Advice on oversized/mismatched tonnage -

[wirelesstim]

Sorry for the graphic title but I'm pissed. Did my contractor screw me?

Specs:
1,600 sq.ft.
3-level townhome built new 1999
No basement, ground level entry
Maryland

I used to have:

Comfortmaker 10 Seer upright split system in ground level laundry room
2.5 TN outdoor / 2.5 ton AC /2.5 blower w/ 50,000 BTU furnace.

System worked but after 10 years, parts started to die, so I figured an upgrade was in order

Now I just had installed:

Goodman 13 Seer upright split system in ground level laundry room
3TN outdoor / 3 ton AC / 4tn blower motor w/ 90,000 BTU furnace.

Contract said it was supposed to be 3 tons all around. But i knew something wasn't right because my new system is loud as hell! After I pulled the serial numbers, come to find out contractors gave me a 4tn blower motor. I hope this wasn't a scratch-n-dent he found on ebaby.

If it was just an oversized blower motor then I wouldn't be pissed, but within 1month of installation, the outdoor comp unit fan broke and damaged the coils. freon had a slow leak. at the inside unit, water isn't draining properly and has damaged basement hardwood and carpet. unit showing signs of rust on the inside due to excessive water. water is all over inducer fan, control board, everything!! it's been happening everyday for last 3 months. i replace 4 towels twice a day to soak up all the water. contractor not returning calls. oh did i mention, that the inducer fan kicks on by itself, and I only have the air on...no calls for heat! (needless to say, I had to physically unplug this fan, especially since water was pouring all over it)

Now that i'm going to have to replace the whole bottom furnace and start on a lawsuit with this Licensed Contractor, i'm wondering about that 4tn blower that i didnt ask for. yeah, air blows through vents stronger, but sure as hell isn't cooler. other than it being louder than I like, what other reasons can you think of that this 4tn is hurting more than helping? electrical bill? efficiency? overcooling/undercooling evap coils?

any assistance is appreciated

[MM#7]

that's pretty salty words!

[wirelesstim]

that's pretty salty words!

you're right. i'll change the title. that was a little harsh

[CrispinHvac]

i would like to see pics thats got to be interesting install. Should be able to adjust the blower speed. Slow the fan down!


hopefully that guy will do the right thing and get u fixed up.

[catmanacman]

Yes you got shafted, also did you get more than one estimate and did you go with low bidder going from a 50000 btu furnace to a 90000 btu furnace is not acceptable the furnace Will not last will probably trip the high limit switch

[wirelesstim]

i would like to see pics thats got to be interesting install. Should be able to adjust the blower speed. Slow the fan down!


hopefully that guy will do the right thing and get u fixed up.

Thanks Crispin, I hope so too.
The installation was beautifully done. Air worked, loud, but worked. Then two weeks in, the 22" fan blade fell off of the condenser motor while it was spinning. Needless to say, it immediately damaged the coil. Instead of replacing the unit with Goodman, contractor came out to solder. He didn't solder correctly and evap coil ended up freezing over.

Here's the info on the furnace, i hope the blower can be slowed down to match the rest of the system.
MODEL#: GMS80904BN
MFG#: GMS80904BNCC
S/N 1104168867

[RoBoTeq]

Most likely the sales person for the company just doesn't understand proper sizing and figured that more must be better. This unfortunately is the thought pattern of too many professionals in the HVAC industry, which is why it is important to go with a contractor that is willing to keep up on available HVAC training and not rely on what used to work.

Let's face it, the contractor screwed him/herself as well as the consumer. For less cost to the contractor, the proper sized equipment could have been installed. So many contractors see how little difference there is in cost to increase capacity to the next level that they think they are doing the consumer a favor by installing more then is needed.

[wirelesstim]

Yes you got shafted, also did you get more than one estimate and did you go with low bidder going from a 50000 btu furnace to a 90000 btu furnace is not acceptable the furnace Will not last will probably trip the high limit switch

No sir. He was licensed and bonded. In fact, I checked his license information and it's still good and current. No Pricing please I went with the middle of the road.

Thanks for the advice on the btu tripping the high limit switch. I didn't know that. Interesting though, when the inducer motor kept coming on for no reason (since I was only calling for air), it actually pushed the hot water heater exhaust back towards the hot water heater. came home one day and smelled exhaust fumes all in the ground level. that was the other reason i physically unplugged the inducer motor.

[wirelesstim]

Most likely the sales person for the company just doesn't understand proper sizing and figured that more must be better. This unfortunately is the thought pattern of too many professionals in the HVAC industry, which is why it is important to go with a contractor that is willing to keep up on available HVAC training and not rely on what used to work.

Let's face it, the contractor screwed him/herself as well as the consumer. For less cost to the contractor, the proper sized equipment could have been installed. So many contractors see how little difference there is in cost to increase capacity to the next level that they think they are doing the consumer a favor by installing more then is needed.

i was typing this, i just went to Goodman Warranty site again. Not only does my name not show up under the warranty, but the warranty end date says 2016. I just bought this system in may 2011. I purchased the system with a 10year warranty in mind, meaning the warranty date should say 2021, correct?

[MM#7]

Thanks Crispin, I hope so too.
The installation was beautifully done. Air worked, loud, but worked. Then two weeks in, the 22" fan blade fell off of the condenser motor while it was spinning. Needless to say, it immediately damaged the coil. Instead of replacing the unit with Goodman, contractor came out to solder. He didn't solder correctly and evap coil ended up freezing over.

