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  1. #1
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    Air purifiers that diffuse reactive oxygen species potentially cause DNA damage

    Air purifiers that diffuse reactive oxygen species potentially cause DNA damage in the Lung

    Several appliance manufacturers have recently released new type air purifiers that can disinfect bacteria, fungi and viruses by diffusing reactive oxygen species (ROS) into the air. In this study, mice were exposed to the outlet air from each of 3 air purifiers from different manufacturers (A, B, C), and the lung was examined for DNA damage, lipid peroxidation and histopathology to confirm the safety of these air purifiers.
    http://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jts/35/6/929/_pdf
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

  2. #2
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    Good job spotting that paper. Translation: you may get lung cancer if you use those devices. I can see lawsuits coming... It is unsurprising that chemicals toxic to bacteria have some sort of deleterious effect when breathed.
    -If you won't turn it on then nothing else matters.

  3. #3
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    You just can't broadcast something into an occupied space and not expect consequences. With our Commercial PCO systems that we design and build for Trane we produce these same hydroxyals but they have a fraction of a second of life span because they can not survive with out an energy source. So everything transpires with- in a 1/8 of an inch from the TIO2 media. Not all PCO systems are the same. These systems that broadcast these radicals and peroxides into an occupied space are going to have to pay the piper at some point.
    We have been drilled by the design engineers to back our systems efficiencies and its safety. I guess that's why ROA manufactures target the end users and contractors instead of the engineers. I can't even begin to tell people some of the critical places we have equipment going into right now.
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

  4. #4
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    I am just about to install a Lennox PureAir which is a PCO system. Should I be concerned about this?

  5. #5
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    From what genesis said in this last post and previously, my guess is that it's fine. My understanding is that it's like combustion engines -- there are clean ones and dirty ones. Genesis stated previously that the Lennox PCO was a good one, which I presume means it is fairly "clean".
    -If you won't turn it on then nothing else matters.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmeunier View Post
    From what genesis said in this last post and previously, my guess is that it's fine. My understanding is that it's like combustion engines -- there are clean ones and dirty ones. Genesis stated previously that the Lennox PCO was a good one, which I presume means it is fairly "clean".
    Hydroxyl radicals only have a life of 10 to the negative 9th or .000000001 seconds. When you are broadcasting Ions into a space there is continual production of radicals. When there are no ions being produced from the energy source like a true PCO system is suppose to be the hydroxyl radicals only survive fractions of an inch off of the catalyst at 500 fpm. The type UV lamps that Lennox uses will not produce ozone or ions. The difference in us an Lennox is the catalyst efficiency and energy source. We use a lamp that produces UVC only to get the highest energy source with out producing ozone to get a more germicidal effect. Lennox uses a combination of UVA and UVB lamps to activate their catalyst. When you dope a catalyst you can lower the amount of energy that is needed to activate it. But there will be consequences of intermediaries when you go below 254 nm with the lamps or energy source. Lennox's Pure Indoor Air is a great well manufactured residential product. Someday maybe we will do something targeting residential but for now we are geared toward the commercial, industrial market.
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

  7. #7
    g and pm
    Interesting article. As you may have guessed I am not surprised by its conclusions. I have been saying for years that the release of Reative Oxygen Species (ROS) in indoor spaces is not a good idea. This holds true for ozone, hydroxyl radicals or whatever. If it can attack living proteins such as mold or bacteria, it can also attack human tissues (and DNA).

    The problem with all of the indoor air ROS reactions is that they are neither complete or controllable. The reason why molecules like hydroxyl radicals and ozone or so reactive is that they are unstable ie. they have unpaired atoms (or charges). While it is true that hydroxyl radicals are very short lived in and of themselves, it is the byproducts they create that can cause the problem. In fact,these byproducts can often be more dangerous than their precursors.

    For example, in this study the authors state that the attack of the mouse DNA may actually be a result of the byproducts such as alkylperoxyl radicals, alkoxyl radicals and reactive carbonyls and not the hydroxyl radicals. Many of the reactions of ROS with other substances occur by "stealing" an atom from a stable molecule. The result is that the once stable molecule now becomes unstable and reactive. This cascading effect may take place for a relatively long period of time.

