Why is it so hard to find help?

[Cole_Schleif]

I also do appliance sales and service with small plumbing projects too still not as busy as you I don't think. I'm a fairly new business though..and really have just gotten into appliances those keep me busy!

[BBeerme]

Thirty nine? My god, your over the hill already.

Does age matter in your choices? Wondering considering I am thirty nine. Thank you.

[BBeerme]

As I've mentioned before on this site, you can pretty much trace it all back to cars. How they are made. Used to be when you were a kid, you had to work on your car just to keep in running. Now they are such a pain to work on, it's barely worth it.

Which means the kids don't have that on hands training to learn hydraulics (brakes), electrical (both high and low voltages), what a bearing is and how to change it, just wrenching in general, how about the emergency repair just so you can get around, maybe you'd get real lucky and even have an A/C in your car (I never did).

So you see, the kids now-a-days just don't have a clue how to act around a screwdriver.

There as to be something why young guys turn off by the TRADE can't just be that they're solely into video software, cell phone and laziness etc.


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[BBeerme]

In response to the original post, as long as I've been in the trade, it has always been this way. It may have gotten worse lately, but it was still near impossible to get quality help 25 years ago. Training from within is how my previous employer built his company up; couldn't do it any other way.

[Hauptmann6]

I'm still in tech school, but it seems the only ones encouraged to go into the trades are those who have had troubled backgrounds(arrests, drugs etc)(I would guess in my program of I would guess 40, 50% have felonies, and another 35-30% have records) not not the normal good students who would make good employees. Those are pushed into the college route. I graduated hs in 97 and until 3 years ago, I didn't even realize you could go to school for HVAC(I found it looking through the catalog) the councilors at the local CC are clueless about all the trade programs and are semi hostile to even dealing with it.

I think the unions(however you feel about them) could do a huge service to themselves by actually promoting the trades. I went to HS near 2 big union towns(Bay City and Saginaw) but the only people we ever saw in school were the college recruiters. Get out and get the idea in kids heads that they can make money and get actual jobs right out of HS. Even if you only get 4-5 kids from a HS for a couple hours of work they would still be way ahead.

[Mike19]

I guarantee 40 but I also live in a county that has maybe 2k people in it so a slight difference I'm sure

I think that's your problem.

If there are only 2,000 people living in the county, I think you are going to have a difficult time finding someone, just because the potential labor pool is so small.

[HVAC-matt]

I went to college, glad I did but then I got into the trades. Not to generalize but as others have said some-most of the kids these days don't want to get dirty and work with their hands.
I am going to try to push my children into the trades if that's what they are good at, make a good honest living and stay out of debt from college like their father and mother are.


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[intellitech]

I went to college, glad I did but then I got into the trades. Not to generalize but as others have said some-most of the kids these days don't want to get dirty and work with their hands.
I am going to try to push my children into the trades if that's what they are good at, make a good honest living and stay out of debt from college like their father and mother are.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I hear that!! I am still paying off student loans. And I can't stand seeing that money go out. But at least I did get an associate degree in business. Not sure I'll ever apply it though....

[HVAC-matt]

I got a bachelors in CJ, at least you can use yours if you open your own business.


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[oldguy1949]

How about stop do background check and drug test


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In my state it is required for HVACR.I have to send it the license cops.
I want to know as much as I can now & not later.My son was an attorney for the Fed Prosicutor and he says you wouldn't believe the people walking around that are CRIMINALS.
I see some of the techs/installers at the supply houses and not convinced lots of them were checked.
Big problem is wages.in Tx a kid can get out of hi-school and go straight to work in the oil/gas industry for $18+ if they don't want to go college or trade school.in a few short years be making 75k or better.

[The_Sale]

Ha! Just had an employee at the supermarket im working at ask me
Him: "you make a lot of money doing that?"
Me: "yup"
Him: "is it hard?"
Me: "if it was easy, you wouldn't get paid a lot"
Him: "ok, nevermind"

I think a lot of it is laziness. just my opinion.

[Mike19]

Ha! Just had an employee at the supermarket im working at ask me
Him: "you make a lot of money doing that?"
Me: "yup"
Him: "is it hard?"
Me: "if it was easy, you wouldn't get paid a lot"
Him: "ok, nevermind"

I think a lot of it is laziness. just my opinion.

If I had a dime for every time I had a restaurant employee ask me that, I would be rich.

