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Thread: Undersized AC

  1. #40
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    Aug 2011
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    Northwest Indiana
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    40
    Quote Originally Posted by vinese View Post
    What is the best way to really screen a HVAC company???...References, years in business, Highest priced, etc..
    I would say references and actually checking up on them. See if you can go see some of their other work if it's for a big job (ductwork qualifies, I think). Years in business helps, but I know a lot of guys I wouldn't let into my house that have been doing it for 20 years or so. Highest price gives you an idea - maybe more like not lowest price. Guarantees, warranties - only as good as the company making/giving them. I guess you need to get a feel for the person/people doing the work and how they stand behind it. Asking family and friends works well too - if someone has had a good experience they'll probably be willing to share. That's how we get a lot of our work - from lifelong customers evangelizing for us.

  2. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Northwest Indiana
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    40
    Quote Originally Posted by vinese View Post
    The attic insulation is over the top of the 2x6 rafters by about 2-4". I'm not sure what the material is...
    That looks like encapsulated fiberglass - if it's similar to the stuff we use (Attic Guard) you need 10 inches to get to R30. I can see the tops of a lot of rafters there - I would say you're getting between R16 and 20. If you paid for R30, it might be time to make another call....

  3. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    Cal
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    1,596
    Preacher man left you with pew to clean up.

    I would waste no time in solving the drain problem by someone qualified, or shut the system down until corrections are made. Any sort of condensate leakage could cause damage to finishes below = many monies to repair.

    You were charged so little, you could easily cut your loses, have a good outfit properly resolve the mess and still have an affordable system.

  4. #43
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    NW Florida
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    713
    Quote Originally Posted by vinese View Post
    Material cost was supposedly $$$$ and labor was $$$$$. I couldn't not do it for that price... The Window units were going to cost $$$$$...

    Material seemed awfully low considering the prices I've seen online. It's all brand new Rheem Equipment, digital t-stat, concrete pad under the outside unit.

    He tied into the hot water heater gas line and put in a shut off valve by the water heater.

    I'm going to put up photos first thing tomorrow.

    Guy is still taking my calls and claiming that the unit is working fine and that the tenant needs to set the T-stat on 78 and forget it.

    I agree that if she is turning it way up or off during the day and expecting it to cool off when she gets home it is going to take sever hours in this heat.
    If she is turning off during day, that dog won't hunt. It will never cool off till late mourning when she shuts off again. An older home in the south. I would be willing to put money on no insulation in the walls or floor. House was built very loose for air circulation. Made obvious by the attic fan where the return is now. Sounds like a spider duct system which would be fine if flex ducts are insulated and sized properly. I would have bumbed up to a 2.5 ton due to age of house and the outside air infiltration. As for the gas flue that would be insane but a qualified man to install way tooooo dangerous. Somebody could get killed if not done properly.
    Last edited by meoberry; 08-14-2011 at 11:58 PM. Reason: forgot something

  5. #44
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    Jul 2008
    Location
    Rochester NY
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    Insulation is like speed bumps to heat loss/gain. R30 is like one bump, and hot summertime attics are like formula 1 tracks. Heat is coming in at 200 mph.

    You need heat gain slowed to 5 mph. To achieve that r50-r60 is needed. Air seal and insulate that attic and 2 tons will probably NEVER run continuously.
    Which makes more sense to you?
    CONSERVATION - turning your thermostat back and being uncomfortable. Maybe saving 5-10%
    ENERGY EFFICIENCY - leaving your thermostat where everyone is comfortable. Saving 30-70%

    DO THE NUMBERS! Step on a HOMESCALE.
    What is comfort? Well, it AIN'T just TEMPERATURE!

    Energy Obese? An audit is the next step - go to BPI.org, or RESNET, and find an auditor near you.

  6. #45
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    14
    Quote Originally Posted by tedkidd View Post
    Insulation is like speed bumps to heat loss/gain. R30 is like one bump, and hot summertime attics are like formula 1 tracks. Heat is coming in at 200 mph.

    You need heat gain slowed to 5 mph. To achieve that r50-r60 is needed. Air seal and insulate that attic and 2 tons will probably NEVER run continuously.
    Would that still be the case if there is no wall insulation or floor insulation?? Adding attic insulation would be a much more affordable option than replacing the condenser and coil I imagine...

  7. #46
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    Aug 2011
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    568

    Confused

    Quote Originally Posted by vinese View Post
    Would that still be the case if there is no wall insulation or floor insulation?? Adding attic insulation would be a much more affordable option than replacing the condenser and coil I imagine...
    question ??? is there any insulation in the walls? any insultion in the floors?
    what year was this stucture built?

  8. #47
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    14
    Quote Originally Posted by meoberry View Post
    If she is turning off during day, that dog won't hunt. It will never cool off till late mourning when she shuts off again. An older home in the south. I would be willing to put money on no insulation in the walls or floor. House was built very loose for air circulation. Made obvious by the attic fan where the return is now. Sounds like a spider duct system which would be fine if flex ducts are insulated and sized properly. I would have bumbed up to a 2.5 ton due to age of house and the outside air infiltration. As for the gas flue that would be insane but a qualified man to install way tooooo dangerous. Somebody could get killed if not done properly.
    I think you are right on the house having no insulation in the walls. I believe the interior was originally tongue and grove wood walls that was later covered with dry wall.

    I know there was originally no insulation in the attic or underneath the house either.

    My thinking is to get a good AC guy to correct any screw ups that the preacher made and then add another 1/2 ton of capacity by putting a window unit back in the master bedroom, which coincidentally is the warmest room in the house.

  9. #48
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    Sep 2002
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    After getting the hvac system fixed up, upgrade to attic insulation if it still can't keep up; even R-30 is too low - I would go for R40+.
    General public's attitude towards our energy predicament: "I reject the reality of finite resource depletion and substitute it with my own; energy is infinite, we just need an alternative storage medium to run the cars on. The economy can grow indefinitely - we just need to "green" everything! Technology is energy! Peak what?"

  10. #49
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    568

    Confused

    Quote Originally Posted by vinese View Post
    I think you are right on the house having no insulation in the walls. I believe the interior was originally tongue and grove wood walls that was later covered with dry wall.

    I know there was originally no insulation in the attic or underneath the house either.

    My thinking is to get a good AC guy to correct any screw ups that the preacher made and then add another 1/2 ton of capacity by putting a window unit back in the master bedroom, which coincidentally is the warmest room in the house.
    how about blown in insulation into the walls? if practical in that area? how hard would it be to insulate the floors under the house?

  11. #50
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    south louisiana
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    3,320
    where are you located??

    do the ducts really go up as high and then as low as it looks like in the video?

    insulation is blown fiberglass.

    here in the south we insulate to R-38 north uses higer R-values.

    I'd get the attic right before adding more insulation.
    mastic seal ducts. strap so that air moves easily not up and down
    but straighe supported runs. that foil tape is crap, use mastic tape
    or paint mastic.
    ducts should not have more than a 1" sag per 4' section.

    insulating the floors would be my next step, but only if using closed cell foam.
    anything else is a waste of time and effort.
    I wouldn't add insulation to attic until any work there is complete.

    it would be a shame to have to put a window unit with a new central system
    I'd work on getting the system right.
    1,000 sq ft with 2 ton system is 500 sq ft per ton. nice safe oversizing
    for installer. too bad it doesn't work right. can't imagine adding more
    air for such small house.

    best of luck
    The cure of the part should not be attempted without the cure of the whole. ~Plato

  12. #51
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    Down by the river
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    1,689
    WOW!!!!
    It's hard to stop a Trane. but I have made one helluva living keeping them going.

  13. #52
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Central Oregon
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    749
    Check your local utilities see if they have a wetherization program. Not sure if rentals qualify but they will upgrade everything. Appliances,windows, doors, insulation.

    I had a buddy contractor friend wanted me to install a electric forced air system in this 650 spft farm house with 1" of attic insulation and none anywhere else. I ask him, who they going to shoot first when they have a cold house and a $1500 electric bill this winter. He opted for cadets and no insulation. Saved my bisquits
    If you think our goverment is screwed up. You haven't lived in another country.

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