BACnet/IP WiFi thermostat

[orion242]

Really think Reliable hit it out of the ballpark with this one.

B-BC on a glorified wall stat, fully programmable.....yea I would second that.

They really need to turn their attention away from hardware and bring their software up to the same level as their hardware.

[BetterDuck]

It is more difficult to deliver really good hardware. Software can be improved. It looks great and has a nice feature set.

[orion242]

True. However they have every base covered with hardware, almost everything has B-BC ratings or higher, its fast as hell. Done beat the hardware horse to death at this point.

Studio and the whole workflow programing and reusing programs is a complete nightmare. Need to copy a program and move I/O around? Total facking nightmare.

[kontrolphreak]

The new send to many and templates in RCS3 are a vast improvement. Moving IO isn't that bad, changing programming to reflect the changes is a PITA. Been thinking about using local variables (not being able to name them is also a PITA) in programming and then directing those to IO so that changing physical points wouldn't be as bad. Been doing some slick data transfer using generic MAC address of the zone controllers to send to cells in an array in the "parent" controller to reduce cutting and pasting network data. Can send 5 values (damper pos, heat/cool/airflow request and zone temp) to an array muxed in a analog variable then de-mux that to the 5 pieces of data with for loop statements to 5 other arrays. Very lean code.

kontrol out

[orion242]

Its getting there with RC3. Yet again, they have a dizzying array of SKUs. What more do you really need in the hardware department??

Get the software as good as the hardware, and they go from a solid system, to a great one IMO.

If they just added a column in the worksheet for I/O channel, it would be 10x reduction in headache factor. Their software guys need to spend some time out in the field with guys that know they are doing and see just what a CF it is to do common tech tasks with their product compared to their competitors.

Offline viewing of pan files is another wtf moment. Like I know what the hell AV23, BI1, etc, etc is 6 months later when I need it again. Need to almost load it in to even tell exactly what is going on. Open this, expand that, cross reference this. Rather stab and eye out with #2 pencil.

Comments in programmings eating up controller memory coupled with program variables that can only be a single letter. Both really help the next guy figure out WTF is going on... The program variable name really frost my rear, and yes I brought this up with them.... Its only a compiler change in studio to support and it could easily be backwards compatible. Really no excuse for not implementing this in RC3.

[MaxBurn]

Thank you for the feedback on the technician side of their software, that was a concern of mine. We have been really spoiled with Eikon over here.

[orion242]

Its a solid system and the hardware is a 10 in my book.

The software is mainly a headache for the contractors my complaints really don't reflect anything the typical end user would deal with. I have to think at some point RnD is circling back and addressing some of this.

[MaxBurn]

From you all I have heard nothing but good things about reliable and I had some conversations with mgmt to see about taking them on, but frankly we would only be interested in the stat and likely wouldn't be a good rep for them.

I also have to think that 2017 will see more options open up in this product category.

[kontrolphreak]

I have worked with both ALC and Reliable for the majority of my career and they both have their pros and cons. I like Reliable's versatility and think their hardware (that they are MSTP at the buss level is way better than ALC's ARC156) is better, but WebCTRL is leaps and bounds ahead of RC-Studio.

I have controllers and software for both and Reliable is what is installed in my home. The ability to change code and/or controller configuration on the fly without a download is great for testing and development.

kontrol out

[MaxBurn]

Honeywell TC500A seems interesting. Anyone use one yet?

https://buildings.honeywell.com/us/e...ial-thermostat

[orion242]

Looks nice.

After getting completely burned with the visionpro series, the first red flag is no detailed SOO for the different applications. The thought of black box figuring that out is a deal killer in a stat that supports a handful of different apps.

[bigguy158]

Honeywell TC500A seems interesting. Anyone use one yet?

https://buildings.honeywell.com/us/e...ial-thermostat

I got one for free. We’re going to install on our shops lunch room RTU.


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[Nembus]

I'm using the TC500 on a job right now, it's pretty straight forward and easy to setup. We connected it to a JACE wifi and discovered all the bacnet points, theoretically if you wanted too, you could have your program on the JACE and override the BACnet points and control equipment with this wireless stat. Don't think it's a great idea to do over WiFi and BACnet though. Best ideas just use this as a normal stat and BACnet for monitoring. Oh one thing, the stat is a little laggy but it's no big deal.

