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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    MASON NECK VA
    Posts
    17

    Fulton Boiler problems

    The boilers i have are Fulton phc 1400 pulse. Cant get one boiler to fire up. Start up it times threw purge the hits once and then times out and restarts.Then the boiler looks out. I have checked the gas pressure and the spark plug flame sensor are new. These boiles have been a problem from a very poorly installed system. Any on have this problem besides It being the Fulton Boiler nightmare.
    THANKS SAILFISH

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    I'm sure you've already checked, but have you checked the gv vent line for clogs? I use to work on a lot fulton's in virginia beach and (i forgot the name of them) bugs would nest inside the vent line clogging it up causing lock-outs on me.


    It's hard to stop a Trane - Until you apply line voltage to it!!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    Also, have you checked the air intake flapper for clogs? Those rings get clogged pretty often too. Or it'll vibrate itself closed.


    It's hard to stop a Trane - Until you apply line voltage to it!!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    MASON NECK VA
    Posts
    17
    Hey Lafittejdubb
    I have replaced the air intake flappers in the back. I cant find the any start settings for any of the adjustments for the flappers or the front air regulators. All of them were replaced with the maintanance kit. I did not check the air intake yet. But i get strong air down into the chamber for the combustion air. I did not check the gas line vents if your talking about the OPD vents. If you have any more suggestions please reply. I thought i had these boilers set up great they ran a full season with out a problem The REP from the boiler MF said they needed Fisher regulators installed and the changed the Church over to to PSI. Did the boilers you worked on have only on gas regulator or two? These boilers now have two regs on to step down 2 psi to 3 to 5 wc then the second regulator sets the pressure for the boiler. The gas is set the same but cant get past the start up. Some times it will hit then take off, once warm it will not refire it just fails to start then loks out.
    THANKS SAILFISH

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,336
    Quote Originally Posted by SAILFISH View Post
    The boilers i have are Fulton phc 1400 pulse. Cant get one boiler to fire up. Start up it times threw purge the hits once and then times out and restarts.Then the boiler looks out. I have checked the gas pressure and the spark plug flame sensor are new. These boiles have been a problem from a very poorly installed system. Any on have this problem besides It being the Fulton Boiler nightmare.
    THANKS SAILFISH
    Not to familiar with the PHC's, but the PHW's need to see proper flame signal(the newer ones) and closure of FSS (flame sensing switch).

    The FSS is feed by the air proving switch. So during "prepurge", the air proving switch should close the NO contacts. And then for ignition, the switch should close the NC contacts, feed the FSS, and combustion ignition will close the FSS.

    Have you try adjusting the air proving switch?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    MASON NECK VA
    Posts
    17
    I have adjusted the switch. The boiler will hit off but will not always stay running. some times it will go threw the purge cycle and fire off and run then the next cycle the boiler boiler will not restart. The boiler is just so inconsistant and will not start. On start up it will go threw purge and pop then lose flame signal then try to reperge.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,336
    Quote Originally Posted by SAILFISH View Post
    I have adjusted the switch. The boiler will hit off but will not always stay running. some times it will go threw the purge cycle and fire off and run then the next cycle the boiler boiler will not restart. The boiler is just so inconsistant and will not start. On start up it will go threw purge and pop then lose flame signal then try to reperge.
    It really sounds like a problem with your air switches.

    If the times you get it to run, your flame sensing voltage is good. I would go to the pressure switches and mimic proper sequence with jumpers and see what happens.

    Btw- You have checked the condensate and flue for obstructions?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    MASON NECK VA
    Posts
    17
    I have jumped the air switch befor, i also cleaned the condesate trap and lines to the boiler. When it starts purges 35 sec gives spark and then puffs once looses flame v and then restarts. Jumpnig the switch did not make a diffrence. Its like the gas is in the wrong area on start up or to lean to rich and it just hits to late or not at all. No where can i find any of the adjustments for the flappers or the starting point for the mixture. The only thing i have is the gas psi for the fuel rail. Im going to a Fulton class in Palaski Ny in November. I think this is the only way to get there start up sheets and peramiters for start. Like i said prior the boilers were hacked in and the Co that put them in went under. You should see the rest of the job ( SUCKS ) WORST INSTALLERS EVER

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,336
    Quote Originally Posted by SAILFISH View Post
    I have jumped the air switch befor, i also cleaned the condesate trap and lines to the boiler. When it starts purges 35 sec gives spark and then puffs once looses flame v and then restarts. Jumpnig the switch did not make a diffrence. Its like the gas is in the wrong area on start up or to lean to rich and it just hits to late or not at all. No where can i find any of the adjustments for the flappers or the starting point for the mixture. The only thing i have is the gas psi for the fuel rail. Im going to a Fulton class in Palaski Ny in November. I think this is the only way to get there start up sheets and peramiters for start. Like i said prior the boilers were hacked in and the Co that put them in went under. You should see the rest of the job ( SUCKS ) WORST INSTALLERS EVER
    So after 3 tries, what is the fault code on the primary control?

