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  1. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    So you agree that the Black South African should not be able to take the White South African's land? So how come you can not see it wrong for those disposed from what is now Israel to just be discarded even though they have lived there for centuries?

    The whites and blacks in South Africa are now living together in one state. How about if the Israelis let the Palestinians return and rather than have two states just have one country for all? Also compensate the people that had their property taken from them. If South Africa can do it surely it can work in the ME.
    Even the idea of this happening anytime soon is naive at best. In the real world you better protect your butt.

    There will never be peace unless it makes sense to both parties. The way I see it is, Israel is too smart to do anything that even resembles your idea. And I think the Palestinians are just biding their time and hoping that some country like Iran or Syria will destroy Israel. Either way it aint pretty. And real peace is probably just an illusion.

  2. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by newoldtech View Post
    The Palestinians did get their own State? But they wanted it all and waged war to try and get it.
    They wanted the right to return to their old lives in what is now Israel and claim the property taken from them. Some still want that but I doubt that is a viable option.

    Not sure of your first question, the Palestinians have not achieved a viable state yet. Israel has not allowed it.

  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by newoldtech View Post
    Even the idea of this happening anytime soon is naive at best. In the real world you better protect your butt.

    There will never be peace unless it makes sense to both parties. The way I see it is, Israel is too smart to do anything that even resembles your idea. And I think the Palestinians are just biding their time and hoping that some country like Iran or Syria will destroy Israel. Either way it aint pretty. And real peace is probably just an illusion.
    I am not saying they would or should. That was a response to answer a previous question. Even if the two could live together in peace those that want Israel as a Jewish country would loose political power if every Palestinian had an equal vote. In South Africa it worked because the people inside the country wanted to work toward peace. In Israel/Gaza/The West Bank, it is not only the people who live there that are pushing their agendas, put people outside.


    OK, now I have to go do some work.

  4. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    They wanted the right to return to their old lives in what is now Israel and claim the property taken from them. Some still want that but I doubt that is a viable option.

    Not sure of your first question, the Palestinians have not achieved a viable state yet. Israel has not allowed it.
    Wasn't the land divided in half in 1948? But the Palestianians(Arabs) did not want to accept it and started war after war. If it would have been accepted maybe there could of been that dream of them living in peace side by side. obviously no easy solutions but each side has to give some and in retrospect that was probably the best chance for it.

  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    They wanted the right to return to their old lives in what is now Israel and claim the property taken from them. Some still want that but I doubt that is a viable option.

    Not sure of your first question, the Palestinians have not achieved a viable state yet. Israel has not allowed it.
    Oh, the so called Palestinians certainly did want to return to their old lives. That would be their old lives under Ottoman rule when there was very little Jewish influence.

    What you seem to be missing is that the Palestinian Arab area of Palestine became Jordan in 1948 when Israel was made a State. A faction of those Palestinian Arabs, who are the same as the Jordanian Arabs, became so militant that even the Jordanians didn't want them;
    The period following the 1967 war saw an upsurge in the activity and numbers of Arab Palestinian paramilitary elements (fedayeen) within the state of Jordan. These distinct, armed militias were becoming a "state within a state", threatening Jordan's rule of law. King Hussein's armed forces targeted the fedayeen, and open fighting erupted in June 1970. The battle in which Palestinian fighters from various Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) groups were expelled from Jordan is commonly known as Black September.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordan

    Whether the design of the PLO was a deliberate Muslim ploy or not is uncertain. What it did was add confusion to who is who in the Middle East when in fact all Muslims work together to erradicate Jews one way or another.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by newoldtech View Post
    Wasn't the land divided in half in 1948? But the Palestianians(Arabs) did not want to accept it and started war after war. If it would have been accepted maybe there could of been that dream of them living in peace side by side. obviously no easy solutions but each side has to give some and in retrospect that was probably the best chance for it.
    In 1948, Palestine was divided between Israel for the Palestinian Jews and an extension of Jordan for the Palestinian Arabs. A large faction of Palestinian Arabs did not want Jews in the region at all. Even though they had their own land in Jordan, these Palestinian Muslims continued to attack Israel and cause trouble for Jordan. Eventually, Jordan ousted the Palestinians who had become a rogue nation within Jordan, calling themselves the Palestinian Liberation Organization.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  7. #46
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    Its all about..





    Lebensraum
    and


    We Have The Power To Make It So


    There is no solution exept to expell or kill all the non Jews, Israel will never accept a two state solution.

    Roy
    "The perfect Totalitarian State is one where the political bosses, and their army of managers, control a population of slaves, who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude"

  8. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by royc View Post
    Its all about..





    Lebensraum
    and


    We Have The Power To Make It So


    There is no solution exept to expell or kill all the non Jews, Israel will never accept a two state solution.

