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  1. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by royc View Post
    I may like to agree with you, but since you and me are males and don't have babies, I don't think its our business what a woman decides. I'm going to leave such decision to woman, whether I like it or not, is not the point.

    But then again, males have always wanting to tell woman what to do, nothing new here.

    I wonder how much we care about babies getting killed by our soldiers overseas. If it wasn't for my mother trying hard for us to stay alive, with massive amount of bombs falling on us, I wouldn't be here talking.

    Seems everyone is so upset cause some woman make heart braking decisions at times. The only male person that may have a say so is the husband. Otherwise, you males need to stay the hell out of it, its hard enough for females to make such a decision as is. And those that don't care, don't deserve a child to begin with.

    Roy
    So Roy do you believe in abortion even after birth like the New York law and that of several other states? That is pure evil IMHO. Do you have any boundaries on abortion what so ever?

    I sure hope so otherwise you have no humanity IMHO. Please define what would be unacceptable if there is one in your mind? Thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."

    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Sen. Barry Goldwater

  2. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by glennac View Post
    So Roy do you believe in abortion even after birth like the New York law and that of several other states? That is pure evil IMHO. Do you have any boundaries on abortion what so ever?

    I sure hope so otherwise you have no humanity IMHO. Please define what would be unacceptable if there is one in your mind? Thank you very much
    if you read the first part of my post it should be obvious that I don't like it.

    Just because I don't like something, doesn't give me the right to dictate to a female what she should do what is within here, once its outside normal born, is another story.

    Roy
    A man is no less a slave because he is allowed to choose a new master once in a term of years.
    Lysander Spooner

  3. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey View Post
    I differ from some of you in my opinions in regard to abortion - but this, as well as Cuomo's recent work, are truly effed up.

    Just to remind: I am against all abortion but I'm willing to compromise in favor of the woman's God given right to self-determination at: first 90 days only. After that it's too close to being able to live without it's mother. For me anyway.

    But these disgusting jerks should be run out of office. And then out of town on a rail. No civilized person with more than a few working brain cells can possibly agree with them.

    Although: maybe it's like they say - there is Good in everything. Maybe, finally, a majority will recognize, and react against the fact; that the pendulum has swung too far.

    PHM
    ------------
    I'm Curious Poodle, .....

    Where in The Scriptures is written that God Said:

    "Go Forth & Abort, that which inconveniences You, cuz' You can't stop "F-ing around"!" ????
    Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you, that you may be no priest to me. Because you have forgotten your God’s law, I will also forget your children.


    "You've got to Stand for Something or You'll fall for anything" (A. Tippin)


    Mat_15:24 But he answered, “I wasn’t sent to anyone but the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

  4. #69
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    DavidB, curious how you interpret Exodus 21 in regards to abortion: specifically verses 22 and 23? I get my moral compass from many sources so please don't assume I am pro-abortion, but to me those verses most directly address abortion, and my interpretation is that the Bible is saying abortion is the choice of the husband/wife.

  5. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey View Post
    Good point - Michael Jackson dressed in whiteface for twenty years and that never bothered anyone.

    PHM
    ---------
    Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you, that you may be no priest to me. Because you have forgotten your God’s law, I will also forget your children.


    "You've got to Stand for Something or You'll fall for anything" (A. Tippin)


    Mat_15:24 But he answered, “I wasn’t sent to anyone but the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

  6. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidadavis View Post
    DavidB, curious how you interpret Exodus 21 in regards to abortion: specifically verses 22 and 23? I get my moral compass from many sources so please don't assume I am pro-abortion, but to me those verses most directly address abortion, and my interpretation is that the Bible is saying abortion is the choice of the husband/wife.
    Exo 21:22 “If men fight and hurt a pregnant woman so that she gives birth prematurely, and yet no harm follows, he shall be surely fined as much as the woman’s husband demands and the judges allow.
    Exo 21:23 But if any harm follows, then you must take life for life,
    Exo 21:24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,
    Exo 21:25 burning for burning, wound for wound, and bruise for bruise.


    Davida, ... The Unjustified taking of a Life is Murder.

    Ecc 3:1 For everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven:
    Ecc 3:2 a time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
    Ecc 3:3 a time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
    Ecc 3:4 a time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
    Ecc 3:5 a time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
    Ecc 3:6 a time to seek, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
    Ecc 3:7 a time to tear, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
    Ecc 3:8 a time to love, and a time to hate; a time for war, and a time for peace.

    Jer 1:4 Now Yahweh’s word came to me, saying,
    Jer 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you. Before you were born, I sanctified you. I have appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
    Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you, that you may be no priest to me. Because you have forgotten your God’s law, I will also forget your children.


    "You've got to Stand for Something or You'll fall for anything" (A. Tippin)


    Mat_15:24 But he answered, “I wasn’t sent to anyone but the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

  7. #72
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    DavidB, that is kind of an evasive answer, especially considering that at the heart of the abortion debate is the question "at what point is the fetus/baby alive." Also, I grew up on the KJV and used the interpreters Bible as supplemental and don't think "she gives birth prematurely" is accurate. From my understanding, Ex 21 is saying that if a 3rd party forces a miscarriage that the 3rd party is subject to a fine similar to if he destroyed property/livestock. Whereas "mischief" is referring to if the woman dies, which triggers the "life for life" clause. And that clearly would imply that a fetus is not on equal standing as the mother. Add in that in Hebrew that the word 'life' is derived from the word 'breath' and I really question the typical Bible thumpers interpretation of the Bible regarding abortion.

