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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2011
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    28

    Confused Is 410a here to stay?

    Just wondering, has anyone heard any rumors about 410a being replaced? I know Wikipedia is not reliable but I saw this quote on there today under the 410a entry:
    "Update May 29, 2011 Because of the much higher operating pressures, units over 5 years old are sustaining catastrophic failures due to metal fatigue of the condenser. Service personnel injuries and property damage have resulted. Several commercial insurance companies are prohibiting the servicing of these units due to the likelihood of injury or death.

    The US EPA is now allowing the production of R22 units and refrigerant to resume until a suitable substitute for R410a can be found."

    Anybody know if there is any truth to this? Has any contractor had their insurance company tell them to stop servicing 410a units? Or, is this BS? Please comment if you've heard one way or the other.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
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    Omaha, NE
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    1,561
    Quote Originally Posted by Spanky McCranky View Post
    Just wondering, has anyone heard any rumors about 410a being replaced? I know Wikipedia is not reliable but I saw this quote on there today under the 410a entry:
    "Update May 29, 2011 Because of the much higher operating pressures, units over 5 years old are sustaining catastrophic failures due to metal fatigue of the condenser. Service personnel injuries and property damage have resulted. Several commercial insurance companies are prohibiting the servicing of these units due to the likelihood of injury or death.

    The US EPA is now allowing the production of R22 units and refrigerant to resume until a suitable substitute for R410a can be found."

    Anybody know if there is any truth to this? Has any contractor had their insurance company tell them to stop servicing 410a units? Or, is this BS? Please comment if you've heard one way or the other.
    As far as I can tell, it's all BS........the Wikipedia revision shows no credible footnote referencing, so I edited it back to the previous edition (you could do this too). We'll see if it stays that way.
    B.O. = B.S.

  3. #3
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    Sep 2002
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    If that was true, manufacturers of 410a units would have a class action lawsuit on their hands.
    General public's attitude towards our energy predicament: "I reject the reality of finite resource depletion and substitute it with my own; energy is infinite, we just need an alternative storage medium to run the cars on. The economy can grow indefinitely - we just need to "green" everything! Technology is energy! Peak what?"

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
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    Grottoes VA
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    Carrier has been doing R410a for a number of years with no issues.
    Karst means cave. So, I search for caves.

  5. #5
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    Dec 2010
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    Palm Beach,Fl.
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    954
    ^ this, since 1996.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    houston, texas
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    3,787
    There is a new refer on the way gentleman, here is the link.

    ://contractingbusiness.com/refrigeration/Comstar_R441a_compressors_manufacturing_0519/
    I'm not tolerating Political Correctness anymore, from now on it's tell it like it is.

    Veto Pro Pak - The best tool bag you'll ever own






  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Omaha, NE
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texas-Tech View Post
    There is a new refer on the way gentleman, here is the link.
    ://contractingbusiness.com/refrigeration/Comstar_R441a_compressors_manufacturing_0519/
    It's a hydrocarbon blend for small systems.

    http://contractingbusiness.com/refri...519/index.html

    "While R441a is flammable, sources say the very small amount of refrigerant required in appliances or automotive cooling systems makes the risk assessment a non-factor. "
    B.O. = B.S.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Rochester, NY, USA
    Posts
    14,190
    The Federal laws that are procedurally banning hydroflurocarbons like HFC-134a in the United States are necessitating innovation in Air Conditioner design. The next HFC you’ll find in your Daikin air conditioning may well be R441a, an unassuming compound that is made of ethane, propane, butane an isobutene. It is touted as the first ‘zero rated’ compound: meaning that there is zero chance of it contributing to either Global Warming or Ozone depletion, two negative effects commonly attributed to Air Conditioners.
    The overall carbon footprint of this refrigerant is also reduced. You’ll find up to a 48 per cent decrease in power consumption due to using R441a. One of the few drawbacks is that R441a is flammable, though in testing thus far, so little of it is required that there seems to be no danger of this being an issue. Produced in South Texas, R441a hasn’t yet been put into massive quantities: though if its promises are true, perhaps it should be!
    flammable? Derp
    Last edited by jmac00; 06-02-2011 at 07:27 AM. Reason: spelling
    BEING AN ADULT

    is the dumbest thing I have ever done

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Galveston Texas
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    530
    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    flammable? Derp
    I was reading in one of the trade mags recently and they were talking about using propane as a refrigerant. It's actually used in europe already quite regularly. The only reason it's not used here is due to the flammability concerns.

  10. #10
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    Dec 2007
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    houston, texas
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    Once the greenies see it's 0 gwp it will be a shoe in, no matter how flammable it is. Wonder how it will react to a leak detector with a heated diode.
    I'm not tolerating Political Correctness anymore, from now on it's tell it like it is.

    Veto Pro Pak - The best tool bag you'll ever own






  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
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    Eastern PA
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    The Wiki article is BS, but R410a will not survive the wrath of the environmentalists. R410a is getting a pass at the moment because we are more concerned with just keeping comfortable during bad economic times. Once the economy is not a concern, the environment will once again become headline news and R410a is on the list of things to get rid of.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
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    SW MO.
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    5,176
    Ban 134a? Seriously?
    Discipline your child so that other parents don't have to.

    We're awl pawthetic and kweepy and can't get giwrls. That's why we fight wobots.

  13. #13
    heaterman's Avatar
    heaterman is offline AOP Committee/Professional Member*
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    It's been and still is my opinion that 410a will be short lived.
    A good HVAC tech knows how, an educated HVAC tech knows why!

    DEM


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