Union VS Non-Union?

[zw17]

Not sure if you're in a Local or if you are if it's even a UA Local. Those first numbers reflect working non-Union for HS here in this market, considering 2,000 Hrs. with 160 Hrs. being paid time off. No overtime was factored.
The other numbers reflect working Union for any National Sig or one of the 3 largest non-National Sigs, considering 1,980 Hrs. with no paid time off. No overtime or doubletime factored.
There's absolutely no comparison.

I have asked him point blank a number of times to name what local he is a member with, he refuses to answer that question, so take what he says with a grain a salt.

Also notice he is taking the average time worked, meaning he is factoring in the guys on the bench, out of town, etc... That is a very poor reflection of hours worked.

Further more, if he is UA, he is taking into account the pipefitters which we all know don't get the hours and OT that the MES and service side do get.

Now factor in a company truck, tools, lots of OT and DT, and a buck or two above scale if you are any good, then you have a decent representation of a union tech.

[neophytes serendipity]

Yes, I am in a Local, but not a UA local. Building trades and service.

Like it or not, my numbers are in the ballpark in my area and in my local. No travelers.

Average is just that. Some will make more, some will make less. Yup, there are active members making much less than the average and some making their 6 figures like nothing is happening.

Yes, there are bound to be some (small) errors because the Local does not report the number of hours worked by classification, nor do they break out the number of members in each classification, at least not to plain old rank and file members.

Very few are working anything close to 1,980 hours at Journeyman rate, at this time, in my neck of the woods.

Guess I should have went UA

[MechanicallyInclined]

No disrespect but Sheet Metal Workers, Electricians or Operating Engineers Unions have no business in HVACR. To the guy in OH, is HS out there? HS is the Commercial Refrigeration OEM's Service division.

[neophytes serendipity]

No disrespect taken.

[qwerty hvac]

No disrespect but Sheet Metal Workers, Electricians or Operating Engineers Unions have no business in HVACR. To the guy in OH, is HS out there. HS is the Commercial Refrigeration OEM's Service division.

Hate to tell you but sheet metal workers started HVACR. Fitters are wanna be mechanics who have no clue about air flow. No disrespect.


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[neophytes serendipity]

Fitters are wanna be mechanics who have no clue about air flow.

That's been my experience so far.

Of course, the piping is way too hard for mere mortals to figure out...

[MechanicallyInclined]

UA HVACR Techs know all about air flow especially when working on Commercial Refrigeration. Tell me where's the ductwork in Com. Ref.? Auditing an air flow system in Air Conditioning is not an HVACR Tech, neither is installing the air flow system. Take it how you want. So how is work in SMW Union going?

[qwerty hvac]

Of course, the piping is way too hard for mere mortals to figure out...

The only thing they do very well is weld pipe. You can have that work with all the fumes and brain damage. Oh wait I think I figured out their problem. Lol


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[qwerty hvac]

UA HVACR Techs know all about air flow especially when working on Commercial Refrigeration. Tell me where's the ductwork in Com. Ref.? Auditing an air flow system in Air Conditioning is not an HVACR Tech, neither is installing the air flow system. Take it how you want. So how is work in SMW Union going?

Don't know. Not in the Union.


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[MechanicallyInclined]

Sounds like both of you joined the wrong Union. Doh!

[qwerty hvac]

Sounds like both of you joined the wrong Union. Doh!

Nope got out to make more money then the union will pay. What's wrong with that?


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[qwerty hvac]

And around my parts the tin knockers make about a buck more an hour then the UA techs and fitters. How does that work?


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[neophytes serendipity]

Sounds like both of you joined the wrong Union. Doh!

Quite possible. I could join the UA, but I suspect that my age will work against me once out of the apprenticeship. The UA has to accept me if I jump through their hoops and get in, but the employers will discriminate.

Nope got out to make more money then the union will pay. What's wrong with that?

I am beginning to agree with this.

[qwerty hvac]

I am beginning to agree with this.

Union contractors are becoming the low payers.


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[neophytes serendipity]

And around my parts the tin knockers make about a buck more an hour then the UA techs and fitters. How does that work?

In my area, the building trades fitters make more than the sheet metal journeymen.

But, the UA HVAC cardholders make less than the BT fitters, and that rate is less than the sheet metal journeyman service card rate.

More difficult to get into the UA HVAC end, which is kind of hard to understand when the rate is lower.

[MechanicallyInclined]

Depends if they're Local Sigs or National Sigs. In Chicago, UA HVACR Tech/SJm working for CBSS, Emcor, HBS, HS, JCSS, SBTS, etc. are co-equals in pay to the Pipefitters and Pipe Welders. $45.05/HR O-T-C. Like I said, maybe the wrong Union. Go to one of the big ones and ask for a Serviceman position. That's 80% of SJm, if you can live with that. UA A, B, C Card are for Local Sigs.

[neophytes serendipity]

So, what's the difference between a local signatory and national?

Yes. Chicago fitters seem to have multiple cards and pay rates.

[valdelocc]

And around my parts the tin knockers make about a buck more an hour then the UA techs and fitters. How does that work?


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UA tech here!just 45mn away from you and around here tin knockers make $1.25 less an hour and their benefits are not as good as ours, somebody is feeding you bad info.

[valdelocc]

Union contractors are becoming the low payers.


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In you area union contractors pay an average $10 to $15 more an hour than non-union, we are at $52 an hour total package nobody can touch that, last I heard JLL was paying $25 an hour(if you are good) with really crappy bennies.

[MechanicallyInclined]

National are Service Journeyman which are equal to the highest HVACR Jm locally.
Serviceman 80% of the SJm.
Service Tradesman 50% of the SJm. Apprentices are rare here.

Local are A Card Jm can be Engineered Systems service.
B Card Jm can be Commercial AC and Refrigeration.
C Card Jm can be Light Com. AC and Ref. along with Res. AC.