is this safe

[pacnw]

found a propane insert sitting on a piece of cardboard on the carpet up against a wall. it has been in operation this way for at least 8 years and the rest of the install looks correct according to the manual.

this unit was meant to be installed in a framework. clearances were 0", zero inches to combustibles except for 1/2" to back wall.

It had some other issues so I tagged it and shut off gas to it, but just wanted to know what others thought.

[lynn comstock]

Sounds both legal and stupid.

[trouble time]

Sounds both legal and stupid.

especially the STUPID part.

[hearthman]

Just to clarify: an 'insert' is designed to be inserted into an existing fireplace. Otherwise, it would be a factory built fireplace or stove.

Factory built fireplaces, almost without exception, are tested and designed for installation on a combustible floor. Most mfr.s specify that carpet must be pulled back so the appliance sits on a solid base for stability--not fire worthiness. They also specify the appliance must be secured to framing using their built in nailing tabs. To place a FB fireplace out in the open is against the listing. They are intended to be installed within framing and wall enclosure or cabinet. They are not intended to have their back, sides and top exposed to the living space where someone could get burned.

They can pull the cardboard, screw it to the floor then build a wooden cabinet over it and be back within the listing.

PACNW, how do you define "safe"? That is the most dangerous word in our dictionary and should be avoided. NOTHING is totally safe. Either it is acceptable for continued operation or it is not.
Even when a unit is installed 100% to the codes and listing, that does not make it 'safe'.

[pacnw]

hearthman,

I agree with the assessment that it was meant to be installed as an insert, but if the instructions do not SPECIFICALLY state that and the clearances are met, then isn't it correctly installed.

safe was the wrong word. I was concerned that it was sitting on the floor even with the 0" clearance rating. as for the hot sides and top, I figured that the customer made the stupid choice and must live with the potential injuries.

as I stated, I did shut it off and tag it for safeties that were removed, but if they were functional I do not know that I would have.