  8. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidadavis View Post
    DavidB, that is kind of an evasive answer, especially considering that at the heart of the abortion debate is the question "at what point is the fetus/baby alive." Also, I grew up on the KJV and used the interpreters Bible as supplemental and don't think "she gives birth prematurely" is accurate. From my understanding, Ex 21 is saying that if a 3rd party forces a miscarriage that the 3rd party is subject to a fine similar to if he destroyed property/livestock. Whereas "mischief" is referring to if the woman dies, which triggers the "life for life" clause. And that clearly would imply that a fetus is not on equal standing as the mother. Add in that in Hebrew that the word 'life' is derived from the word 'breath' and I really question the typical Bible thumpers interpretation of the Bible regarding abortion.
    That's a Pity Davida, ..... My "Focus" apparently goes Deeper than Yours.

    All Life is Precious & not to be taken lightly.

    And, ... I'll put it this way, ... "If" the Mars Rover found some wiggly, squiggly Sperm om Mars, are You SERIOUSLY going to state that NASA / JPL/ Scientists around the world wouldn't be ecstatic about "Finding Life on Mars"?

    Whether You Believe in Our Creator or not, .... The Shedding of Innocent Blood/ Life is a Sin, & per many Scriptures, ... It Absolutely Pisses Our Creator off.

    Now, as far as "Mischief"?

    I'm going to go with the Hebrew, as much as possible:

    Exo 21:22 IfH3588 menH376 strive,H5327 and hurtH5062 a womanH802 with child,H2030 so that her fruitH3206 departH3318 from her, and yet noH3808 mischiefH611 follow:H1961 he shall be surely punished,H6064 H6064 according asH834 the woman'sH802 husbandH1167 will layH7896 uponH5921 him; and he shall payH5414 as the judgesH6414 determine.

    H611
    אָסוֹן
    'âsôn

    aw-sone'
    Of uncertain derivation; hurt: - mischief.
    Total KJV occurrences: 5
    Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you, that you may be no priest to me. Because you have forgotten your God’s law, I will also forget your children.


    "You've got to Stand for Something or You'll fall for anything" (A. Tippin)


    Mat_15:24 But he answered, “I wasn’t sent to anyone but the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

  9. #74
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    https://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=124535&page=1

    also in my mind no such thing as afterbirth abortion ,once born killing the child is murder .
    Go Trump

  10. #75
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    I really have to wonder if abortion does piss... the creator off..... I mean... think about.... "going" before birth... if its quick...... is probably more easy on the soul than some of the monstrous and downright horrible ways that GOD ALMIGHTY brings onto some babies, infants and children home...

    Slammed into walls by angry baby daddys... or mommas...... raped... beaten to death... tortured......

    Some children are born into this world and never know anything but pain....

    No free BS please..... 6 month old being repeatedly stomped or kicked or thrown into a wall...... has no free will..... nor do most children.

    Oh, free will of the abuser..... yea.... thats pretty messed up aint it....... makes you wonder about the creators state of mind.... like some damn rat crawlin around in there.... gnawing away.....

    Anywho... just something to think about......

    orange.... man.......... BAD
    The bible is my constitution and the constitution is my bible.

    WE THE PEOPLE refers to THEM and not YOU.

    Chewbacca Mom 2016

  11. #76
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    Thread Starter
    You need a license or a education for most everything in this country but anyone can pump out as many kids as they can and not have any proof they know how to take care of them or financial support them.

    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

  12. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    I really have to wonder if abortion does piss... the creator off..... I mean... think about.... "going" before birth... if its quick...... is probably more easy on the soul than some of the monstrous and downright horrible ways that GOD ALMIGHTY brings onto some babies, infants and children home...

    Slammed into walls by angry baby daddys... or mommas...... raped... beaten to death... tortured......

    Some children are born into this world and never know anything but pain....

    No free BS please..... 6 month old being repeatedly stomped or kicked or thrown into a wall...... has no free will..... nor do most children.

    Oh, free will of the abuser..... yea.... thats pretty messed up aint it....... makes you wonder about the creators state of mind.... like some damn rat crawlin around in there.... gnawing away.....

    Anywho... just something to think about......

    orange.... man.......... BAD
    That's pretty heavy corn. We need to tighten your choke collar down some until you come into line here. Yeah. Thank you, thank you very much

  13. #78
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    DavidB, let me stress again, I have not stated my personal beliefs on abortion, I was only asking about what the Bible says about abortion. To me, what the Bible says about abortion is different from what I think is moral, and what I think should be legal is yet a third discussion. And I am asking you specifically because I know you get into Hebrew translations. And I think the two most important words/phrases in Ex 21 that would help shed some light on this for me are:

    "fruit depart from her," to me this sounds like miscarriage, but maybe I am mistaken?
    "mischief," I have no personal view on this, but the interpreters Bible that I have says it implies death of the mother, do you agree?

    If you want to know personal feelings on the morality or legality of abortion, I would happy to tell you independent of my Biblical question.

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