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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Minneapolis
    Posts
    22
    I am also in the Twin Cities and have just selected a HVAC vendor to install a new furnace and AC in my home. I could share my impressions of the contractors that I consulted. Would that be appropriate for this web site? I would not post dollar values. After my install is done I will be more than happy to share my thoughts on Flare Heating & Cooling. Thus far all I can go by is the quoting process.

    One place I didn't pursue was Aspen Air. Look at the BBB web site and you'll find they have had 27 complaints in the last three years. Those complaints were probably more related to their duct cleaning business but it was enough for me to rule them out.

    Jon

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    947

    Re: Re: Re: Heating & Cooling Two?

    [QUOTE]Originally posted by MikeJ
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by hvac_czar
    Originally posted by acam

    [From your profile you are laughing thru your ass from a long way away. Is that MA in your profile Massachusettes? Never been there. Maybe one day.

    Did you get irritated when Snelling locked the boys out rather than continue Union?



    Yes, I'm in MA, transplanted here from there a couple years ago. Interesting you brought up the union thing, I worked for Standard during that era and Standard was/is the largest residential merit shop in the metro. My issues are with the quality of the guys they had during that time and the shortcuts they would take to sell a job.











  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    947

    Re: No effing way??

    Originally posted by acam
    So what is the problem with heating & cooling two? My in-laws are considering them for a replacing their furnace & AC.
    We cleaned up many of their new contruction jobs, they may be OK on a retro but there are many others I would pick first.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    143
    hvac_czar

    I live in the Saint Paul area...Iam looking for someone to "fine tune" my system checking balancing etc possibely install dual pipe direct vent on my Goodman. Could u recommend any techs that work with Goodman and/or you would trust. I can provide my email if you would like to exchange in private

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    St Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    3,468
    Here's another link that might be useful:

    http://www.twincityreferral.com/Heat...eferrer=Google

    and then there is angies list

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    947
    Originally posted by he8833
    hvac_czar

    I live in the Saint Paul area...Iam looking for someone to "fine tune" my system checking balancing etc possibely install dual pipe direct vent on my Goodman. Could u recommend any techs that work with Goodman and/or you would trust. I can provide my email if you would like to exchange in private
    As I noted in my earlier post, I've moved to Mass. 2 years ago... I'm unable to give current references on individuals, sorry.

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by he8833
    Grasshopper,,,,,,,what is your territory in the cities.
    I have worked in just about every part of the cities.
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by Chad711
    Grasshopper whats up man, how are the cities treating ya? Youll have to heap up here this winter for some ice fishin!

    Hey buddy! I e-mailed you and tried calling you about a two months ago when I passed through your neck of the woods. Things have been up and down. We should talk soon!!
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by tas
    interesting thread...

    We live in Mounds View, and I'm very interested in where this thread ends up. We've been searching for a quality contractor in the Twin Cities for a couple of years - our furnace and A/C are old, but to this point have continued to function. We almost made the move last spring, but other financial demands came up and I wasn't willing to low-ball on a new HVAC system - I know good contractors don't come cheap, and a good, properly installed HVAC system is far more important to me and my family than most other luxuries of life.

    I could add several Twin Cities contractors to this thread who, from a homeowner's perspective, would not meet the definition of a quality contractor as defined on this forum. Load calcs are not done by the majority of contractors - some almost laugh when you ask for one - "I've done lots of houses just like this one - they're all the same." Many contractors aren't interested in installing a system that meets your needs or desires, and will try to steer you to something you don't want, even to the point of bad-mouthing your "wants" in a system (ie. 2-stage thermostat for a 2-stage furnace, high-efficiency vs. 80%, Aprilaire air filter, etc.). Most of the contractors I've talked with don't instill much confidence that they know what they're doing, or that they will install the system well. There just aren't enough quality contractors out there, and those that do exist are not easy to find! I'm very thankful for the help I've received from all of you on this forum - I feel like I've at least gleaned enough knowledge to recognize when a contractor knows his stuff (or at least when he doesn't).

    At any rate, with finances stabilized (for the moment, anyway) we're trying to get the furnace and A/C replaced now. So, for grasshopper, any input on any of the following? I'd love to get your input as someone who may actually have seen their work and knows of them from a professional perspective!

