Plasma table wont fire ... hmmmm...

[R12rules]

I got back from lunch yesterday and the shop girl approaches me and says I'm to come inside with her.
Something about needing to check some fuses.


So I go strolling inside the shop and find out the plasma table isnt firing an arc.

I asked some questions and ended up drawing a blank.

Cybermation .... anybody ever trouble shoot a plasma system?

It does everything save for creating the arc.


didn't even have a contact number for the factory, at the time I was scratching my knogin.



any advice would result in suds being sent your way, if the info results in an action move for Monday.


cant beat that with a stick of sil-fos dipped in roof patch ... now can ya?

[icemeister]

I've never had the opportunity to play with one of these machines so I know near zero about them. I asked Mr Google:

http://www.hypertherm.com/technology/long_life.htm

This appears to be a good summary of the inner workings of a typical plasma cutting system. It's where I would start from.

[square2round]

Have you checked the tip and electrode?

They get worn and cause problems.

[ct2]

R-12...

The person to contact for cybermation Is Pete at the lockformer company in Chicago...I will have to look up his number, but first lets do a few things, they may seem rather foolish for me to suggest this but...


First and foremost of course is the Ground, The table must have a good ground and the power supply should be grounded to the same lug as the table

Cybermation is the table that lockformer built during the 80's and I have never heard anyone say anything good about the cybermation set up.,

ok once we have a good ground established, it's time to take the torch apart
The top of the torch and the bottom are threaded together, so seperate them .
inside the torch there is a gaget with two tubes on it that form a Y....one of those tubes delivers the air supply and the other connection is from the power supply

that assembly gets removed from the bottom of the torch , and that piece is a very common piece for the operator to break , causing a short in the torch and no plasma spark

Ok try that and if that doesnt work we can go on from there

1 more point!
the machine that we used was a three phase machine, however it was connected single phased( using only two of the three hot wires

ok , Pete at lockformer ( 800 441-2840 ext 3220 )

pete has assisted with the computer end of the vulcan system
electricial questions etc. He will do all he can to help

wait untill you hear his response when you tell him what you are working on

[ct2]

BTW the piece I described inside the torch needs to be insulated from the air tube with a piece of shrink tubing and the whole assembly insulated from the body of the torch

I hope this helped

[troyorr]

Instead of working on something you know nothing about (DIY), why not call a technician qualified and certified in working on this equipment?

[hvac_czar]

Originally posted by troyorr
Instead of working on something you know nothing about (DIY), why not call a technician qualified and certified in working on this equipment?

Because there are none left for this POS... Just ask Pete at Lockformer... he's the only one.

[R12rules]

Originally posted by ct2
BTW the piece I described inside the torch needs to be insulated from the air tube with a piece of shrink tubing and the whole assembly insulated from the body of the torch

I hope this helped

Thank you. This is exactly what I came here seeking.

I like it when someone who knows about something is willing to pass it along, freely, to someone they respect.

I believe you know I would take this only as far as I felt comfortable going ... and stop there. At my own discretion.

I have only known two industrial mechanics, personally, in my entire lifetime.
Maybe more ... but few and far between, to say the least.

Finding someone to work on this system is outside what I do, regularly.
I tried, Friday. No luck.

So I came here and found just what the doctor ordered.


Thanks.

[R12rules]

Originally posted by troyorr
Instead of working on something you know nothing about (DIY), why not call a technician qualified and certified in working on this equipment?

Troy, I dont know what you feel about the trade, but I believe that a seasoned HVAC/R mechanic is at THE Pinacle of industry! Any Industry!!!

Right up there with bio-med techs and industrial mechanics.

Only dif being ... we get paid less ... in some instances and receive a lot less respect.
Pity.


With all that we do in our day to day affairs ... we are qualified to know when to proceed with a repair and when to stop and ask for assistance.

If anyone thinks less of our trade skills and people ... that's their problem.




as far as why I would want to explore a plasma table to repair it ...
1) it is down. My new employer wants it up. It takes five men to do what that machine does with one person running it.

2) my employer asked me to check it out. And so ... at the advice of DiceMan and others here. .. (many others in fact), I simply keep my big mouth shut and do what I am told

3) I am curious.

4) I was being paid to troubleshoot an electro-mechanical system. Didn't seem to me like rocket science or nuthin'....

if nobody else at the shop comes up with a solution and I carry Pete's number in on Monday ... won't that look like I did something with my brain ...?

