt that the results of monitoring will show that it is not just the systems that are responsible for that. You also stated that your billing is likely to be a predicted/averaged and probably incorrect bill, which is why I suggested you get an Eyedro monitor for your whole home, to compare your household usage to what you're being billed for, for piece of mind. I am genuinely sympathetic to your situation, but the technology is not at fault, and I believe you know that based on your personal understanding and recognition of the concept.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    2
    Post Likes
    Needcoldair,

    Some of the statements you made are written emphatically, and are factually incorrect. "We" did not use any tactics. Nor can you say, "These Solx thermo condensers do not reduce the electric bill 40% to 60%, as stated." Your system(s) may not functioning optimally, and we don't yet know if that's true or why. And to say that we (SolX) did not offer you assistance is also incorrect. A 1 hour call in an effort to come up with some solutions is assistance. We would appreciate if you'd remove this thread entirely, or at least until all efforts have been made to rectify it. There is harm being done here that is not fairly placed.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    167
    Post Likes
    Quote Originally Posted by solx-eu View Post
    I want to comment on coolcoil: The secret of ThermX lies in a quicker phasechange from gas to liquid. It has nothing to do with pressure, as the measurements indicate clearly. Of course the condenser has to remove more heat, because the refrigerant gots hotter after the panel. The measurements show definitely an increase of 20K and more, despite the fears of "coolcoil". Of course the number of panels must match with the size of A/C or refrigeration. The condenser can easily remove the larger heat, as for a radiator: the hotter the water in the more heat is transferred without any loss. The formula is very easy and relates only to the delta T water in - water out or refrigerant in - refrigerant out. And now an effect takes place, the so called Mpemba effect, whcih accelerates the speed of phase change. This has to do with the Van-der-Waals forces between the atoms of the molecule. Water and much more refrigerant act as Dipoles and are heavily subject to the Van-der Waals forces. As a result the subcooling is larger, yielding to less flash gas after the expansion valve in the evaporator and subsequently to more liquid content in the "refrigerant spray" in the evaporator - rising the cooling capacity in the evaporator or reducing the compressor's speed/consumption at original cooling capacity.
    Just go back to selling the 100 mile-per-gallon carburetor that Big Oil is paying billions to the auto companies to suppress or the patches that you stick on your circuit panel to cut electricity consumption by 45%.

    My job is to evaluate new HVAC technologies and stuff like this comes across my desk all the time. Your claims that heating the gas improve the ability to condense are ludicrous for two reasons:

    1) While it is true that the dipole moment of most refrigerants is temperature dependent, any gain you would get from heating the gas goes away as it goes back down to temperature.

    2) Even if what you said was true, you would need a solar panel the size of a house with sun-following reflectors to heat compressor discharge gas that is already more than 200 degrees F up by another 36 degrees (20K).

    Back when the original post was made, I spent about 90 minutes going through your website to try to find anything to substantiate your claims. You link to no peer-reviewed research of your product or the concept under which it operates. For that matter, you show no research of any kind other than unsubstantiated claims from satisfied users that are not found anywhere else on the internet. I could find no independent verification of any of your claims.

    If your product were providing even 25% of the results you claim, people would be shouting it from the rooftops. You wouldn't even be posting here, as your company would have been already purchased by one of the big HVAC companies.

    But just for fun, I went back to your website and found this document that purports to explain how the process works. It says exactly what I said that it would in my first post - adding heat to the system replaces the work of the compressor. Others are invited to read it for themselves:

    https://www.solxenergy.com/images/so...Works-2019.pdf

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes
    Customers do not complain if satisfied. So far no satisfaction. I called the electric company regarding my usage and billing.
    The usage is monitored in real time. I see no sense in adding an energy monitor. The ducting was tested. No leaks.
    Both AC units are 2 months old. I spent a sizeable amount of money for improved performance and reduced electric bill.
    So far my 14 year old single stage 10 SEER units out performed the new equipment with Solx solar condensers on my roof top. Expectations are not being satisfied nor met. If Solx can fix the problem, improve performance and reduce the electric bill then I will remove the negative post, promote your product and become satisfied with no complaints. Until otherwise, I am very unhappy customer

