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  1. #1
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    What Was VW Thinking?

    Volkswagen is the worlds largest automaker by sales. They sell more cars than GM or Toyota. They also make Porsches, Audi's, Bentley's and several other cars. As I'm sure many of you know they purposely installed a device that would cheat emissions inspections. They finally got caught and admitted it. They will have to recall over 11 million cars. They have opened themselves up to virtually unlimited liability. Obviously as always the motive was money and greed.

    Supposedly several high and even mid levels of management at VW knew about the scheme. How did they think that with so many people knowing about it, that they could get away with it? It amazes me how stupid, seemingly smart, successful people can be. Any thoughts?

  2. #2
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    Thoughts? Yes, hire the software programers that figured out a way to detect when an emssions test was being preformed so it could change its settings so it would "pass" and then return to "gitty-up" mode when complete.
    Politicians need to be changed like diapers, and for the same reason.
    Mark Twain

  3. Likes lkapigian, Tool-Slinger liked this post
  4. #3
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    The fact that VW went to such measures is yet another symptom of the fact that government agencies like the EPA have gotten out of control.
    Vacuum Technology:
    CRUD = Contamination Resulting in Undesirable Deposits.
    CRAPP = Contamination Resulting in Additional Partial Pressure.

    Change your vacuum pump oil now.

    Test. Testing, 1,2,3.

  5. Likes ChaseAir, lkapigian liked this post
  6. #4
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    But, but, but . . . Those cars had lots of power AND passed the emissions testing . . .

  7. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space Racer View Post
    The fact that VW went to such measures is yet another symptom of the fact that government agencies like the EPA have gotten out of control.
    I guess there is always a way to blame everything on the govt to shift blame away from corrupt corps. I'd say the CEO's are out of control…not risking any jail time or personal financial responsibility.

    They obviously did not do this to pass smog tests. They did it to illegally get more power out of the engine at a cheaper price.

    Car makers are legally getting well over 500hp out of engines. If VW wants to do that, they have to charge for it.

    A few weeks ago I had a VW Passat rental car. What a POS.

  8. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    I guess there is always a way to blame everything on the govt to shift blame away from corrupt corps.
    I said it was a symptom. Do you know what a symptom is?

    If we had been talking about measles, your statement would translate to:

    "I guess there is always a way to blame everything on the disease to shift blame away from the red spots."

    All I did was point out the government's red spots. You are the one who is talking about shifting blame.
    Vacuum Technology:
    CRUD = Contamination Resulting in Undesirable Deposits.
    CRAPP = Contamination Resulting in Additional Partial Pressure.

    Change your vacuum pump oil now.

    Test. Testing, 1,2,3.

  9. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space Racer View Post
    I said it was a symptom. Do you know what a symptom is?

    If we had been talking about measles, your statement would translate to:

    "I guess there is always a way to blame everything on the disease to shift blame away from the red spots."

    All I did was point out the government's red spots. You are the one who is talking about shifting blame.
    I'm not in love with the government or anything like that but I saw it the same way BrianGC did, as placing the blame on the government.

  10. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadheaddave View Post
    I'm not in love with the government or anything like that but I saw it the same way BrianGC did, as placing the blame on the government.
    I did not shift blame away from VW.
    I pointed out that the government is partially to blame.

    It takes two to tango. VW did not act in a vacuum.
    Vacuum Technology:
    CRUD = Contamination Resulting in Undesirable Deposits.
    CRAPP = Contamination Resulting in Additional Partial Pressure.

    Change your vacuum pump oil now.

    Test. Testing, 1,2,3.

  11. #9
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    IMO what happened...

    Was VW figured the 'risk/reward' ratio of doing this (they KNEW there was a chance they would get caught someday) WAS worth it. They built complicated spreadsheets and determined the reward was worth the risk.

    Sure... they are gonna have to fix 11+million cars... but I bet the accountants knew ahead of time it would work out to a profit. IMO the only difference between what VW did... and what many a corp gets away with (and NEVER gets caught)... is getting caught.
    And individuals get away with cheating on their taxes all the time... so what is the difference?
    Is it OK if I game the govt and win... yet not OK if the govt games the govt and wins? In the case of VW... folks got a car that ran better and got better mileage... seems to me they won.

    IMO folks need to get over their self-righteous and hypocritical attitudes.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  12. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space Racer View Post
    I did not shift blame away from VW.
    I pointed out that the government is partially to blame.

    It takes two to tango. VW did not act in a vacuum.
    Yes you did. You characterized VW as "went to such measures" instead of stating it 'has engaged in criminal activity.' You also said the "EPA have gotten out of control."

    Those two statements said volumes about your expressed position on VW's criminal activity. You clearly downplayed it.

  13. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Yes you did. You characterized VW as "went to such measures" instead of stating it 'has engaged in criminal activity.' You also said the "EPA have gotten out of control."

    Those two statements said volumes about your expressed position on VW's criminal activity. You clearly downplayed it.
    You clearly inferred something which I did not imply.

    Not only that, but you are insisting on my use of particular language, which is a form of the practice of political correctness, a tactic used by Marxists to attack the language of an argument instead of the argument itself.

    As far as my positions on the EPA goes, see the thread
    What's So Bad About Overregulation?
    http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread....Overregulation
    Vacuum Technology:
    CRUD = Contamination Resulting in Undesirable Deposits.
    CRAPP = Contamination Resulting in Additional Partial Pressure.

    Change your vacuum pump oil now.

    Test. Testing, 1,2,3.

  14. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Yes you did. You characterized VW as "went to such measures" instead of stating it 'has engaged in criminal activity.' You also said the "EPA have gotten out of control."

    Those two statements said volumes about your expressed position on VW's criminal activity. You clearly downplayed it.
    Not to me....

    But then I am not a left coast 'fruits and nuts' person...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Your comfort, Your way, Everyday!

  15. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space Racer View Post
    You clearly inferred something which I did not imply.

    Not only that, but you are insisting on my use of particular language, which is a form of the practice of political correctness, a tactic used by Marxists to attack the language of an argument instead of the argument itself.
    The term "takes measures" into their own hands is a form of legitimizing the action. Whether you are aware of it or not.

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