[rfhcms]

Adbridged Quotes: "How about stop do background check and drug test" AND "y r u passing judgement r u god?"
My required ANNUAL company paid physical consists of the usual plus Hearing, Vision, and non-CDL required Urine testing in order to operate anything from a van, non-CDL truck, scissor lift, electric vehicle, etc., along with a few pages of questions to answer that could catch you in a lie. Also, to be granted access to certain rooms or facilities, a once every 7 year background check and CREDIT check which you authorized when you first signed the paper. If I had a CDL requirement, then that brings in the random urine tests and whatever else is on that. So, who is to judge?

For Health Insurance, in order to pay the lower rates and deductables company/insurer requires myself and MY WIFE to get 1. ANNUAL physicals, results of which are reported to this third party health service, 2. to fill out a health screaning questionare which includes questions like "I won't drive after 2 drinks" or "won't get a vehicle where the driver has had 2 or more drinks" not to mention a few more you won't like, and 3. HAVE TO talk to a medical person by phone for coaching. If one of us doesn't do it, higher rate applies (almost 2x). I screwed up one year on the due date of the coaching call, and found out. Appealed, answer was hell no, we emailed you x times on such and such, we mailed copies of the enclosed to you x times on such and such, and like that. So who is to judge??

Union shop. There are 50 of us. Non-military/government. When we have new applicants, as soon as you tell them some of the requirements, it's "see ya!" and "Oh, I need to have a specific City/State HVAC license to work here and a 608 card?" So who is to judge?

[HVAC_Marc]

Adbridged Quotes: "How about stop do background check and drug test" AND "y r u passing judgement r u god?"
My required ANNUAL company paid physical consists of the usual plus Hearing, Vision, and non-CDL required Urine testing in order to operate anything from a van, non-CDL truck, scissor lift, electric vehicle, etc., along with a few pages of questions to answer that could catch you in a lie. Also, to be granted access to certain rooms or facilities, a once every 7 year background check and CREDIT check which you authorized when you first signed the paper. If I had a CDL requirement, then that brings in the random urine tests and whatever else is on that. So, who is to judge?

For Health Insurance, in order to pay the lower rates and deductables company/insurer requires myself and MY WIFE to get 1. ANNUAL physicals, results of which are reported to this third party health service, 2. to fill out a health screaning questionare which includes questions like "I won't drive after 2 drinks" or "won't get a vehicle where the driver has had 2 or more drinks" not to mention a few more you won't like, and 3. HAVE TO talk to a medical person by phone for coaching. If one of us doesn't do it, higher rate applies (almost 2x). I screwed up one year on the due date of the coaching call, and found out. Appealed, answer was hell no, we emailed you x times on such and such, we mailed copies of the enclosed to you x times on such and such, and like that. So who is to judge??

Union shop. There are 50 of us. Non-military/government. When we have new applicants, as soon as you tell them some of the requirements, it's "see ya!" and "Oh, I need to have a specific City/State HVAC license to work here and a 608 card?" So who is to judge?

[Wild]

I think the higher cost of living these days has a lot to do with it. The national median income for an HVAC technician is $41,000. That isn’t an income that’s going to give you very much financial security these days. Given these circumstances is it really a surprise that our trade doesn’t attract today’s brightest and best youth?

The kids getting in the trade today are likely doing so because they have limited options from making poor past decisions or lack of opportunity. I wouldn’t judge today’s youth based on the demographic that gets drawn to our trade.

Here’s an idea with spring coming. Do high schools still have auto mechanic classes? This is where you find wrench turners. See if you can go in and give a presentation on what the HVAC trade is all about to an auto class. Maybe you could find a senior with good work ethics that would be willing to give HVAC a try this summer and possibly forgo spending thousands at the local tech school on a different trade. The kids coming out of these HVAC tech schools seem to know nothing anyways, so either way you have to train them.

[BBeerme]

Ding, ding, ding !!

This used to be the only question required: Do you work on your own car?

I think the higher cost of living these days has a lot to do with it. The national median income for an HVAC technician is $41,000. That isn’t an income that’s going to give you very much financial security these days. Given these circumstances is it really a surprise that our trade doesn’t attract today’s brightest and best youth?

The kids getting in the trade today are likely doing so because they have limited options from making poor past decisions or lack of opportunity. I wouldn’t judge today’s youth based on the demographic that gets drawn to our trade.

Here’s an idea with spring coming. Do high schools still have auto mechanic classes? This is where you find wrench turners. See if you can go in and give a presentation on what the HVAC trade is all about to an auto class. Maybe you could find a senior with good work ethics that would be willing to give HVAC a try this summer and possibly forgo spending thousands at the local tech school on a different trade. The kids coming out of these HVAC tech schools seem to know nothing anyways, so either way you have to train them.

[mofotech]

As I've mentioned before on this site, you can pretty much trace it all back to cars. How they are made. Used to be when you were a kid, you had to work on your car just to keep in running. Now they are such a pain to work on, it's barely worth it.

Which means the kids don't have that on hands training to learn hydraulics (brakes), electrical (both high and low voltages), what a bearing is and how to change it, just wrenching in general, how about the emergency repair just so you can get around, maybe you'd get real lucky and even have an A/C in your car (I never did).

So you see, the kids now-a-days just don't have a clue how to act around a screwdriver.

..Yes we do...we just google it... geez

Just playing around.. I don't know man I wish I had good HVAC opportunities...but companies just pass me by. LOLLL, I even offered to work for free. But I have a feeling something is going to happen this Spring. So hopes are high to break ground. But I also think there are a lot of young people just thrown into hvac and really don't want to be there. Just like others are saying they may come from a bad background or environment. You guys just gotta weed out the bad ones and find the good ones.

[XcelTech]

I believe we have several situations conspiring to make this field difficult to find good help in the younger generation. I see the problem being in three majority parts;
1. Youth restrictions,
2. Social Media/Career Options,
3. Industry requirements vs Industry rewards.

I will not be referring to those who have underprivileged or bad home lives. Only the moderation. If the moderation has these problems then so do the underprivileged.

I am still a young man at 34, but I at least have the experiences of my elder male role models in a regions of the USA that is still a bit behind and originally built upon coal mining, to reflect upon. In many ways the world for young men now is very much harder and much easier all at the same time.

Growing up now and then
Even when I was a younger man, leaving the house to run and jump through the woods with the rattle snakes, wolves, creeks and rivers at the age of 13 was no big deal. Using shotguns, bow and arrows, camping, hunting, fishing, and so on was not a worrisome or illegal prospect.

At 17, my cousin and I were pulling engines and transmission out of one car to modify and place in another. None of these things were out of the normal or a court rendering action. I was trained by family and friends not a certified professional. I was in the boy scouts, I played sports, and I lived in the country side.

However now a days young men and woman are so strictly enforced as to what they can do they have little to grown upon. They are strangled into growing up with computers, TVs, and internet social activities because no one trusts them or anyone else.

How with these restrictions are they supposed to learn from their mistakes, become self- confident, and learn the real dangerous of life but more importantly how to overcome, adapt, be responsible, self-reliable, and learn the difference between laziness and hard work?

Most young men and woman now do not take on a part-time job until they are 17, let alone have work like responsibilities before that.

On the other hand they do have unlimited access to learning resources, more educational options, and world events. Of course they are in no way personally involved with any of it because they are locked down by parents and the government.

They have more toys, better (tasting at least) food options, fancier clothes and the list goes on and on…. But they also have less strong family interactions, longer distances to older relatives, divided homes, less outdoors/social events, fewer roots in the community, and so on.

Again how are we expecting them to “mentally, responsibly, socially, grow up?”

Social Media and Career Options
No, I do not believe Facebook is destroying our youth. It is ignorant to believe there is one all-encompassing source.

Yet, I do believe that a Vogue style does not help. However, I believe the, “You can be anything you want,” campaigns that have been a staple in all social media and schooling is. Not because today’s children are inept, but because we feed them “you can do it” without making them ready for the difficulties of getting there, as well as the mental stability to forge forth through the unfair aspects of human politics and regulations.

Of course they can be whatever they want but there is no “Staple easy button” for that. More so, we have allowed the selling media to invoke the belief that you have to have, be, look, or act within an acceptable style or fashion to achieve these goals. While certain retrospective or dirty fashions and actions can restrict a youth due to perception, this does not mean they need to conform, nor resist.

I have confused myself just typing these words, what are they supposed to do with that?

We then tell them hard work will prevail, really? Can anyone here say that hard work is the soul attribute to their success? For many, it was a large piece to getting where they now are but it was hardly the whole story. When was the last time we truthfully talked to our youth about reality?

Lets not forget opportunity.

Example: Joey is a 16 year old male who has 2 years to finish school and decide what his future endeavors will be. Having been groomed for the last ten years on by media, friends, family, teachers, and so on that he can be whatever he wants and that life is all about success in employment, family, and respect of others.

When presented with a choice of a two year technical school for HVAC or a four year degree in engineering, Joey, believing that an engineer makes more money, is more respected for being an engineer, and can create a better life style, selects this over a two year technical school in the HVAC field, having no idea that engineering is a flooded field, and a very under trained field with a very harsh and demanding day to day.

Youth are offered great opportunities without understanding the day to day of the field they are being offered. Knowing only the hype of the media surrounding such fields, they are in no way prepared for the office politics, menial tasks, and the need for self-education outside of professional training.

But least not forget the pay. Joey can start work in an office with little to no physical responsibilities for 2 or 3 times the pay of an HVAC technician with 10 years of on the job experience, which leads me to my third conspirator.

Industry requirements now and then
It is no longer a simple field.
We are no longer able to vent, refill, or guess. It has become imperative for HVAC technicians to understand a larger more complex system. For generation it was okay to gorge upon the simple repairs such as “beer can cold” or over-sizing but we are no longer as a wasteful of a society as we once were.

We now have many aspects that must be equalized or micromanaged to create a complex yet well maintained system.
Technicians must be knowledgeable in
1. engineering,
2. energy conservation,
3. physics and thermodynamics,
4. aerodynamics,
5. electronics,
6. government regulation,
7. plumbing,
8. sales,
9. business ethics,
10. professional appearance,
11. political correctness,
12. customer management,
13. critical customer diffusion,
14. and the list goes on.

Technicians are now a PR engineering scientist wearing a company designed suit and carrying a door to door sells brochure.

Yet, we want to pay them a garage mechanics wage and do two to four years of training before they enter the field.

And then we complain about having trouble finding qualified people.

In short, to gain a better base of personal we need to offer a better life style.

We need companies to become involved in the youth outreach for a more physical and growth related activities in our communities, such as boyscouts, girlscouts, community programs, and self-confidence building activities.

We need to use social media to expand upon the career possibilities of physical labor work such as BAS, Management, Ownership, Energy Conservation, Massive Distribution companies, growing field of innovations, and socially acceptable living as well as increase the understanding to the population as to how the industry has changed and what HVAC requires.

We need to motivate colleges and universities to create, offer, and expand upon scholastic endeavors in the field. We need to make HVAC a part of every universities Science and Engineering curriculum.

And we need to increase the wages/benefits/personal growth of a long lasting career in the HVAC industry.

[GT Jets]

I believe we have several situations conspiring to make this field difficult to find good help in the younger generation. I see the problem being in three majority parts;
1. Youth restrictions,
2. Social Media/Career Options,
3. Industry requirements vs Industry rewards.

I will not be referring to those who have underprivileged or bad home lives. Only the moderation. If the moderation has these problems then so do the underprivileged.

I am still a young man at 34, but I at least have the experiences of my elder male role models in a regions of the USA that is still a bit behind and originally built upon coal mining, to reflect upon. In many ways the world for young men now is very much harder and much easier all at the same time.

Growing up now and then
Even when I was a younger man, leaving the house to run and jump through the woods with the rattle snakes, wolves, creeks and rivers at the age of 13 was no big deal. Using shotguns, bow and arrows, camping, hunting, fishing, and so on was not a worrisome or illegal prospect.

At 17, my cousin and I were pulling engines and transmission out of one car to modify and place in another. None of these things were out of the normal or a court rendering action. I was trained by family and friends not a certified professional. I was in the boy scouts, I played sports, and I lived in the country side.

However now a days young men and woman are so strictly enforced as to what they can do they have little to grown upon. They are strangled into growing up with computers, TVs, and internet social activities because no one trusts them or anyone else.

How with these restrictions are they supposed to learn from their mistakes, become self- confident, and learn the real dangerous of life but more importantly how to overcome, adapt, be responsible, self-reliable, and learn the difference between laziness and hard work?

Most young men and woman now do not take on a part-time job until they are 17, let alone have work like responsibilities before that.

On the other hand they do have unlimited access to learning resources, more educational options, and world events. Of course they are in no way personally involved with any of it because they are locked down by parents and the government.

They have more toys, better (tasting at least) food options, fancier clothes and the list goes on and on…. But they also have less strong family interactions, longer distances to older relatives, divided homes, less outdoors/social events, fewer roots in the community, and so on.

Again how are we expecting them to “mentally, responsibly, socially, grow up?”

Social Media and Career Options
No, I do not believe Facebook is destroying our youth. It is ignorant to believe there is one all-encompassing source.

Yet, I do believe that a Vogue style does not help. However, I believe the, “You can be anything you want,” campaigns that have been a staple in all social media and schooling is. Not because today’s children are inept, but because we feed them “you can do it” without making them ready for the difficulties of getting there, as well as the mental stability to forge forth through the unfair aspects of human politics and regulations.

Of course they can be whatever they want but there is no “Staple easy button” for that. More so, we have allowed the selling media to invoke the belief that you have to have, be, look, or act within an acceptable style or fashion to achieve these goals. While certain retrospective or dirty fashions and actions can restrict a youth due to perception, this does not mean they need to conform, nor resist.

I have confused myself just typing these words, what are they supposed to do with that?

We then tell them hard work will prevail, really? Can anyone here say that hard work is the soul attribute to their success? For many, it was a large piece to getting where they now are but it was hardly the whole story. When was the last time we truthfully talked to our youth about reality?

Lets not forget opportunity.

Example: Joey is a 16 year old male who has 2 years to finish school and decide what his future endeavors will be. Having been groomed for the last ten years on by media, friends, family, teachers, and so on that he can be whatever he wants and that life is all about success in employment, family, and respect of others.

When presented with a choice of a two year technical school for HVAC or a four year degree in engineering, Joey, believing that an engineer makes more money, is more respected for being an engineer, and can create a better life style, selects this over a two year technical school in the HVAC field, having no idea that engineering is a flooded field, and a very under trained field with a very harsh and demanding day to day.

Youth are offered great opportunities without understanding the day to day of the field they are being offered. Knowing only the hype of the media surrounding such fields, they are in no way prepared for the office politics, menial tasks, and the need for self-education outside of professional training.

But least not forget the pay. Joey can start work in an office with little to no physical responsibilities for 2 or 3 times the pay of an HVAC technician with 10 years of on the job experience, which leads me to my third conspirator.

Industry requirements now and then
It is no longer a simple field.
We are no longer able to vent, refill, or guess. It has become imperative for HVAC technicians to understand a larger more complex system. For generation it was okay to gorge upon the simple repairs such as “beer can cold” or over-sizing but we are no longer as a wasteful of a society as we once were.

We now have many aspects that must be equalized or micromanaged to create a complex yet well maintained system.
Technicians must be knowledgeable in
1. engineering,
2. energy conservation,
3. physics and thermodynamics,
4. aerodynamics,
5. electronics,
6. government regulation,
7. plumbing,
8. sales,
9. business ethics,
10. professional appearance,
11. political correctness,
12. customer management,
13. critical customer diffusion,
14. and the list goes on.

Technicians are now a PR engineering scientist wearing a company designed suit and carrying a door to door sells brochure.

Yet, we want to pay them a garage mechanics wage and do two to four years of training before they enter the field.

And then we complain about having trouble finding qualified people.

In short, to gain a better base of personal we need to offer a better life style.

We need companies to become involved in the youth outreach for a more physical and growth related activities in our communities, such as boyscouts, girlscouts, community programs, and self-confidence building activities.

We need to use social media to expand upon the career possibilities of physical labor work such as BAS, Management, Ownership, Energy Conservation, Massive Distribution companies, growing field of innovations, and socially acceptable living as well as increase the understanding to the population as to how the industry has changed and what HVAC requires.

We need to motivate colleges and universities to create, offer, and expand upon scholastic endeavors in the field. We need to make HVAC a part of every universities Science and Engineering curriculum.

And we need to increase the wages/benefits/personal growth of a long lasting career in the HVAC industry.

Great stuff.

GT

[BBeerme]

You sound like you want to work. I wish I could give guys here on this site opportunities. But there are a couple of problems. First, I'm just a worker-bee. Not much into management. In fact, the more management involved, the less likely I'll survive.

But I diverge. Hard to say what you should do.

As a kid I pushed a lawn mower around the neighborhood. Made a lot of money, relatively speaking, of course. Hey, five bucks a lawn was good money. Then this old man finally told me I was worth ten bucks a lawn. It was difficult to process, but somehow I figured out how to charge others more money.

That actually worked into a sort of handy man business, as a teenager.

To get into the HVAC field, you need a bit more. Be humble. Most guys the place I currently work for get fired because they over sell them selves.

Present yourself (clean cut of course) as someone who will work for pennies as though you are working for dollars. Wear the blue work clothes and boots to the interview. And if there is no interview, show up dressed like that anyway.

Follow up on phone calls in person. Dressed in work clothes. Just keep being there. The season is approaching. A point will come when you are in the right place at the right time. That's just the way life works.

Just keep doing it and pushing.

..Yes we do...we just google it... geez

Just playing around.. I don't know man I wish I had good HVAC opportunities...but companies just pass me by. LOLLL, I even offered to work for free. But I have a feeling something is going to happen this Spring. So hopes are high to break ground. But I also think there are a lot of young people just thrown into hvac and really don't want to be there. Just like others are saying they may come from a bad background or environment. You guys just gotta weed out the bad ones and find the good ones.