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  1. #1

    Carrier vs Payne and Coil questions

    We have currently solicited multiple bids to replace our A/C unit. We are looking at low cost options since we will be selling the house within the next year. I am getting conflicting advice from different contractors so I was hoping for some advice from people who do not have monetary gain involved.

    Part 1: (Keep existing evap. coil or replace)
    Two contractors have advised it would be okay to keep our existing 6 year old Carrier CD5A coil (certified R22 and R410) which is currently running R22, but upgrade it with a R410 TXV and replace the leaking 12 year old A/C unit with a new R410 unit. Keeping costs in mind this seems like a feasible idea. But another contractor told me this was a bad idea and when they have done this before it always resulted in failure of the new A/C compressor, sometimes in as soon as 6 months. Is it safe to keep the existing coil? If so, what prep should I be making sure they do to make sure the coil will not cause problems with new R410 unit.

    Part 2: Carrier vs Payne
    Our deck was built around the concrete pad that the outdoor unit sits on. We live in townhouse limited area to put unit. So the two units we are looking at are a Carrier 24ABB and a Payne PA13NA. These are the only units that will fit in the existing space without modification of the deck. As far as I can tell these two units are identical. Could someone tell me if I missing something in comparing these two units? Why should I pick the more expensive Carrier unit over the Payne?

    TIA -- Patrick

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    568

    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick101 View Post
    We have currently solicited multiple bids to replace our A/C unit. We are looking at low cost options since we will be selling the house within the next year. I am getting conflicting advice from different contractors so I was hoping for some advice from people who do not have monetary gain involved.

    Part 1: (Keep existing evap. coil or replace)
    Two contractors have advised it would be okay to keep our existing 6 year old Carrier CD5A coil (certified R22 and R410) which is currently running R22, but upgrade it with a R410 TXV and replace the leaking 12 year old A/C unit with a new R410 unit. Keeping costs in mind this seems like a feasible idea. But another contractor told me this was a bad idea and when they have done this before it always resulted in failure of the new A/C compressor, sometimes in as soon as 6 months. Is it safe to keep the existing coil? If so, what prep should I be making sure they do to make sure the coil will not cause problems with new R410 unit.

    Part 2: Carrier vs Payne
    Our deck was built around the concrete pad that the outdoor unit sits on. We live in townhouse limited area to put unit. So the two units we are looking at are a Carrier 24ABB and a Payne PA13NA. These are the only units that will fit in the existing space without modification of the deck. As far as I can tell these two units are identical. Could someone tell me if I missing something in comparing these two units? Why should I pick the more expensive Carrier unit over the Payne?

    TIA -- Patrick
    i like payne, it's basically carriers builder model, good product!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Ft.Worth,Tx
    Posts
    4,584
    BDP-Carrier

    B ryant
    D ay-Night
    P ayne

    The use of existing coil is fine;as long as the system is flushed w/cleaner..
    Install/txv and LL drier, and your set.
    "Everyday above ground, is a good day".
    "But everyday that you have made a difference in someones life, may insure you stay above ground a little longer".<aircooled>

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Eastern Shore, MD
    Posts
    798
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick101 View Post
    We have currently solicited multiple bids to replace our A/C unit. We are looking at low cost options since we will be selling the house within the next year. I am getting conflicting advice from different contractors so I was hoping for some advice from people who do not have monetary gain involved.

    Part 1: (Keep existing evap. coil or replace)
    Two contractors have advised it would be okay to keep our existing 6 year old Carrier CD5A coil (certified R22 and R410) which is currently running R22, but upgrade it with a R410 TXV and replace the leaking 12 year old A/C unit with a new R410 unit. Keeping costs in mind this seems like a feasible idea. But another contractor told me this was a bad idea and when they have done this before it always resulted in failure of the new A/C compressor, sometimes in as soon as 6 months. Is it safe to keep the existing coil? If so, what prep should I be making sure they do to make sure the coil will not cause problems with new R410 unit.

    Part 2: Carrier vs Payne
    Our deck was built around the concrete pad that the outdoor unit sits on. We live in townhouse limited area to put unit. So the two units we are looking at are a Carrier 24ABB and a Payne PA13NA. These are the only units that will fit in the existing space without modification of the deck. As far as I can tell these two units are identical. Could someone tell me if I missing something in comparing these two units? Why should I pick the more expensive Carrier unit over the Payne?

    TIA -- Patrick
    if youre having leaks....id be REALLY hesitant on not replacing the evaporator....AND the system is designed to work with a specific coil. I strongly recommend you do it right and just have the system replaced.

    brand doesnt matter a lick

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    33,917
    Quote Originally Posted by aircooled53 View Post
    BDP-Carrier

    B ryant
    D ay-Night
    P ayne

    Sorry AC, that's not the case anymore. Bryant is very similar to Carrier with diffrerent cosmetics.