    Northern Heating and Air Conditioning (NHAC) - Ramsey
    Perfection Heating and Air Conditioning - Stillwater
    Apollo Heating and Ventilation - Oakdale

    Have also considered talking with another company, based on word of mouth (not sure if they work in my area, and also haven't had much success with word of mouth recommendations so far):

    Palmer Heating and Air Conditioning (Mendota Heights)

    I'm very interested in your recommended contractors - I'm guessing you may have a short-list of people you feel good about, so please feel free to pass them along!

    TAS....

    Did you and I speak on the phone over a year ago? I am sorry if I have you confused with someone else.

    To answer your questions....

    Heard of Northern but know nothing about their work, Perfection Htg/AC is a newer company born out of former Standard Htg people, I am a little familiar with Apollo. But I have never seen their retro install work. You should talk to Mike J. He used to work for them. Sorry, but I have never heard of Palmer Htg.

    More to follow.....
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by hvac_czar
    Originally posted by grasshopper


    Standard Heating and AC is also a Mpls licensed company, and one I know well!! I know people who work there, I have worked there once upon a time, etc. Their bread and butter is gravity and "lowboy" jobs in old Mpls and St. Paul. They do pretty good sheetmetal work for the money and have been around a long time.(75 years) They sold out to Blue Dot for some years but now have been bought back to my knowledge. (Do a search for Blue Dot on this site.) My biggest complaints about their work is they size their ductwork to "tight" in my opinion, and they do not have a micron gauge or digital refrigerant scale on any truck in the company. They "time in" their refrigerant charges instead of weighing it in, and pull vacuums based upon time instead of measuring it.(How much time they have.) So with their vacuum pulling and refrigerant charging practices I refuse to refer anyone to them for anything involving refrigerant work like AC work. Post some questions or do a search for more details to understand what I mean.


    Hey, I am also a former employee of Standard Heating circa '98-'04... Would I know you?

    The goal there was always to push the work out, their streamlined methods have caused problems from time to time and I found that any new or better methods were quickly put down. They were bought back from the now defunct Blue Dot by Ted and Todd, management was stable during that time and has been since. Even though they have their shortcomings I would recommend them as they are far better than most contractors in the Twin Cities.
    "The goal there was always to push the work out, their streamlined methods have caused problems from time to time and I found that any new or better methods were quickly put down."

    You mean like counting seconds to measure in refrigerant instead of using a scale?

    Sorry but we did not cross paths. Sounds like you keep in touch with them though. It sounds like your lucky you did not have to deal with their new install manager. From what I hear he is a nazi and one step from flipping out at all times. Heard a story about him alost putting his hand through the windshield of a cube truck at a installer once because he passed him in traffic one morning. I know guys that have been there decades and fear for their jobs at times. I would agree that they are better then many others. But like many bigger companies the true quality of each install depends on which employee does the job. I saw good and less then good jobs there.
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by hvac_czar
    One thing Standard will do is a load calc...

    I did sales for them for a short while and no job gets submitted for install without one...

    When I was in sales I often encountered folks who wanted me in-and-out quickly... to the point of asking "Whats the tape measure for, don't you know what size I need? Nobody else measured my house."

    No calc to me immediately eliminates a contractor.
    "No calc to me immediately eliminates a contractor."

    I completely agree!

    "I did sales for them for a short while and no job gets submitted for install without one..."

    Yes thats true. However I saw that there, like almost every place I have worked.... some salesmen either fake them or GROSSLY manipulate the numbers to say what they want. When my Grandmother went to have me install a new furnace a few years ago, she got 4-5 bids behind my back to "check up on me." I truely laughed going over some of the bids and "load calcs" later with her. 2 years ago the same happened with one company and my brother. You wouldn't believe the crap that the owner of that company told my bro. You wouldn't think its funny if you knew how he wanted to install and vent a 90% in his house.
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Central MN and the Twin Cities
    Posts
    1,530
    Originally posted by he8833
    hvac_czar

    I live in the Saint Paul area...Iam looking for someone to "fine tune" my system checking balancing etc possibely install dual pipe direct vent on my Goodman. Could u recommend any techs that work with Goodman and/or you would trust. I can provide my email if you would like to exchange in private
    So you had a new Goodman already installed?
    Warning: Just because I am over the head injury doesn't mean I'm normal!

    The day I stop learning.... I'm dead!

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    143


    So you had a new Goodman already installed? [/B][/QUOTE]


    Well when we moved in we assumed it was close to new if not new. Since then through this site and via my annual checkups whom ever installed it did not due a very good job. As a result and in addition to it being loud when starting up (reason I may want it direct vented) I want to have things checked over and potentially fine tuned, blower speed etc

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