Trane RTAA 215// circuit a,b intermittent low oil flow codes 199

[aggiechillertech]

It finally did it while I was there went first thing in the morning about 4:00. Had the gauges on it and ammeter. As soon as she tried to start it failed right off.

Trane first start syndrome as Graham mentioned early on. Going to wait until after the first and order the slide valve and do one circuit first.

[jayguy]

It finally did it while I was there went first thing in the morning about 4:00. Had the gauges on it and ammeter. As soon as she tried to start it failed right off. ..

that is not 'first start syndrome'. what kind of time frame is 'failed right off'?

1 second? 2 seconds? 2 minutes?

[aggiechillertech]

Sorry didn't clarify. It started circuit A fired 1 fan instantly then another 2 fans at 25 seconds of run time head pressure skyrocketed to 350 then at 390 it tripped on oil flow. I had 52 lbs of drop across the oil filter as it was happening. At about the same time it tripped it fired on the rest of the fans on that bank. My helper said it was pulling 102 amps instantly on start up. This whole process took about a minute start to finish. Yesterday morning it was off on high pressure. It takes turns one time it will be high pressure next time low oil flow.

I shut it off completely let the pressures equalize and fired it up again and it worked perfectly. pressures averaging 65 and 205 with 60 degree water OAT 52 degrees. Ran about 15 minutes and system satisfied and shut back off.

First time it did it was the first start of the morning I shut it down overnight to try and make it act up.

Am I on the right track with this one or do I need to try again and get some more data.

[River runner]

The prior posts suggest everything from cleaning coils ( especially that top inside area ) checking fan rotation and technical service bulletins from Trane. The local Trane branches and even Peublo Colorado will say the same thing. But not to pick this apart - is this a RTAA 200 or 240 ? I had read your post and I believe you said it was a 220 that did not have a remote barrel. You might want to take the others suggestions about Lip seal, wear ring,unloader piston ,and load and unload solenoids and start there.Most 100 ton compressors have Lip seal failures . When a motor starts at 100 % and pressure builds slowly it's a Lip seal.If it builds fast it's a wear ring. Another option is to get a factory rep. and /or price out the R-newal program for the customer.

[jayguy]

Sorry didn't clarify. It started circuit A fired 1 fan instantly then another 2 fans at 25 seconds of run time head pressure skyrocketed to 350 then at 390 it tripped on oil flow. I had 52 lbs of drop across the oil filter as it was happening. At about the same time it tripped it fired on the rest of the fans on that bank. My helper said it was pulling 102 amps instantly on start up. This whole process took about a minute start to finish. Yesterday morning it was off on high pressure. It takes turns one time it will be high pressure next time low oil flow.

I shut it off completely let the pressures equalize and fired it up again and it worked perfectly. pressures averaging 65 and 205 with 60 degree water OAT 52 degrees. Ran about 15 minutes and system satisfied and shut back off.

First time it did it was the first start of the morning I shut it down overnight to try and make it act up.

Am I on the right track with this one or do I need to try again and get some more data.

now THAT sounds like first start syndrome to me. redo the slide valve.

[Healey Nut]

now THAT sounds like first start syndrome to me. redo the slide valve.

See post 52 ....guess he didnt believe me ??

[Mongo and me]

From post #52 "Time for some new hockey pucks."
Just to clearify, a hocky puck in the TRANE arena woudl be a slide valve rebuild kit ???

I LOVE THIS STUFF !!!!

I have just spent the better part of my shift reading this incredible tread, as it moved along I would feel the frustration and jubilation of a problem talked about , and loked over by ALL kinds of minds, it is AMAZING !!!

My compliments to all, for your imput and ability to move this item along to a point of positive outcome, AGGIECHILLERTECH, you will of course let us knwo when you have completed the repairs and of any further shut downs...........

Its been fun and reall, next time lets make it reall fun !!

[Healey Nut]

The hockey puck is the slide valve piston c/w seals .

[aggiechillertech]

Thanks for the input. My customer ok'd slide valve rebuild and parts are on order. As soon as it's done I will let everyone know but I'm positive it will be good to go afterwards. I apologize for not getting back with anyone earlier the holidays were kinda hectic.

In the middle of all of that we went for our first sonogram last week to see our new little one at ten weeks of progress along only to find out we'd be having a miscarriage instead.

Thanks again. jayguy graham r123 and all of the others who have donated ideas and time to helping me get to the bottom of this.

[stanbyyourword]

if the chiller is short cycling so much ,due to low load / gross oversize, you need to disable one circuit, and probably have a monthly schedule to change between them, This is a school right? Im almost positive RTAA has "current limit " parameter that will allow you to say keep at 50-60% for longer run cycles, the question I have is why are they even running all night long and so early? Im very sorry to hear about your baby , that cant be easy compiled with a stressful job, stan

[aggiechillertech]

This unit does several buildings and has a ancient EMS system on the complex. Usually this time of year it's off more than it's on even during the day. But early in the morning around 4 everything starts coming out of night setback to get rooms down to temp and that's usually when it trips. Even then at full load it runs about 15-20 minutes and shuts off.

Todays better than it has been since wednesday when we found out. The wife is definitely in better spirits.

[stanbyyourword]

ahh ok, may follow my advice still , disable one ckt and put some limit start w 60% on the running one , be much better for the machine longer runs , less starts , you should still have alarms to ems in which case it faults stan

[stanbyyourword]

any of the Trane gurus know if there are remote contacts on chiller per a/b ckts to remotely enable? or just the main run? stan

I gather if you have Tracer it can communicate this digitally?

[aggiechillertech]

The UCM just has the main start stop input. It takes control of Circuit A and B from there. That is food for thought for sure to try once it's back up working the way she needs to be

[Dallas Duster]

any of the Trane gurus know if there are remote contacts on chiller per a/b ckts to remotely enable? or just the main run? stan

I gather if you have Tracer it can communicate this digitally?

I think you are correct on the first statementas far as enabling a certain circuit not just a main run.

[stanbyyourword]

Hi "main run." ? as to the individual circuit remote contacts , I just read diagram and yes they are available , so you could have ems guys program to alternate ckts for even runs , stan

[Dallas Duster]

Hi "main run." ? as to the individual circuit remote contacts , I just read diagram and yes they are available , so you could have ems guys program to alternate ckts for even runs , stan

This

[stanbyyourword]

main run as 100% got it

[jayguy]

i would not recommend 'disabling' any circuit for an oversized condition. i do agree with current limiting the chiller during the low load times of the year to give the chiller a chance to have some run time without excessive cycling. this can be done by the BAS and it can be done manually.

unfortunately, the current limit is for the chiller %RLA instead of the individual circuits/compressors, however, it may still help.

i hope all goes well with your wife. talk about it A LOT with her. our 3rd pregnancy was a very early miscarriage...like 2 weeks into the pregnancy...we didn't talk about it much because it was an 'accident' and we didn't plan on it and we never had any other children...i did not think it was a big deal...WRONG! good luck!

[R123]

I agree with Jayguy. Also, you can set your "differential to start" setpoint up high to prevent short cycling.

I'm also very sorry to hear about your baby.