    Day & Night is ICP equipment.

    Payne is super cheap Bryant/Carrier stuff.

    Why buy a Carrier A/C over a Payne? America has a jobs crisis. Buying a Carrier puts an American to work. Buying a Payne puts a Mexican to work. Depends upon your view of things and who you want to support.

    Flushing an evap could leave flush & mineral oil in it. With multiple paths through the coil, there is NO way to be sure you have all the residue out. A coil is not like a lineset where flushing can clean everything out. Unless you flat out can't afford to change the coil, I sure would. Unless a TXV is added, the system won't get 13 anyway. And Carrier evaps are notoroius for leaking anyway!

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post

    Why buy a Carrier A/C over a Payne? America has a jobs crisis. Buying a Carrier puts an American to work. Buying a Payne puts a Mexican to work. Depends upon your view of things and who you want to support. anyway!
    Appreciate your response BL. And I do not want this thread to get off topic but I don't quite get your argument about jobs here. Payne, Carrier and Bryant all fall under the UTC corporate umbrella. Payne is manufactured by ICP a subsidiary of Carrier. Payne and Carrier are both based in the US as well as ICP. This seems to get quite muddy trying to track down the exact manufacturing point of a specific model which is beyond the scope of my questions.

    These two units come from the same parent company. They look like identical units to me cosmetically as well as specifications. This would indicate they are most likely manufactured at the same location. The only difference I noticed was the CFM output was a little higher on the Carrier. Motor output, type and RPM are the same. That is why I was asking for clarification. That and going with Carrier is going increase my expenditure by 27%.

    Thanks - Patrick

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    2,844
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick101 View Post
    Appreciate your response BL. And I do not want this thread to get off topic but I don't quite get your argument about jobs here. Payne, Carrier and Bryant all fall under the UTC corporate umbrella. Payne is manufactured by ICP a subsidiary of Carrier. Payne and Carrier are both based in the US as well as ICP. This seems to get quite muddy trying to track down the exact manufacturing point of a specific model which is beyond the scope of my questions.

    These two units come from the same parent company. They look like identical units to me cosmetically as well as specifications. This would indicate they are most likely manufactured at the same location. The only difference I noticed was the CFM output was a little higher on the Carrier. Motor output, type and RPM are the same. That is why I was asking for clarification. That and going with Carrier is going increase my expenditure by 27%.

    Thanks - Patrick

    what baldloonie said was correct as to the manufacturing locations. I don't think they are flying americans out of vegas to mexico (like area 51) to work in the plants

    Also, everything else BL said was correct.
    Last edited by beshvac; 08-09-2011 at 02:59 PM.
    Give a man a fish, he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, he will eat for a lifetime.

    Give a man a capacitor, doesn't know what to do. Teach a man to install it, now he knows everything.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Kingsport, Tennessee
    Posts
    131
    If price is a big concern, I would just go with the Payne too. And be happy!

    I can't speak on the Payne being made in Mexico, and Carrier in US, but the import/export line is so muddy these days.

    I live in the Southeast and can drive by almost every "foreign" car company.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,614
    im sure all the evap coils are made in mexico as are the payne condensers the bryant condensers are assembled in the us of china made parts, i would go with the bryant and replace the evap coil .if you do not change the evap coil i would not let them flush it . i would just blow it out with nitrogen while the metering device is off .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    568

    Hmm

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick101 View Post
    Appreciate your response BL. And I do not want this thread to get off topic but I don't quite get your argument about jobs here. Payne, Carrier and Bryant all fall under the UTC corporate umbrella. Payne is manufactured by ICP a subsidiary of Carrier. Payne and Carrier are both based in the US as well as ICP. This seems to get quite muddy trying to track down the exact manufacturing point of a specific model which is beyond the scope of my questions.

    These two units come from the same parent company. They look like identical units to me cosmetically as well as specifications. This would indicate they are most likely manufactured at the same location. The only difference I noticed was the CFM output was a little higher on the Carrier. Motor output, type and RPM are the same. That is why I was asking for clarification. That and going with Carrier is going increase my expenditure by 27%.

    Thanks - Patrick


    IT'S LIKE ARCO-AIRE/ TEMPSTAR/ HEIL/ COMFORTMAKER, when carrier took controlling interest in ICP, the tempstars were made at a plant that was producing, bryant in indiana. basically you have about 7 mfg's and 2000 names ex. is nordyne! matter of fact a while back when i went to carrier north east they'd ask you wht a/h you buy, if bryant you got thta plate if carrier you got the carrier plate, or lux-aire and fraser johnson! a lot of it is marketing, it's in the mind!

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