    Rule of thumb is 1.5 turns on air flapper from fully closed.

    If the boiler burps, then the gas is in the right place. What switch are you jumping? You need to jump two switches.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Pulaski, NY
    Posts
    23
    Hello Sailfish, I'm sorry to hear about your boiler troubles. Hopefully I can point you in the right direction.

    There are only (4) items that are required to be inspected and/or replaced yearly for a Fulton Pulse boiler: the spark plug, flame rod, air flapper gaskets, and gas flappers gaskets. If there is still an issue after all these items have been inspected and/or replaced then you may have a combustion problem and the gas or air may need to be adjusted.

    When the boiler does run, are you able to put an analyzer on the boiler long enough to get a reading? I read that you have 3-5 w.c. incoming. If that is incoming to your gas train then it is insufficient. There should be 7 w.c. incoming when the unit is running at high fire. If the 3-5 w.c. is instead referencing your last elbow pressure then it sounds like the correct range but it should be a fairly steady reading and not bouncing from 3-5. Some fluctuation may occur, but that much would suggest a regulator issue; either the stepdown or the regulator on the boiler.

    You also mentioned that the incoming gas pressure was increased to PSI. If the regulator on the boiler is a RV series regulator and it was allowed to see this pressure before the stepdown was installed it could have damaged the boiler regulator.

    We've seen past installations which have had low spots in the exhaust venting which caused pooling of water. When the boiler starts it pushes the water out of this pocket and creates a blockage, preventing the unit from running properly.

    Please also take a look at your linkage (specifically your exhaust butterfly). It should be fully open when the unit starts (or purge) and the gas butterfly should be open but may not be at 100%.

    If you've checked everything above, my best suggestion would be that you contact your local Fulton sales representative. They are likely the same group who sponsored you for our November service training (you mentioned you will be attending). You can also find your local rep HERE. If all else fails, please contact Fulton directly and we can direct you to the appropriate service personnel.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    Sorry to get back so late. The nut on the front of the flapper assembly is your air intake adjustment. I can't remember the setting for it, but you can download the IOM from Fulton's website and then close the air intake (clockwise) then reopen IAW the IOM.

    I would definetly look at the gas valve vent line! Disconnect from the gas valve and blow in it, or even better, blow some nitrogen or co2 through it to ensure it's clear. Temporarily disconnecting it from the valve would answer the question if it's clogged.

    Something else I found on these POS's; they are very sensitive to incoming gas psi. Use a water-in-tube manometer to measure gas psi drop during start-up, and you'll see a more accurate psi drop in incoming gas psi. If it's dropping below 3.5"wc then that may be your problem. Digital manometers don't show that drop like a water n tube does!


    It's hard to stop a Trane - Until you apply line voltage to it!!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    Print that IOM and call the Fulton rep while your on it. They're pretty helpful, OTT everytime I called they sound like they smoked 200 cigarettes and drank 2 pots a coffe that morning.


    It's hard to stop a Trane - Until you apply line voltage to it!!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,336
    Fulton tech service is horrible! Sorry "FultonBoiler".

    SAILFISH, sorry I gave you some bad info. 1.5 turns is max opening on air flapper. I should have gone through my work PC, before responding. But anyway, I went through my notes today, and found that the pulses I work on end up being just off a full turn. 14-18 screws if your counting from fully closed.

    Then I got thinking about your description of a puff. They can puff if they are trying to delay ignite. What I do is first verify that the air pressure switch is sending 120v to the comb switch as soon as the main ignition is activated. Then if it is, I verify I'm getting close to the recommended manifold gas pressure at last tee before the gas flapper.(This is assuming you already verified the gas butterfly and air butterfly valves are at full open.) And if you still can't light off, then turn your air flapper fully closed and go 1 full turn open. That should light her off. Once you light off, then dial in your high fire by verifying proper manifold pressure, then adjust air flapper. Now your ready to bring it down into lower firing ranges and adjust your air linkage.

    They can be tough to work on, but once you get them tuned, they aren't so bad. Would I pick a different boiler to work on, of course. But you get paid to keep these things going.

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