    Roy
    Just the opposite is true;
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    Lebensraum (help·info) (German for "habitat" or literally "living space") was one of the major political ideas of Adolf Hitler, and an important component of Nazi ideology. It served as the motivation for the expansionist policies of Nazi Germany, aiming to provide extra space for the growth of the German population, for a Greater Germany. In Hitler's book Mein Kampf, he detailed his belief that the German people needed Lebensraum ("living space", i.e. land and raw materials), and that it should be found in the East. It was the stated policy of the Nazis to kill, deport, or enslave the Polish, Russian and other Slavic populations, whom they considered inferior, and to repopulate the land with Germanic peoples. The entire urban population was to be exterminated by starvation, thus creating an agricultural surplus to feed Germany and allowing their replacement by a German upper class.
    Unlike Hitler's Germany, Israeli Jews only want the tiny piece of the Middle East that is now Israel. It is the Middle Eastern Muslims who want to erradicate Jews from that little area of the Middle East.

    Today's Palestinians are a displaced Muslim people who were forced to leave their own country of Jordan because they even caused trouble for the Muslims. At least that is the stand that the Muslim's in the Middel East are taking.

    With all of the lands in the Middle East available to Muslims, these self proclaimed Palestinian Arabs only want the land that Israel occupy's.

    No, it is not the Jews who were allies with Germany. The Islamic nations learned a few tricks from the Germans though.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  9. #48
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    This is about the most concise, down to earth description I can think of as to how the Six Days War came about;
    The boundaries came about as result of the 1967 Six Day War between Israel and its Arab neighbors, who had a combined population many, many multiples to that of the Jewish state. The Arab world, led by Egyptian President Gamal Abdul Nasser, got into a tizzy and was prepping to destroy Israel. For simplification sake, just imagine 30 guys surrounding and preparing to beat up and kill some seemingly tiny fella. Only, the tiny fella turned out to be Bruce Lee and instead of getting pummeled, he kicks the sh*t out of all of them — in six seconds. That’s the Six Day War in a nutshell.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  10. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Just the opposite is true; [/COLOR]Unlike Hitler's Germany, Israeli Jews only want the tiny piece of the Middle East that is now Israel. It is the Middle Eastern Muslims who want to erradicate Jews from that little area of the Middle East.

    Today's Palestinians are a displaced Muslim people who were forced to leave their own country of Jordan because they even caused trouble for the Muslims. At least that is the stand that the Muslim's in the Middel East are taking.

    With all of the lands in the Middle East available to Muslims, these self proclaimed Palestinian Arabs only want the land that Israel occupy's.

    No, it is not the Jews who were allies with Germany. The Islamic nations learned a few tricks from the Germans though.

    I dont know, everytime I see pictures of the "Security Wall" and the total devastation in Palestine, it reminds me of the Warsaw Getto, different times, different people....I just know when I was young I was so happy that the Jews got their own land, and I knew that they would never forget what was done to them, and do better......I guess I was wrong.

    Looks as though they learned a few tricks from the Germans also.





    Roy
    "The perfect Totalitarian State is one where the political bosses, and their army of managers, control a population of slaves, who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude"

  11. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by royc View Post
    I dont know, everytime I see pictures of the "Security Wall" and the total devastation in Palestine, it reminds me of the Warsaw Getto, different times, different people....I just know when I was young I was so happy that the Jews got their own land, and I knew that they would never forget what was done to them, and do better......I guess I was wrong.

    Looks as though they learned a few tricks from the Germans also.





    Roy
    You were happy for what happened to the Jews in Nazi Germany because you thought it would teach them a lesson!?

    I have a news flash for you; "Jews in Germany "WERE" Germans!" Many German Jews worked to aid Germany during WWI. The scientists that gave Germany the ability to make chemical fertilizer from the air which was also used for making weapons and synthetic gasoline that allowed Germany to last longer in it's fight against the world....were German Jews.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    You were happy for what happened to the Jews in Nazi Germany because you thought it would teach them a lesson!?

    I have a news flash for you; "Jews in Germany "WERE" Germans!" Many German Jews worked to aid Germany during WWI. The scientists that gave Germany the ability to make chemical fertilizer from the air which was also used for making weapons and synthetic gasoline that allowed Germany to last longer in it's fight against the world....were German Jews.
    I think you better re read my post, cause something isnt right about your reply.

    Roy
    "The perfect Totalitarian State is one where the political bosses, and their army of managers, control a population of slaves, who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude"

  13. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by royc View Post
    I think you better re read my post, cause something isnt right about your reply.

    Roy
    I would hope not. That is what I got from your post.

    Are you saying that your happiness was only for the Jews getting their own homeland....period?

    And you also knew that the German Jews who were not exterminated would never forget about the Jews who were exterminated? I think that goes without saying.

    Are you equating Jews in Israel not wanting to allow Muslims that have ousted from Jordan, who vow to wipe out Jews, to be allowed to form a country next to Israel the same as Germany exterminating millions of it's own people?
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


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