Transition faults.......RTAC500.......

[Mongo and me]

OK, been learning these monsters, up to about 9 of them now.
cir. 2b is not doing right on transition, never around to see it happen, reset and the unit does well for a few weeks, then Pop it trips.

From the manual:
The Starter Module did not receive a transition complete
signal in the designated time from its command to transition.
The must hold time from the Starter Module transition
command is 1 second. The Must trip time from the transition
command is 6 seconds. Actual design is 2.5 seconds. This
diagnostic is active only for Y-Delta, Auto-Transformer,
Primary Reactor, and X-Line Starters.



Not much in the manual for trouble shooting just tells me it’s a trip and do a reset. It’s now to a point that I have to look deeper and see what is failing!!
Let me have the field tested fix with an understandable explanation of things for this fault.

I can go in and look, but would like to know a bit more of what to be looking at and or for........

One of my limits is I am not able to just start and stop this unit, and I am not allowed to use the lap top for hooking up, well not yet, I am getting my own lap top ready soon to use......it's the boss's policy, so let’s just let that one rest.........(I get a battery for the old basement lap top and I'm good to go with getting software and stuff, will get back on that in a week, battery in on order now). Also when I do get to start the unit it is with limits, we must have 2 or 3 running all the time, so if I do get to run it, I'm allowed "ONE" hick-up, then pull out and regroup before any re-try's !!!

So I am asking for an explanation of the transition sequence, from a basic moron level to the pro tech level, even thro an engineer in there too!!

[stanbyyourword]

auxillary contacts

[Healey Nut]

First stop the hardware store for a can of Jig A Loo .
Take apart the contacts that have the mechanical interlock between then , clean it lubricate it , put it all back together exactly the same way . Problem solved .
As far as the sequence of operation you will probably find it on here if you use the key word search .
Its to much typing for me at this time of the AM to type and explain after a 1.30am service call to a Multistack POS .

[jayguy]

are these the benshaw contactors or the C-H contactors (later versions used the Benshaws)?

if it is the benshaw contactors, then like the tired Graham said, you need to tear the contactors out, remove the contactor interlock between them, remove any burrs or plastic 'flashing' material, lubricate with a non-greasy 'moly-lube'-like spray and re-assemble.

when you look at the interlock, it really is a very cheap piece of plastic crap. do not order a new one, thinking that they have upgraded the interlock to something without these ,because they haven't. the lubricant works very well. i personally use a commercial/industrial door lock lubricant that a customer turned me on to and it works well. you will want something that dries and will not collect dust/dirt over time and cause you problems.

i had a customer have issues with this very problem at start up. the building was a condo with tennants that had a collective net worth of over a few billion dollars or so...chiller has to worky! i removed the interlocks and the problem went away. however, without the interlocks, the risk of a massive fireball went up a few billion percent too! ordered new ones, and the problem came back randomly. sprayed lubricant on them and never had the problem come back in 3 years now.

[stanbyyourword]

[Mongo and me]

JIG A LOO !!!! Got it, now down to my local ACE harware store...........
a 1:30am call, well I feel your sleep !!! Thats why I came out of the service truck and got lucky landing this gig !! 12 hour shifts, NO ON CALL, work 5 days off 5 days, then work 2 days, then off 2 days, SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE T !!!!!!

Took me 34 years in the trade to get to this point, I do love it, doing 9 day straight run of 12's covering the holidays for the other guys doing vacation and all............

Now then this cleaner goop, I would take it the standard "Contact" cleaner should work, I like it when guys say I have this great stuff, well I understand that but the sexy lady behind the counter justy gives me the "WHAT ?" look when I say a can of good stuff please..........

My regular "Kroll" is out, and the "Bolt Buster" will draw dust, I figure old reliable WD40 may be ok, but you guys say it has to get dry when done so I figure that "Contact Cleaner Spray " must be next...... Hey just flash me the name on the can of stuff and I'll find it, kind of like that special lube we all use for O rings on a YORK seal kit rebuild, best in the trade, won't make it swell up !!! or maybe some TRANE red **** !!

Well I have my work cut out for the next few weeks, will look at geting ready to open up and tear it apart to clean and lube, great info and I thank you all for the feed back.

I would search more offten, justy I cant spell for beans and I am not very good at this computor stuff. Besides I like to see the viens raise up on soem of you guys !! I love the diffrent ways ya can say the same thing !!

Back to my bucket !!

[Healey Nut]

Jig A Loo . I'm serious . Not sure if its available in the states . You need a silicone based non greasy no residue lubricant . Not WD40 its highly flammable and not contact cleaner .

[Mongo and me]

Well it doesn't look like I can get it here, and its out of stock on thier web site, I wonder if it can be mailed ??

Will have to call next year and talk to em......... looks like good stuff !! You swear by it !! ???

[ryan1088]

Seems like everyone has pretty well covered it. Worse case scenario you'll be in for some contactors. We put 3 sets on 10+ year old machines for the first time and all the transition faults went away.

[Mongo and me]

JIG A LOO< my kingdom for a can of JIG A LOO,
any back up idea's ?? preferable from USA, no harm intended !!
I'm guessing a good brake drum cleaner would work, I'll cross the MSD sheets......

Thing is I need a lubricating factor.........

OH WELL< it will wait till next year, time to go ponder ......

[Healey Nut]

I swear by Jig A Loo in that it fixed exactly the problem you are having for me . Im sure if you just go to Lowes or whatever good hardware/automotive type place you can find and get a dry silicone based non flammable lube you will be good .

[Mongo and me]

Good enogh for me !!
Sucks this 12 hr day stuff, will make a pit stop at HD today, its on the way home.......

Well go get some rest now, gona be a long night ...........

Hows the snow up there this year ??

Looks like we get to start our winter next week, will see 20 deg. after our 60's today !!

[Healey Nut]

Not to much snow as yet but its coming . 32degrees F today but we have had some cold nights down to -15/18 degrees f and yes I did say minus ???????

[Mongo and me]

KEEP IT UP THERE !!!

Got a can of the Jig A Loo on the way, every one here is givign me a funny look, I must be saying it wrong "Jig aloo !!" LOL....

HAPPY NEW YEAR< OMG, look only 3 more hours to go today, man this reading on the weekend is great !!! Time fly's by and I may even learn a thing ot two, hard part is remembering it !!! At my dateline, sleep is a bad thing, I forget too much by next day !!

[Mongo and me]

HEY, before this dies, anyone have a PDF or referance for parts to the starter relays ..... Would like to look it over before I get into it and maybe have a set of contacts before I open the paitent, hate to get half way and discover things bad or worse BROKEN !!!

chiller :
RTAC5004UPONUAFNL4TU1CDCNA6NN1OCG

Thanks,

[R123]

I used LPS greaseless lubricant and it worked great. Going on 4 years now with no problems. Don't overdue it, a small drop goes a long way.

[stanbyyourword]

jigaboo