New Technology for air conditioning

[ben9108]

I would like to seek comments on whether the following designs are the new technology in air conditioning or not.

1. Using Variable speed drive (VSD) to control the air flow rate of an existing AHU

[Nuclrchiller]

"New" is subjective. Since VSDs have been used on AHUs for over 30 years, I would say that it is not new technology. Others may say differently, especially if if it is new to them.

[ben9108]

Thanks for reply

What is a new technology in air conditioning in recent years ?

How about the split type unit with a frequency inverter compressor?

[servicefitter]

Mini split heat pumps that can run below 0* with out losing capacity with multi evaps,VRF system's,crimp refrigeration fittings, Building automation system's that can talk to multiple systems and equipment, wifi thermostats and multiple different types refrigerants from drop in replacements to who knows what is next. ECM motors for furnaces and condensers.

[B_roche]

Mini split heat pumps that can run below 0* with out losing capacity with multi evaps,VRF system's,crimp refrigeration fittings, Building automation system's that can talk to multiple systems and equipment, wifi thermostats and multiple different types refrigerants from drop in replacements to who knows what is next. ECM motors for furnaces and condensers.

Digital scrolls are pretty new. Magnetic bearing centrifugals are only ten or fifteen years old. Those god awful micro channel condensers....


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[hvac6470]

A couple of years ago there was an article in Hvac news about Daikin had found a way to put magnetic materials in refrigerant and was using magnetic field as the compressor. A compressor with no moving parts!

[coolcoil]

I assume you are doing this for LEED credits. If so, you will likely get a better answer on one of the many LEED forums out there. Whether LEED will accept something as "new" technology can be subjective.

I very much doubt variable speed drive on AHU's would count. That has been a code requirement for many years.

I, and I think most here would agree, would not consider variable speed drive on a split system to be new technology, but maybe LEED would.

[coolcoil]

Digital scrolls are pretty new. Magnetic bearing centrifugals are only ten or fifteen years old. Those god awful micro channel condensers....


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Digital scrolls? They have long since been sent to the dustbin of history. They were just a temporary answer back when very few companies had variable speed drive technology for compressors. Digital does not perform nearly as well. If they are even available in the market today, it would only be on old models of AC equipment.

[ben9108]

Thanks

Do you have any comments on whether the following designs are the new technology in air conditioning or not.

1. Oil free chiller
2. Self cleaning for water cooled chiller
3. Water cooled for VRF system

[fitzyfitta]

Digital scrolls? They have long since been sent to the dustbin of history. They were just a temporary answer back when very few companies had variable speed drive technology for compressors. Digital does not perform nearly as well. If they are even available in the market today, it would only be on old models of AC equipment.

Digital scrolls are installed on high end equipment still. Leibert, Aaon and many custom built ahu's utalize the digital scrolls.

[timebuilder]

Digital scrolls? They have long since been sent to the dustbin of history. They were just a temporary answer back when very few companies had variable speed drive technology for compressors. Digital does not perform nearly as well. If they are even available in the market today, it would only be on old models of AC equipment.

I'm not sure who told you that, but I have many units only three years old with that technology, and I am still seeing it in new units. The VFD drive for compressors is not cost effective in lower tonnage applications, but being able to control scroll output is very effective, indeed.

[Spitz]

I take care of a Intellapak it has 3 scrolls 1 is ran on A VFD. The problem manufactures have with running compressors on drives is oil.

[timebuilder]

I take care of a Intellapak it has 3 scrolls 1 is ran on A VFD. The problem manufactures have with running compressors on drives is oil.

Very true.

[Aaronpdoyle]

Apparently they've designed a material that emits heat at a specific wavelength that is capable of rejecting heat past the earths atmosphere into space. It wasn't highly effective as it could lower water temperature by 6f over 3 days or something, but it's quite new. The company name is SkyCool.

[B_roche]

I take care of a Intellapak it has 3 scrolls 1 is ran on A VFD. The problem manufactures have with running compressors on drives is oil.

Especially trane, with that delicate flower of a scroll.


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[coolcoil]

I'm not sure who told you that, but I have many units only three years old with that technology, and I am still seeing it in new units. The VFD drive for compressors is not cost effective in lower tonnage applications, but being able to control scroll output is very effective, indeed.

Actually, I was told this by one of the manufacturers of compressors that are suppliers to some of the companies listed earlier in this thread. I was involved with the early stages of the redesign of compressorized product a couple of years ago, and we held meetings with the usual North American compressor companies. We asked about using digital scroll, and they told us it was not recommended now that they had variable speed products available.

To be clear, when I said that you would not see them on anything new, I meant that you will not see manufacturers unveiling completely new designs that employ digital compressors. I have no doubt that digital compressors will continue to be used on legacy designs until they are retired, which could be for many years yet.