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes
    Suggesting the use of a Eyedro monitor is not offering assistance. This is only a way to redirect responsibility.
    The electric company monitors the usage in real time and updates by the hour. No point in in adding the energy monitor.
    Suggesting Solx is not responsible for the new AC units is another way redirect responsibility and not to address the issue. The comparison is made between new units installed in spring of 2019 vs. 14 year old crippled units using an evaporator that leaked. Your comments above do not assist wi but rather shifting the responsibility. Sizing formulas need to be presented along with pressure / temperature data with and without Solx units . As to date, your exclusive rep and Solx
    are unable to provide the data. The goal is to fold, (1) install equipment that performs , (2) reduce the electric bill. o far neither occured.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes
    I am giving this less than 30 days. If I do not see real results after the next billing then I will be re-sending the loan.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes
    Suggesting the use of a Eyedro monitor is not offering assistance. This is only a way to redirect responsibility. The electric company monitors the usage in real time and updates by the hour. No point in in adding the energy monitor. Suggesting Solx is not responsible for the new AC units is another way to redirect responsibility and not to address the issue. The comparison is made between new units installed in spring of 2019 with Sol X installed vs. 14 year old crippled units using an evaporator that leaked. Your comments above do not assist but rather shift the responsibility. Sizing formulas need to be presented along with pressure / temperature data with and without Solx units . As to date, your exclusive rep and Solx are unable to provide the data. The goal is twofold, (1) install equipment that performs , (2) reduce the electric bill. So far neither occurred. I should have saved my money and continued with the 14 yr. old crippled units.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    13
    Post Likes
    I am giving the installation less than 30 days. If I do not see real results after the next electric billing then I will be re-sending (disputing) the loan. This will become an issue with bank - doubtful they will provide loans in the future with equipment that does not work.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    2
    Post Likes
    Beside the issues by needcoldair, which need help, and can rely in inproper sizing or inproper charging, i can not agree with coolcoil:

    Dear "coolcoi", you base your assumptions only on your experience and calculations. I am myslef a PhD in Science and there is one basic rule:
    Make your hypothesis - proove your hypothesis by proper readings and make sure you are measuring correctly - then and only then derive your judgement.
    So far, your statements are your personal hypotheses:
    Where are your measurements to proove them ? Share them and make clear to all, what and how you HAVE measured. Which equipment did you use ?
    The Solx groups around the world have several measurements, carried out by the clients (like Mercedes Banz and Toyota) to proove the savings.
    Or do you think their engineers and some univsersities involved are all dumber than You and cna not measure ?

    Identify please and the SOLX people will happily give you access to installs where you can put on your gauges and test
    Just by judging with your opinion and providing no proof - it stays what it is - your personal theory.

    I agree the effect responsible is not that easy to understand. But i have pointed it already out and do no need to repeat it here.
    The effect of Solx is a chemical effect, not a thermodynamic one. Unfortunately some refrigeration engineers think, the smallest element is a gas or fluid, run their commonly known formulas, base everything on the Mollier diagramm and completely ignore, that behind all the formulas in thermodynamics there is always chemical stuff going on. Phase change which is that important in DX systems, is a chemical process on the basies of Van-der Waals forces. For understanding thermodynamics in depth you have to look into chemistry. Ignoring that will never open the eyes.

    A similar companion of that is the Mpemba effect, stating exactly that: The phase change of water, which is a dipole, and not as strong as refrigerants, finishes phase change quicker, when the process starts at higher temeprature than the same amount of water with a colder temeprature. There are hundreds of videos in the Net proving that. Unfortunately there fly around many theories for it and which are wrong, as clear experiments from several others show. All these theories never went into chemistry and never took a deeper look in what is really happening at the phase change, because it is very complicated. But all empirical data for the Mpemba effect shows: It's there and you can proove it repeatedly. Most just have the wrong theory for it.

    Or you can continue to argue as the church did for hundreds of years: The sun goes around the earth and the earth is a disk - because they never measured it and were not open for new ideas.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •