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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
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    Northern Michigan
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    The best approach is to contact Tech support. Obviously, make sure you have the model and serial of the unit you are working on. I would also have a manometer because they will probably ask you to check the pressure drop across your coils.
    I have all my check point's and recommended values provided by Tech Support written down at my unit.
    "Close Enough" doesn't fly with these units.
    Good luck

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle, WA
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavisServicesLL View Post
    I have been called in on a Dessert air system for an enclosed pool.
    To the best of my knowledge this system had been designed for the application and installed correctly.
    The new owners of the house have no history though and I found the water supply lines from the pool cut and disconnected.
    I checked for refrigerant and it is charged leading me to believe the water cooled condenser was/is not an issue.
    I reconnected the water lines and started the system up.
    It is running!
    What should I be looking for next?
    The pool water supply/return lines are for heating the pool when a call for dehumidification is required and, typically, the Dessert air has only the secondary heating function with a separate boiler or heating system for primary source of pool water heating.

    Unless there is an outside condensor for an A/C option the dehumidifier can not work as without the pool water connected the hot discharge gas has no where to go so the system will shut down on high head.

    And there must be a balancing valve installed to bypass the dehumidifiers pool water heat exchanger as the systems are not built to handle the full GPM from the pool pump. And the balancing valve must be set to maintain a constant differential between the inlet/outlet of the pool water heat exchange.

    The basic & main design for these indoor pool systems is for control of the humidity inside of the enclosed pool room. With the right unit they can also control the room temperature for heating & with the A/C option the cooling of the room. They also should influence the pool room by keeping a negative pressure in the pool room so gases/vapors don't enter the residence if it is attached.

    So the more advanced indoor pool room systems dehumidify first, control the pool room air heat/cooling if included & use the compressor energy to heat the pool water. And the control system, especially the humidity sensor, is a very important part of the successful operation of these systems.
    "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers it can bribe the public with the public's own money.
    - Alexis de Toqueville, 1835

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
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    78,376
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    And the thread was only started 5 year ago.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    St. Louis
    Posts
    1,269
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    Poolpak +1

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
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    11
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    anyone saying to keep air temp 2C above water temp to limit evaporation has never run a swimming pool or if he does he will run out of business very soon. Customers want warm water, at least 28C for amateur or slow swimming (which is the 90% of the people) and minimum 32C for little kids learning or fisiotherapy. if you follow the above rule you should keep air temp to 30C and will cook everyone working in the pool make the feel the water colder than it is to the customers, so stop suggesting this thing that would work only virtually.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Dover, DE
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambrusco View Post
    anyone saying to keep air temp 2C above water temp to limit evaporation has never run a swimming pool or if he does he will run out of business very soon. Customers want warm water, at least 28C for amateur or slow swimming (which is the 90% of the people) and minimum 32C for little kids learning or fisiotherapy. if you follow the above rule you should keep air temp to 30C and will cook everyone working in the pool make the feel the water colder than it is to the customers, so stop suggesting this thing that would work only virtually.
    Please attend training for pool room conditioning and proper setting of equipment.
    From the PoolPak factory technical service manual page #2.

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    This is the manual I used for all my factory startups.
    I havent failed. Ive just found 10,000 ways that wont work. - Thomas Edison

    Its not whether you get knocked down, its whether you get up. - Vince Lombardi

    "In this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics" - Homer Simpson

    Local 486 Instructor & Service Technician

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  8. #33
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    11
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    Quote Originally Posted by rider77 View Post
    Please attend training for pool room conditioning and proper setting of equipment.
    From the PoolPak factory technical service manual page #2.

