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  1. #1
    During my schooling years my instructor taught us not to try to suck the solder into the mechanical joint, but instead to solder where the male copper enters the female joint and to build up the joint so the shoulder of the coupling/elbow is not visible...others where I work disagree and say to draw the solder inside ....just the same as when you sweat a water pipe....any opinions???

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,864
    I don't solder. I don't agree with soldering refrigerant lines. I know some techs swear by it but I have seen mostly problems with soldering refrigerant lines.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Poughkeepsie, Ny
    Posts
    631
    Originally posted by trapper101
    During my schooling years my instructor taught us not to try to suck the solder into the mechanical joint, but instead to solder where the male copper enters the female joint and to build up the joint so the shoulder of the coupling/elbow is not visible...others where I work disagree and say to draw the solder inside ....just the same as when you sweat a water pipe....any opinions???
    Read instructions that come with the equipment you purchase and it will tell you what materials you need to use to install the equipment piping properly.
    Happiness is the only good. The time to be happy is now. The place to be happy is here. The way to be happy is to make others so.
    -Robert Green Ingersoll

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Huntsville,AL
    Posts
    4,125
    a joint in piping with slip over joints must have the joint filled with the joining material -- whether chemical solvent for plastic or solder for copper piping or brazing -- not true for welding -- else the contact surface will be too small.

    brazing will give a stronger joint than soldering

    lots of other threads herein about this subject!

    joining is an art, material selection is a science.

    whether doing water piping or electrical joints, including circuit boards for the past 50 yr, I have ALWAYS heated the coupling socket or terminal to draw in the solder. Usually I have cleaned both items first, use rosin paste, then tinned both.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    4,198
    the solder that you don't see is the solder doing the work. any solder outside the joint is just decoration.


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Toledo,OH
    Posts
    142
    R410A you must braze. Higher pressures. Dont solder

  7. #7

    brazing or soldering?

    My last post about drawing solder into the joint seems to have come back with questionable answers....

    I use soldering and brazing synonomously (I know I misspelled that word)... However, what I do is in fact braze with acetylene and oxygen.....now do we suck the solder in the joint or just buildup around the shoulder...books say not to get flux into the joint due to corrosive acids.... to suck or not that is the question....minds out of the gutter...
    thanks

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,510
    clean the pipe and fitting
    little flux and put them together
    roll the flame arround the back of the flux will pull the fitting from the bottom because the heat will riase around to the top untill the solder flows. the flux will let the solder flow to the heat and fill the fitting. if you like let it cool down and then bead it around the bell
    for solder to work properly it has to flow into the joint and fill it in. as long as the flame is near the bach of the joint it will fill. i like to bead it after but only if it flows in to the fitting

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Wilmington, DE
    Posts
    355
    i never solder unless its water pipes, carrier wont even let you solder a puron system, it has to be brazed same with heat pumps have to be brazed in de i dont know about other states, but when it comes to solder i suck it into th e joint you would want to fill the gap as much is possible its not like welding wear the metals fuze into one, solder just sticks and fills the gap, plus brazing is so much stronger and with the pressures in a refrigerant system i wouldnt even consider it jsut purge with nitrogen while brazing

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    2,927
    Do a search here.This topic has been well covered by several other members,very well covered.
    I will give a quick answer because I dont type very fast.
    BOTH.You try to use the heat to pull the filler material into the joint,THEN puddle around the edge to make double sure.Also with copper to copper,you dont need flux.

    Does any one know where to go read about electronics soldering techniques?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    333
    Dynalowrider,

    Where did you read that Carrier requires lineset and filter drier brazing for their 410 systems. Would like the reference.
    meanwhile, back at the ranch.....

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Wilmington, DE
    Posts
    355
    didnt read it thats what carrier told us when we became a carrier dealer, shouldnt solder heat pumps either, was always taught that, some times when people solder little beads of solder get into the system and damage reversing valves, check with most manufacturers they will prefer that you braze heatpumps not solder, my company is will be facorty authorized by the end of the month, im a dealer now but to a facory auth dealer 50% of your staff need to be nate certified. so we are pretty close with carrier, carrier doesnt feel that solder is sufficient enough for the pressures that 410a creates some people may disagree but then again im not the engineer i just do what they say but if someone thinks that soldering is better i would need a good explanation why and i dont think there is one


    [Edited by dynalowrider79 on 08-25-2005 at 10:30 PM]

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Rapid City, SD
    Posts
    7,405
    If you solder a heat pump, in theory, couldn't the joint close to the heat pump get hot enough to come apart (despite pressure). Maybe not enough to actually melt the solder, but enough to soften it?

    Also at the last Trane school I was at they were showing the different strengths between silver solder and brazing. They had the same joint strength, but the bursting pressure of the brazed joint was 1/2 of what the soldered joint was.

    When I braze (almost all of the time) I do a combo between globbing it on and sucking it in. I know I get it sucked into the joint, probably not as far as soft solder but close, then a nice fillet between the pipe and socket.

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