[condenseddave]

I've worked on my own portable plasma cutter. Not much to it, really, air and electric.

Like has been mentioned, the torch tip is a consumable...

You have no arc. Does the Xformer receive primary voltage?

Is your ground cable connection good on both ends?

Have you called a pro?

[ct2]

nstead of working on something you know nothing about (DIY), why not call a technician qualified and certified in working on this equipment?
-------------------------------------------------------------


Troy:

as the hvac_czar has stated and I will confirm

There is only one person in this country left that knows that system inside and out. The only way that anyone would know that system would be from the information they learned from the countless hours spent on the phone with Pete.

lockformer mad a real POS and sold a bunch of them and the few that still remain are nothing but a headache..

This ismuch more than a DIY project . I had to learn by hard knocks and if I can save anyone the grief I will

R_12

I am in Cali, not sure where you are but I leave for work at 1:30 in the afternoon cali time. If you still cant get it to fire, leave me a message here and I will check back throuout the morning...do you know when the last time this thing worked was?

[ct2]

condenseddave
Professional Member


Have you called a pro




Yes dave he has.

[burnman]

What is the brand name?

How big is it?

You said this is a table, it is not a hand held torch is it?

Is it a CNC?

Automatic torch height sensing?



Make sure you have all your gases turned on,also make sure you have a air supply.

Is there a full time operator for this machine?
If there is ask him, he should be able to help you alot.

Let us know these answer.
It will help getting to the problem.

[R12rules]

once again, I want to thank y'all for the helpful advice.

when this sucker works ... it works flawlessly.
To my knowledge, this is the first time ever had trouble of this degree.

That woman who ushered me into the work area, she is the operator.

She told me the system worked and then quit. She replaced the tip and it still didnt fire. So she called the owner and he said to get me to check the fuses on the main board.
Those were fine.

There is air pressure. And the servo motors operate to move the head around the table.

The ground has been cleaned, verified and re-inspected. All the grounds.

I will know more tomorrow morning.

[ct2]

burnman
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 3
What is the brand name?

How big is it?

You said this is a table, it is not a hand held torch is it?

Is it a CNC?

Automatic torch height sensing?



Make sure you have all your gases turned on,also make sure you have a air supply.

Is there a full time operator for this machine?
If there is ask him, he should be able to help you alot.

Let us know these answer.
It will help getting to the problem.
------------------------------------------------------


It is not a hand held torch

the brand is CYBERMATION

only a few were made by LOCKFORMER and they are a real pos but if you have one it must be maintained

yes it is a cnc, controlled by the VULCAN system like version 5.0 and it is not compatable with anything...

not even another vulcan verson

the vulcan program controls x&y and you manually set the height of z

it has an independant power supply and it only uses "CLEAN DRY AIR" shop air

the power supply is connected to its own disconnect and does not require the same power as the table

The table power is 110 volt to the computer and to the table
x&y are driven by two DC reversable motors
gears drive the axis and each axis has a belt driven encoder
that establishes o position and tells the vulcan controller how far each axis has travled

[ct2]

The DC drive motors each have 4 wires connected to them . because the terminals on the motors are of a size never seen before , ours used to fall off when it was in use

they are all black wires but they cant be switched as they are a + and - wire for each direction of the motor
so you mite want to mark them before you start so they cannot be swaped

I keep reliving that nitemare as the day progresses.

btw r-12 you have mail

[ct2]

That drawing I sent to your e-mail addy is a bad one but it resembles what you will find in the head

the tip and the hardware on the outside tube thread on to this piece . when cutting (like a circle) and the sheet metal peels up , all it takes is a hard bump for that piece to crack


I see where you are located so you are probably 1 or 2 hrs ahead of me. ill look for your post in the am

[burnman]

Try putting in all new consumables.

Is the height ok between the torch and the steel being cut?

On the machines I have run,you have the power source on,but you have a torch ON in the controls.

Is there a torch ON?

If a new program is being used,try one that you know works.

Will it fire manually?

Hope you get it going,let us know what you find Monday.

I run a 30 amp to 250 amp. ESAB table.

Good luck,Burnman

[ct2]

Bump this thread:for R-12 rules:

[ct2]

bump this 1 more time for R-12 rules

you must have that thing burning like mad by now

I get off at 11:00 so i'll check back then