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    This is the manual I used for all my factory startups.
    This is a thing written by someone staying in a room full of books and never lived inside a pool. . The only situation you can keep air 2 degrees more than water is a pool with attended by only fast swimmers or athletes, which as i said before will run out of business very quickly. Practice without theory is more valuable than theory without practice

    Inviato dal mio HUAWEI VNS-L31 utilizzando Tapatalk

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Dover, DE
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambrusco View Post
    This is a thing written by someone staying in a room full of books and never lived inside a pool. . The only situation you can keep air 2 degrees more than water is a pool with attended by only fast swimmers or athletes, which as i said before will run out of business very quickly. Practice without theory is more valuable than theory without practice

    Inviato dal mio HUAWEI VNS-L31 utilizzando Tapatalk
    No, none of that is correct.
    None of the hundreds of nanitoriums I serviced, or still service, “went out of business very quickly”.
    The equipment and conditioning it provides is for the swimmers in the pool, not the people around it.
    That book was written by the engineers that designed the equipment, the people that built it and the service techs that maintain it. I’d highly doubt they are wrong.
    Unfortunately it seems you have an opinion that is flawed.
    I havent failed. Ive just found 10,000 ways that wont work. - Thomas Edison

    Its not whether you get knocked down, its whether you get up. - Vince Lombardi

    "In this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics" - Homer Simpson

    Local 486 Instructor & Service Technician

  10. #35
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
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    I take care of several pool units at various hotels.

    They're all set up to maintain the air temp 2F above water temp. And have been open for many years.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by rider77 View Post
    No, none of that is correct.
    None of the hundreds of nanitoriums I serviced, or still service, went out of business very quickly.
    The equipment and conditioning it provides is for the swimmers in the pool, not the people around it.
    That book was written by the engineers that designed the equipment, the people that built it and the service techs that maintain it. Id highly doubt they are wrong.
    Unfortunately it seems you have an opinion that is flawed.
    I agree, is the best for the building but not for the comfort of people inside it.

    Inviato dal mio HUAWEI VNS-L31 utilizzando Tapatalk

  12. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle, WA
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    If a pool is kept covered except when used - very little - then the pool room air can be lowered a few degrees for energy savings if the customer understands the consequence meaning when the swimmer gets out of the pool the heat will be wicked from their body since the room temp is less than the pool temp so they will have a very good chance of feeling cold.

    I have a good many customers that keep their pools covered - based on my advice - and they accept the cooling off fact for the money that they will save in energy. And heating the air takes less energy than heating the water so I also instruct them that they won't save all that much energy in lowering the air temperature.

    As a humorous side story made as briefly as I can, a new customer with a very large roof mounted Dectron called me about his unit costing so much money to run. So I asked him to give me a day by day run down of how he operates his system. Every morning he gets in the pool for one hour and a little before he turns up the pool room air to 82 degrees. When finished he turns down the pool room temperature to 72 to save on heating costs. Then twice a week he rents out his pool to a lady that does child proof swimming to infants and she does the same per his instructions.

    The control system is a factory high end software centered control system that has a joined heat/cool set point that only has the choice of a differential between the two. His differential between switching to heating or cooling of the pool room air being only 4 degrees caused the heating of the air by a separate large gas fired boiler then, when set down to save energy, indexed the Dectron to energize both compressors to cooling to maintain the now 72 degree room cooling set point.

    He was floored. He was even more floored when I showed him videos/pictures of the condition of the unit inside due to the other fact that he would shut the system completely down between midnight and sunrise.

    He's a software engineer so he hates listening to me much but I let him know it's his house, his unit and his money and how he likes to throw him money and damage his systems is up to him. Now he has started to listen a little.

    The system is 8 years old, I think, and never serviced. The exhaust fan had failed from rust and had a layer of rust over the blower belt. I had to remove everything and rebuild that as a started.

    Now I have him convinced to allow the system to run on fan at night and to not dink with the controls during the day. I don't think he's doing ti though but that is OK with me as I just keep getting more work.
    "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers it can bribe the public with the public's own money.
    - Alexis de Toqueville, 1835

  13. #38
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    11
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    Ok, private pool, is not my case, I was speaking about public facilities with 2000/4000 access per week. We have pools with water at 32/33 C so following the books written by engineers who never stayed inside a pool for more than an hour, i should keep air at 34C. It's nothing less than hilarious.

    Inviato dal mio HUAWEI VNS-L31 utilizzando Tapatalk

  14. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Central Texas
    Posts
    259
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    Isn't 1.8F = 1C, so if you have the water set to 32C, the air should be set to 33C
    (32x1.8)+32=89.6F
    (33x1.8)+32=91.4F

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