Pretty comical considering their Payne units are some of the best priced R22 units in my area and they are throwing in disconnect, tstat, whip, etc etc...
Originally Posted by Carbon
"Gentlemen. You can't fight in here. This is the War Room!"-Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Thats weird, they are pushing Payne dry 22 units around here. Payne is Carrier, so I dont know whats going on with them.
Originally Posted by Carbon
They may be pushing them because they think they will not be able to sell them soon.
Whether or not its convenient now for all parties involved, its going to cause big problems later on. Customers are buying dry 22 units now without being told that in the near future they will pay outrageous prices for refrigerant. I understand using them in some circumstances (apartments and the like) but if the customer doesn't understand that they are buying a dying technology, they are very likely to be extremely upset in a few years. As contractors we are offering a quick, cheap fix to a complicated issue. But your every day uninformed customer doesn't realize that in reality it is only a temporary fix. What happens to those apartment complexes when we cant get R-22 anymore. What about the cash strapped family that goes for a cheap easy dry 22 change out and as few as 5 years down the road is paying out the a$$ for a few pounds of refrigerant.
Im not saying that we shouldn't offer these products, but we as a trade need to tread lightly and make sure the customer if fully informed.
The only true knowledge is the pursuit of knowledge
I don't know about the Payne units everyone else see but I've only seen a couple in my area and they are bone dry for safety's. No LPS, HPS or even a DTS. I had one have a leak and the customer decided to keep running the thing into the ground without a charge, that was a fun repair. The moisture in the great NW turned the oil to gum and it plugged my first filter drier in 3 minutes. It took an oil change, new txv and a 2nd FD to fix this one, I added a LPS for safety precautions.
Wasn't there a hue and cry about folks selling 12 equipment when it was phased out?
Personally, I will suggest a 410 change over, not because of phase out, but because energy efficiency.
And all of my customers so far have grasped that idea.
DuPont has a drop in replacement for r-22
No oil change needed just need to change what they call critical seals
if used in an r-22 system first
schraders, piston or txv seals.....
haven't seen a price on it yet though
Every supply house I have been in lately has both 410 and r22 units
in stock. Selling about a equal amount of both.
22 is still cheaper that 410. The last 4 units I installed were r22 units
because that is what they wanted, and asked for. They did not want
to know about what would or would not be around in a few years.
Heck R12 was banned almost 20 years ago, and you can still get it,
only problem is not many people need it anymore. I still have some
for when I work on old Whirlpool ice makers.
I am not going to run out of r22, I have more than enough to take
care of my customers for at least 10 years with what I have stored,
and I bet I can still get more in the next 3-7 years with no problem if
my stock gets low.
There are already rumblings in the industry about moving away from 410a because of the hydroscopic issue with p.o.e. oil and the higher operating pressure producing more leaks. Personally, I'm not totally buying into the formicary corrosion theory; the rash of coil failures that the industry has recently experienced co-incides with the change over to 410a. And there's more than one drop in replacement already available for 22.
Theres plenty of R22 available.
As mentioned there are already several drop in replacements out there.
More than likely there will be no problem getting either R22 or a replacement at anytime, at a reasonable price.