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Thread: Migration

  1. #14
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    Insulate it. Problem solved.

  2. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by pecmsg View Post
    Wouldn't the liquid start warming up somewhere?
    It melts about half way to the coil. How much energy do you suppose it's wasting. If there is a slight natural flow thru the evap.

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  3. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spitz View Post
    How much energy do you suppose it's wasting. If there is a slight natural flow thru the evap.

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    A Bit!

    Ive seen that with chilled water

  4. #17
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    I think I'll close the service valves this weekend when it warms up. Maybe pull the disconnect so I don't forget I closed them

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  5. #18
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    What you have here is an example of how a heat pipe works, The condenser is in a cold environment above the evaporator, which is below in a warm basement area. The refrigerant vapor in the system migrates from the warm to the cold and condenses to a liquid, then by gravity flows toward the evaporator...all with no pressure drop involved.

    From an energy standpoint, the temperature difference sets up the migration and gravity enables the flow. The migration is absorbing heat from the basement and rejecting it to the atmosphere. To stop the flow, add a solenoid valve.

    If you insulate the liquid line to prevent frost formation, the frost will still buildup further downstream toward the evaporator, so there is still a waste of energy.

    The amount of dehumidification required would depend on what the temperature of the evaporating liquid is. All we know now is it has to be somewhere between -23 Deg F and +32 Deg F. In any case, the solenoid would be the way to solve the problem and not simply attacking a symptom

  6. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by icemeister View Post
    What you have here is an example of how a heat pipe works, The condenser is in a cold environment above the evaporator, which is below in a warm basement area. The refrigerant vapor in the system migrates from the warm to the cold and condenses to a liquid, then by gravity flows toward the evaporator...all with no pressure drop involved.

    From an energy standpoint, the temperature difference sets up the migration and gravity enables the flow. The migration is absorbing heat from the basement and rejecting it to the atmosphere. To stop the flow, add a solenoid valve.

    If you insulate the liquid line to prevent frost formation, the frost will still buildup further downstream toward the evaporator, so there is still a waste of energy.

    The amount of dehumidification required would depend on what the temperature of the evaporating liquid is. All we know now is it has to be somewhere between -23 Deg F and +32 Deg F. In any case, the solenoid would be the way to solve the problem and not simply attacking a symptom
    Don't you miss this weather?

  7. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by pecmsg View Post
    Don't you miss this weather?
    I haven't lived where it gets cold for nearly 40 years, so I've become so intolerant of the cold no amount of clothing could keep me warm in such conditions.

    Back in Florida I couldn't work when it got much below 50 Deg F. Here it never gets much below 70 Deg F.

    No, I really don't miss the cold one bit.

  8. #21
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    -27f air temp this morning. 40s and rain this weekend.

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  9. #22
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    Hi ice! With a -27*F the press at the cond unit is about 20psi while the indoor temp is about 65ish*F and that is about 290psi. Thats what I was thinking.

  10. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechmanTerry View Post
    Hi ice! With a -27*F the press at the cond unit is about 20psi while the indoor temp is about 65ish*F and that is about 290psi. Thats what I was thinking.
    Free cooling............

    Now its a chargeable service call!

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  12. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechmanTerry View Post
    Hi ice! With a -27*F the press at the cond unit is about 20psi while the indoor temp is about 65ish*F and that is about 290psi. Thats what I was thinking.
    OK...but with the heat pipe both the evaporator and the condenser would be at the same pressure and at saturation. We can't predict what that pressure would be without know all the conditions and a lot about the coils. I would guess closer lower than the mean temperature because there would be more heat transfer potential with the OD coil due to its size and likelihood of more airflow (wind).

  13. #25
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    I'm confused, why would the liquid in the condenser or the vapor in the condenser even want to move (migrate) towards a evaporator on top of a running furnace ?

  14. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by VTP99 View Post
    I'm confused, why would the liquid in the condenser or the vapor in the condenser even want to move (migrate) towards a evaporator on top of a running furnace ?
    It doesn't.......It wants to migrate to the frozen condenser, that's the -20°liquid flowing toward the evap as the vapor warms and seeks a cooler place!

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