    Another unintended consequence is that the reactions lead to stable but undesirable substances such as formaldehyde.

    My prediction is that other researchers will be finding more results like this study in the future.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by genesis View Post
    Hydroxyl radicals only have a life of 10 to the negative 9th or .000000001 seconds. When you are broadcasting Ions into a space there is continual production of radicals. ...
    How can ions generate radicals? Aren't radicals more reactive, therefore having more energy than ions?
    -If you won't turn it on then nothing else matters.

  9. #9
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    When you read studies like this you can see someone was on a mission to discredit ROS and ignor the benefits. The mice where immature. The test instruments to measure ozone were like 1980's and then stated they were non-conclusive. I think Japan has bigger problems than ROS.

    I think I saw a study once that stated driving a vehicle can potentially cause accidents. Another one that said going into a swimming pool can potentially cause drowning.

    The only two things that I can think of as far as DNA damage is you can't be convicted of a crime with DNA as evidence and you won't be able to prove who your parents are.

    I guess the Japanese medical and pharmaceutical fields are worried about lost income just like this country. Don't want to cure anything, just keep on treating it.
    captain CO

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmeunier View Post
    How can ions generate radicals? Aren't radicals more reactive, therefore having more energy than ions?
    Global Plasma Solutions’ bi-polar ionization generator creates cold plasma
    discharge that consists of positive ions (H+) and negative ions (O2
    –) from water vapor in the air. These ions have the property of clustering around microparticles and gases, and thus, they surround harmful substances such as airborne mold, virus, bacteria, volatile organic compounds and allergens. At that point, a chemical reaction occurs on the cell membrane surface and they are transformed into OH radicals, a powerfully active but
    unstable material, which robs the harmful substance of a hydrogen atom (H). As a result, they are inactivated by severing the protein on the cell membrane, opening holes. The OH radicals instantly bond with the removed hydrogen (H), forming water vapor (H2O), and return to the air.
    http://www.globalplasmasolutions.com...asma%20Kill.pd
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Davis View Post
    When you read studies like this you can see someone was on a mission to discredit ROS and ignor the benefits. The mice where immature. The test instruments to measure ozone were like 1980's and then stated they were non-conclusive. I think Japan has bigger problems than ROS.

    I think I saw a study once that stated driving a vehicle can potentially cause accidents. Another one that said going into a swimming pool can potentially cause drowning.

    The only two things that I can think of as far as DNA damage is you can't be convicted of a crime with DNA as evidence and you won't be able to prove who your parents are.

    I guess the Japanese medical and pharmaceutical fields are worried about lost income just like this country. Don't want to cure anything, just keep on treating it.
    I have a dozen more case studies if you want them.
    Here is another


    The Role of Oxygen Free Radicals in Occupational and Environmental
    Lung Diseases
    Val Vallyathan and Xianglin Shi
    Health Effects Laboratory Division, National Institute for Occupational
    Safety and Health, Morgantown, West Virginia

    Lungs are vulnerable to endogenous and exogenous sources of ROS insults. They are well equipped with antioxidant defenses to negate normal oxidative insults. However, when the oxidative defenses are overwhelmed by formidable oxidant influx, injury results. ROS are frequently associated with many pulmonary diseases. They are increasingly being recognized as mediators of early cell injury in lung diseases.

    Free radicals are defined as atoms or molecules with one or more unpaired electrons. Oxygen-centered free radicals are those in which an unpaired electron is on an oxygen atom. While carbon- and nitrogen-centered free radicals are also important in biology and are reactive to living cells, oxygen-centered free radicals play a central role in the pathogenesis of many pulmonary diseases.

    One of the most common and important oxygen free radicals is the superoxide anion (02'-), which can be dismutated to form H202 and the highly reactive hydroxyl radical (OH) in the presence of Fe2+ and other trace metals.

