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What ar the differences between SV and SM series ?
FHP/Bosch has an SV line which is less expensive and an SM line which is more. In an 024 size - what are the actual differences? I can't picture a two stage 024 compressor but: is there?
Anyway; what are the differences? How different are the SV and the SM?
PHM
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When faced with the choice between changing one's mind, and proving that there is no need to do so, most tend to get busy on the proof.
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According to Bosch's datasheets, the SM is indeed two-speed even in the lowest capacity model (024). I just looked on Copeland's website, and they offer 2-stage scrolls down to 20,000 btu/h low stage, 25,600 btu/h high stage.
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Thanks. I was getting nowhere and the customer is bugging me. My office computer is AFU - but only on some websites; elsewhere it's fine.
So 2 speed compressor - but wait a minute; that's only a 25% capacity reduction! My cost of the SM unit is 200% of the SV and the capacity-control variation is less than 6000 BTU's ? <g>
PHM
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Originally Posted by
rjk_cmh
According to Bosch's datasheets, the SM is indeed two-speed even in the lowest capacity model (024). I just looked on Copeland's website, and they offer 2-stage scrolls down to 20,000 btu/h low stage, 25,600 btu/h high stage.
PHM
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When faced with the choice between changing one's mind, and proving that there is no need to do so, most tend to get busy on the proof.
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Post Likes - 1 Likes, 0 Dislikes
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Sounds like your paying for one more thing to break. Haha
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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First; I don't pay for anything - the customer does.
And Nope; I am making the same Percentage of profit on a job which They will be paying twice as much for. <g>
Oh; and I am substantially in the service business - so I prefer when lots of things break. <g>
PHM
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Originally Posted by
Core_d
Sounds like your paying for one more thing to break. Haha
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
PHM
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When faced with the choice between changing one's mind, and proving that there is no need to do so, most tend to get busy on the proof.
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Post Likes - 2 Likes, 0 Dislikes
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Do you work with this equipment much? I sure would like to talk with someone who does. <g>
My condensing unit selection is an SM024 (N-HX) condensing unit with a horizontal-left-return AH. But . . . . according to the Bosch catalog there are SIX matching AH's - including a 35K unit. Zupwidat? <g>
Do you know what the differences are between the SM air handlers and the DX air handlers?
PHM
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Originally Posted by
rjk_cmh
According to Bosch's datasheets, the SM is indeed two-speed even in the lowest capacity model (024). I just looked on Copeland's website, and they offer 2-stage scrolls down to 20,000 btu/h low stage, 25,600 btu/h high stage.
PHM
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When faced with the choice between changing one's mind, and proving that there is no need to do so, most tend to get busy on the proof.
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Originally Posted by
Poodle Head Mikey
Do you work with this equipment much? I sure would like to talk with someone who does. <g>
My condensing unit selection is an SM024 (N-HX) condensing unit with a horizontal-left-return AH. But . . . . according to the Bosch catalog there are SIX matching AH's - including a 35K unit. Zupwidat? <g>
Do you know what the differences are between the SM air handlers and the DX air handlers?
PHM
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Sorry, I don't work with them at all - I sure hope someone comes along that has actual experience with them and posts in this thread.
According to my review of the datasheets, the DX model is a standard-style 4-way multipoise AH, fan on bottom, A-coil on top, like any other manufacturer. The SM AH is more of a traditional Geo-style box with a slab coil and a side return and a top supply. As far as I can tell, the SM AH is only a water coil, and the DX AH is a DX coil. However, I could be wrong about this.
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According to Bosch's datasheets, the SM is indeed two-speed even in the lowest capacity model (024). I just looked on Copeland's website, and they offer 2-stage scrolls down to 20,000 btu/h low stage, 25,600 btu/h high stage.
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Weirdly enough; this four-years-ago job has recently come to bite me in the ass.
Original quote was for the SM with the marine-grade condenser as it's a two-well system in a high-acid ground-water area. I ordered a 5 or 10 KW heat package for backup. The customer said they wanted the best and his other system is an SM. After he got the proposal he hesitated over the price and asked if there was a lower cost option. I called the vendor - United Refrigeration - and some jackass there told me the SV was 'pretty much the same' as an SM - it was just a "commercial" unit. "Commercial" sounds good and he said they were the same unit at their cores. So I lowered the customer quote by my cost difference and the customer accepted it.
Screaming busy, brutal summer attic install - just started the cooling and left them comfortable. Two years later a capacitor or something failed in the winter and they had no heat. The unit had no heat package. I called the vendor and asked where the heat kit I ordered was.
"It wasn't on the order."
"Why the hell now? I ordered an SM with all the high end stuff - including the heat package. I agree to substitute the SV after you told me it was basically the same unit!"
Huh; sorry about that I guess.
Well; order me a damned heat kit!
OK.
They never call that the order is in so a month later I call: "Where's my heat kit?"
It's not here - I guess it didn't come yet.
Do you all just sit there waiting with your thumbs up you ass? Call the damned factory and find out where the hell it is!"
An hour later: "They don't make a heat kit for that unit."
What about backup heat?
I don't know.
Call them back and find out!
"You bought a commercial unit - they don't have a heat kit for those."
What? You knew I wanted a heat kit. When I asked about the SM / SV difference you told me they were pretty much the same unit. So when you saw there was no heat kit for the SV what did do? Just say fuggit?
I don't remember.
The perpetual failures on this job are all water coil failures - due to the high acid well water. Hold that thought.
Last week I get a call from the guy who is working on their systems now. Last winter he had to top off the charge. Now no cooling - low on refrigerant. "I put dye in last winter but there is not even a trace of a leak - where could the refrigerant be going?"
Of COURSE! It's the friggin condenser - what else Could it be? So I call United about the warranty. Which is some huge long time on the SM. "Oh an SV? One year warranty on the commercial line."
One year warranty? What about the marine grade condenser?
"Oh the SV doesn't have that - just a standard copper condenser." (!!!!!!!!)
Tech said: "Mr. Customer; about time for a new condenser."
"What! That unit is almost new! And it has like a ten year warranty on it!"
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So now what? United effs everything up and EYE get to eat it? Or I get to tell my lifelong customer to go eff himself?
Sometimes I Hate what this business has become.
PHM
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Originally Posted by
NickFisher
According to Bosch's datasheets, the SM is indeed two-speed even in the lowest capacity model (024). I just looked on Copeland's website, and they offer 2-stage scrolls down to 20,000 btu/h low stage, 25,600 btu/h high stage.
PHM
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When faced with the choice between changing one's mind, and proving that there is no need to do so, most tend to get busy on the proof.
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We’ve had some crazy issues this past year with this geo hp manufacturer.
From service valves brazed in backwards, to stuck txv’s, to warranty parts availability.
We stopped quoting their equipment, and are just trying to get through the quotes we already committed to.
They used to be good and we have so much of their stuff out there going back to when they were FHP.
My heart goes out to you. There’s few things more maddening as getting hung out by the factory to your customers/neighbors.
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