Here's the info on the furnace, i hope the blower can be slowed down to match the rest of the system.
MODEL#: GMS80904BN
MFG#: GMS80904BNCC
S/N 1104168867

as far as speed, that unit is a 4 ton drive, what does that mean, it can push about 1600 cfm which is 4 ton, if memory serves, that unit can use 2 1/2 ton
through 4 ton a.c so he can drop down the cfm to a lower speed tap, that part is easy. question, with the 3 story town house, before the new furnace where you having any air flow problems on the top floor of your town house?

[MM#7]

i was typing this, i just went to Goodman Warranty site again. Not only does my name not show up under the warranty, but the warranty end date says 2016. I just bought this system in may 2011. I purchased the system with a 10year warranty in mind, meaning the warranty date should say 2021, correct?

to get the 10 year warranty you have to register on line w/in 60 days i think!

[wirelesstim]

as far as speed, that unit is a 4 ton drive, what does that mean, it can push about 1600 cfm which is 4 ton, if memory serves, that unit can use 2 1/2 ton
through 4 ton a.c so he can drop down the cfm to a lower speed tap, that part is easy. question, with the 3 story town house, before the new furnace where you having any air flow problems on the top floor of your town house?

okay,that 's a good thing then! wheww! only problem is, now it'll need to be replaced. i'm only using the blower portion since it's summertime. plus, it's getting all rusted out in there, and the control board has been soaked and dripping with water for the last 3 months :-(

in answer to your yes, the top 3rd floor was ALWYAS warmer and had air flow problems. all of my neighbors have the same issues and they still have the original units. however,if they bring their air down to 72 degrees on the middle floor, the top floor might see 77 on 95 degree humid Washington DC day. With my new system, it's a 'hair' better but not significantly different on the top floor vs the older system. the only difference is that is seems to cool down a little faster, which is good i guess.

[MM#7]

okay,that 's a good thing then! wheww! only problem is, now it'll need to be replaced. i'm only using the blower portion since it's summertime. plus, it's getting all rusted out in there, and the control board has been soaked and dripping with water for the last 3 months :-(

in answer to your yes, the top 3rd floor was ALWYAS warmer and had air flow problems. all of my neighbors have the same issues and they still have the original units. however,if they bring their air down to 72 degrees on the middle floor, the top floor might see 77 on 95 degree humid Washington DC day. With my new system, it's a 'hair' better but not significantly different on the top floor vs the older system. the only difference is that is seems to cool down a little faster, which is good i guess.

why is it dripping water for 3 months? after one day some one shoould of checked it! where is the water coming from?

[wirelesstim]

to get the 10 year warranty you have to register on line w/in 60 days i think!

WOW didn't know! The contractor didn't leave me any paperwork, any directions, or anything. I got the serial numbers myself. I'll do that immediately!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU

[MM#7]

WOW didn't know! The contractor didn't leave me any paperwork, any directions, or anything. I got the serial numbers myself. I'll do that immediately!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU

no problem, the bill is in the mail!!!!!!!!

[wirelesstim]

why is it dripping water for 3 months? after one day some one shoould of checked it! where is the water coming from?

contractor hasn't been out in month and half. the first month and a half, I had a service call about 6/7 times. each time the contractor attempted to fix the water and it would work for a day then water again. he says it's either drip pan is installed wrong, or is slanted wrong, or condensation drain line isn't level, or something keeps clogging the drain line, or evap coil keeps freezing up and drain line is too small to handle massive thawing, or.... each time it's always something different.

[wirelesstim]

no problem, the bill is in the mail!!!!!!!!

should've hired you instead of these clowns! they give small companies a bad name.

[RoBoTeq]

i was typing this, i just went to Goodman Warranty site again. Not only does my name not show up under the warranty, but the warranty end date says 2016. I just bought this system in may 2011. I purchased the system with a 10year warranty in mind, meaning the warranty date should say 2021, correct?

I see you are in Maryland. I may know the contractor and may be able to arbitrate if you'd like. My email address is in my profile.

[lynn comstock]

• The air volume and noise can be reduced by chosing a lower fan speed.
• The water is from humidity removed from the air. The water is supposed to go down the drain piping. (PICTURES of the drain piping would help.)
• Was the installation permitted and inspected?
• A complaint filed with the Maryland Home Improvement Commission is a good step now. http://www.dllr.state.md.us/license/mhic/

[RoBoTeq]

• The air volume and noise can be reduced by chosing a lower fan speed.
• The water is from humidity removed from the air. The water is supposed to go down the drain piping. (PICTURES of the drain piping would help.)
• Was the installation permitted and inspected?
• A complaint filed with the Maryland Home Improvement Commission is a good step now. http://www.dllr.state.md.us/license/mhic/

Having had to deal with MD's HVAC inspectors in the past, I would much rather see you resolve the issues with the contractor. Then again, I would accept nothing less then a 2.5 ton cooling system with a 45k Btu furnace with the air volume set for no more then 1,000 cfm of air for the cooling.

Direct the contractor to this site or have the contractor contact one of us via email in our profiles. There is a very good chance that the contractor can get you happy while learning a bit of an expensive lesson.