    Considerable evidence has emerged in recent years implicating a central role for oxygen free radicals in the initiation of cellular injury that leads to the development of several lung diseases (1-3). It is well established that oxygen free radicals and their metabolites-collectively called reactive oxygen species (ROS)-can induce direct cell injury, which may trigger a cascade of radical reactions promoting the disease process. Furthermore, excessive generation of ROS may lead to: the stimulation of the inflammatory process; secretion of chemotactic factors, growth factors, proteolytic enzymes, lipoxygenases, and cycloxygenases; inactivation of antiproteolytic enzymes; and activation of oncogenes and transcription factors (1-8).

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...00326-0165.pdf
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

  12. #12
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    Not trying to be difficult but I have been reading studies on Ozone for years much like the ones you have that seem to come up with the same result. Key words in the study is excessive exposure! What is excessive? Usually concentrations that can only be created in a lab.

    I know dozens of people that have had respiratory problems, asthma, etc., that have experienced a complete reversal of syptoms when using these types of devices. Medical books I have talk about how oxidation, which includes radical oxygen, is the cure for almost all diseases.

    It is like when cities have Ozone Alerts. Is Ozone the real problem or is it pollution. Ozone is produced by the sun when pollution is high. Without higher levels of ozone outdoors we would all probably die.

    I have had personal experiences with these types of devices, mostly Ozone, for 25 years and have seen only positive results other than a very few that were sensitive to it. I still believe most of the medical studies on it are misguided and someone has an adjenda.

    I deal with CO most of the time and the government, authorities and the medical field feel it is okay to have 69ppm of carbon monoxide in your house year round.(70ppm is the first level alarms go off) Sure , more work for them.
    Makes me a little suspicious of everything else that comes from them.
    Last edited by Jim Davis; 05-11-2011 at 10:34 AM. Reason: add
    captain CO

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Davis View Post
    Not trying to be difficult but I have been reading studies on Ozone for years much like the ones you have that seem to come up with the same result. Key words in the study is excessive exposure! What is excessive? Usually concentrations that can only be created in a lab.

    I know dozens of people that have had respiratory problems, asthma, etc., that have experienced a complete reversal of symptoms when using these types of devices. Medical books I have talk about how oxidation, which includes radical oxygen, is the cure for almost all diseases.

    It is like when cities have Ozone Alerts. Is Ozone the real problem or is it pollution. Ozone is produced by the sun when pollution is high. Without higher levels of ozone outdoors we would all probably die.

    I have had personal experiences with these types of devices, mostly Ozone, for 25 years and have seen only positive results other than a very few that were sensitive to it. I still believe most of the medical studies on it are misguided and someone has an agenda.

    I deal with CO most of the time and the government, authorities and the medical field feel it is okay to have 69ppm of carbon monoxide in your house year round.(70ppm is the first level alarms go off) Sure , more work for them.
    Makes me a little suspicious of everything else that comes from them.
    Jim, your not being difficult. Its a great opinionated post. The majority off my working background has been involved with servicing Commercial HVAC. With only 12 years in IAQ. Your occupation as a consultant lets you see many things. I have spent the last 10 years bringing a new technology to market. And we get raked over the coals monthly from PEs, consultants over safety and efficiencies. Then they want to know how we compare to other technologies. When they throw the caution flags at us I am dang sure going to point out the deficiencies with others. There is to much over marketing in IAQ and mistrust. And when other technologies aren't held to the standards they we are being held to. Then I tend to push back.
    I have projects right now that have hundreds of thousands of people passing thru environments with our equipment treating it. I have to know the boundaries of our equipment so that other salesman don't misrepresent it or over sale it.
    IAQ and HVAC is evolving right now with the LEEDs movement and drive for energy efficiencies. Its only going to make IAQ more challenging as technology evolves.
    The premise of ventilation is that the OA is clean or of sufficient quality to be used for dilution. Traditional ventilation is somewhat being threatened by the fact that the EPA is changing the requirements for outdoor air quality which is creating non-attainment zones in what is now becoming a significant portion of the country. That means that buildings in those areas will need to clean up the OA before they bring it into the building.
    www.genesisair.com
    Genesis Air Inc.

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