[bigguy158]

Update on our lunch room RTU we’ve had hundreds of ping alarms on the thermostat every week. I’m not sure if it was an issue on the IT side or not. I haven’t really cared enough to dig into it.

This is the Honeywell TC500 stat.

It is pretty cool and has a bunch of I/O on it. Though I wish it had more analog inputs.

Also the RTU coils got hammered flat by hail, like 2 weeks after installing stat, so the stat is going away once we can get new RTU.


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[MaxBurn]

That’s why I’d really like to see signal level reported by the device.

[TheCoveTech]

Anyone have some good options to compete with the Honeywell TC500? We have a few buildings on our property with only a single unit in them that we may not want to install a full BACnet controller in. So we are debating installing either these TC500 or a Reliable Control LCD MachPro View. I'm trying to figure out if there are any other good options. So far we have only Reliable Controls BACnet equipment.

[kontrolphreak]

Huge proponent of the MACH-ProView. Onenof the most versatile controllers / user interfaces out there.

kontrol out

[gwilliams99]

Honeywell has a very nice thermostat that is both WiFi and Bacnet IP over Wifi as well as MSTP
Honeywell TC500
https://buildings.honeywell.com/us/e...ial_thermostat

[TheCoveTech]

We got a TC500 to try out in one of our buildings. As Nembus comments:

I'm using the TC500 on a job right now, it's pretty straight forward and easy to setup. We connected it to a JACE wifi and discovered all the bacnet points, theoretically if you wanted too, you could have your program on the JACE and override the BACnet points and control equipment with this wireless stat. Don't think it's a great idea to do over WiFi and BACnet though. Best ideas just use this as a normal stat and BACnet for monitoring. Oh one thing, the stat is a little laggy but it's no big deal.

It is a little laggy. For ours that has meant a slight delay in the room temperature reading. So it has been a little slow to turn on and off. It has kept the room comfortable and we have not received any complaints yet.

I have not yet been able to integrate it into our BAS. IT is currently setting up an isolated WiFi that links in with our isolated VLan. I will plan to update when I go through that portion. So far it has seemed pretty straight forward. I am planning to us some of the additional IOs for return and supply temp monitoring as well as possibly a filter alarm.

If anyone has suggestions on other uses for the IOs for improved equipment monitoring or energy savings I'd be interested in hearing them. I've also considered having the thermostat turn on and off the water heater with occupancy/scheduling.

[TheCoveTech]

Update on our TC500. We had some month long delays getting the thermostat networked into BACnet since IT wanted to setup a separate HVAC Wifi network for it to connect on but IT was swamped with some major work and over halls.
That said once IT got the designated Wifi connected and linked it to the VLan that our other equipment is on the thermostat immediately displayed in Reliable Controls Studio system tree without any real discovery process needed. I have since been making graphics and mapping points to give remote control of the thermostat on BACnet. The most difficult part has just been hunting for the actual point desired to be adjusted (like the mode setting) in the very long list of points given.

I am also having issue with getting the heating and cooling setpoints setup to work properly. The thermostat default writes to priority 15 and Studio default writes to 10. I have tried to see if Studio can write to 15 but the thermostat will not allow it. The thermostat actually operates off of the last entered setpoint. However, BACnet shows the value in the highest priority (so 10). This is mostly an issue of possible operator confusion more than improper equipment operation. I had tried to write some code to see if I could make priority 10 relinquish if priority 15 is changed. The code would have worked IF the program was able to read the value of priority 15. However, the program will not refence any value other than the highest (so 10 when a value is present there).

We were looking at and considering the Honeywell TC500 for some remote cabins and for some replacements of Pelican thermostat (which IT does not like since it needs connection off property to operate). Overall the thermostat is fairly comparable though needs a lot of setup in Studio in order to have remote monitoring and operation (while Pelican is setup from the start). We will have the option of adding additional inputs beyond what Pelican was capable of. I will plan to continue to update as we move forward.