Results 1 to 8 of 8
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,720

    Trane TEH Packaged Roftop Fan Blade Failures

    We have three 30 Ton Trane M/N TEH360A4AY0A5BA10 rooftops that we installed in 2009. Since then we have had at least 6 condenser fan blades and at least two condenser motor failures. Most originate due to a separation of hub from blade. The thinking is the fan is not on, is windmilling backwards from those that are on, and when energized, the inertia damages the fan hub.
    I did a search but found nothing on this particular model Trane, but did see pics of damage on an RTAA.
    Has anyone experienced this problem?
    These are critical care RTU's that must run. So we have to resolve this issue as soon as possible.
    Any helpful responses are greatly appreciated.
    Jogas
    Jogas
    Four wheel therapy, my 1968 Camaro is gone and will be missed

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Mount Airy, MD
    Posts
    7,281
    We as well have seen more and more fan blade and motor failures on equipment that has been installed in the last 5-10 years or so and have wondered the same as you.

    It would seem to me that either a drive(s) could resolve the issue or perhaps something like the older head pressure controlled dampers, but instead of pressure perhaps a time based opening?

    Nice to see ya back Jogas

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,720
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_Worthington View Post
    We as well have seen more and more fan blade and motor failures on equipment that has been installed in the last 5-10 years or so and have wondered the same as you.

    It would seem to me that either a drive(s) could resolve the issue or perhaps something like the older head pressure controlled dampers, but instead of pressure perhaps a time based opening?

    Nice to see ya back Jogas
    Thanks...been busy with Projects for a while.

    These failures look to me like they might be the result of the Hub flexing from the air load on the blade...Hub being made from too thin metal.
    If that is so, I don't think a VFD or Dampers will help.
    Anybody know a good brand Universal Fan Blade Replacement Company that makes a quality blade like we had in the old days?
    jogas
    Jogas
    Four wheel therapy, my 1968 Camaro is gone and will be missed

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,720
    The Customer had another failure yesterday, so I wound up at the job.
    This Blade was replaced only 2 weeks ago. But it separated between the fan blade hub shaft section and the flat Blade-attaching section of the Hub.
    the Customer heard it and shut down the unit, so no other damage done.

    We are trying to find a quality replacement universal blade as we are tired of these expensive fan failures. But the Motors are 1.1 Hp and 1750 RPM.
    We're having trouble finding a blade that will handle that speed. Could have something to do with the failures if no one else is using fans at this speed.
    Lau does not have one that will fit the application.
    Has anyone already found a Blade Manufacturer or other setup that can handle this application?
    Sorry, I don't have the Blade specs right now but can get them.
    Jogas
    Jogas
    Four wheel therapy, my 1968 Camaro is gone and will be missed

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    Seen that too many times!!
    Given you have single phase fans, You're gonna have a DPDT relay controlling either both or the second condenser fan upon demand for cooling from either compressor.

    Cut that crap out, wire directly to contactor (load side, of course), add a 14 ga jumper across Run caps on the line input side (if necessary)

    TCD's are renowned for that crap!

    BTW, replace your motors and blades, then you won't have that short circuit in your airflow anymore. They'll both start upon any demand for cooling!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,720
    Quote Originally Posted by lafittejdubb View Post
    Seen that too many times!!
    Given you have single phase fans, You're gonna have a DPDT relay controlling either both or the second condenser fan upon demand for cooling from either compressor.

    Cut that crap out, wire directly to contactor (load side, of course), add a 14 ga jumper across Run caps on the line input side (if necessary)

    TCD's are renowned for that crap!

    BTW, replace your motors and blades, then you won't have that short circuit in your airflow anymore. They'll both start upon any demand for cooling!
    Wouldn't low head pressure be a concern at low outdoor temps (say just above Economizer Changeover) running all 3 fans with one Compressor?

    What replacement motors and blades do you suggest?
    Jogas
    Four wheel therapy, my 1968 Camaro is gone and will be missed

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    49
    I apologize, I'm a newbie, I didn't realize your unit had 3 (or 4) stages of cooling. My idea would start causing problems in your situation.

    I'm pulling this out of my a$$, but you could install Close on rise (psi) fan cycle controllers. There's a lot options to choose from on this, though.

    The JC P66 fan speed controller (Only brand I've used - which is good) being your best option ($225-300 range) or you could use just a standard SPST fan cycle controller (or a combination of the two mentioned). That would keep you fans running enough to keep your head at least 190 or more. You can set a couple of them to stagger at different settings but, again we're falling back to your initial problem.

    Considering you have three of these units, giving you a total of nine fans, factoring this needs to get fixed - and stay fixed, get 3 of the P66 FSC's and try it on fans 2 and 3 first.

    If you can keep all three fans running upon demand of ckt 1 (break the control ckt's on the other 3, if you need to - for the test) and maintain good head psi. If it doesn't work, add the third controller.

    If it works (and it should), buy the remainder of them. Put them in your remaining fans on the other 2 units (as mentioned above). At least this will keep your fans from drafting.

    Last thing, always go OEM on Trane, AAON, Lennox, Liebert, and usually Carrier when replacing major components. (Including blades and wheels) It'll keep your callbacks to a minimum.

    Again, I apologize for the confusion!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Western Mass
    Posts
    21
    Soon you'll be able to check out all the different revisions trane has done just by walking around that roof! I've had this problem with tranes before, I have a RTAC that i can walk across and see every revision from 2005 to now. Honestly though I think its just a trane issue. And your right your pretty much stuck using there blade.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event