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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,635
    Yes. Let us know. The old pros here are too senile to remember anything past this morning. And the young ones have an equally hard time due to the brain damage caused by the TV and the MTV. It'll be like starting over.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    5
    Second tech came out this morning and found the compressor had grounded out. His explanation was that the system had lost all refrigerant, and lacking a low-pressure automatic shutoff (or something like that!)it fried. Guess I'll never know if it was the accumulator that leaked (as the first guy suspected but didn't check to be sure). He asked if I just wanted to "get by"- meaning he'd find me a used compressor and hook it up- on the "side", of course! I wonder how many jobs get lost to the contractor because his guys flip them like this ( but that's another subject I guess)...

    I told him no, that I wanted to do it "right". He and his service manager both told me that they sell Goodman, but recommended I spend the extra dollars and go with Lennox. In their opinion, Goodman is a "lower-end" product and not something I should put into my own home I'm going to be spending the next fifteen years in. I will not discuss price (!), but they will be installing a 3-ton, 13 seer Lennox compressor tomorrow, with replacement of the air handler next week. Fortunately I have a linen closet directly below where the existing attic handler is mounted so we're going to put it there.

    I do have one more question- I noticed that the ductwork in the attic (flex) has the outer plastic vapor barrier deteriorated to a point where it has fallen off most of the ductwork. There is an inner plastic vapor barrier still intact; does this need to be replaced?

    Thanks again for helping me do the right thing...

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    340
    Originally posted by tobnpr
    they will be installing a 3-ton, 13 seer Lennox compressor tomorrow, with replacement of the air handler next week. Fortunately I have a linen closet directly below where the existing attic handler is mounted so we're going to put it there.

    I noticed that the ductwork in the attic (flex) has the outer plastic vapor barrier deteriorated to a point where it has fallen off most of the ductwork. There is an inner plastic vapor barrier still intact; does this need to be replaced?
    How did they know you need a 3 ton system? Before you approve the installation they should do a heat loss calculation to insure that is the right size.

    Your installation contract should include replacement of the lineset and any deteriorated ductwork, along with a leak check of all ductwork.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,635
    Travis is right of course. But given the timing it likely won't happen. At least you're not upsizing for no apparent reason as seemed to be the case before.

    Side work is indeed another topic. As far as I'm concerned that technician is a thief. I understand the reluctance to do so. But personally I'd inform his boss. I am my brother’s keeper. When I know a wrong is being committed I'm responsible to do something about it when I can. I've never had employees. So this isn't personal. It's principle.

    BTW: How did we go from only having a leak to now having a grounded compressor? Sheesh. Contractors these days...

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    997
    they are replacing a three ton for a three ton

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    340
    Originally posted by drk
    they are replacing a three ton for a three ton
    http://www.proctoreng.com/articles/bigger.html

    "In the Model Energy Communities Project, Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) found that 53% of the air conditioners checked were a ton (12,000 Btu/h) or more oversized and a study by Pacific Northwest Laboratories found a third of the air conditioners to be a ton or more oversized."

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Waco, Texas, USA
    Posts
    6,153
    This oversizing claim is a big load of crap. Oversized for what? The house? Who are we to tell a homeowner how cool he/she can be? They are paying the bill right?

    Now I agree a system can be oversized for the ductwork....
    "And remember my sentimental friend......that a heart is not judged by how much you love, but by how much you are loved by others" - Wizard of Oz.

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Mechanicsville, Virginia
    Posts
    1,417
    Originally posted by Steve Wiggins
    Who are we to tell a homeowner how cool he/she can be?
    Your right, it's ultimately the customers choice whether to oversize or not.

    We should not just offer "cool" we should offer comfort, and comfort is cool and dry. And let's not ignore how comfortable it is to save a few bucks, each month and down the road.

    We should educate homeowners so they can make an informed decision and not an ignorant one.



    "If perfection is your goal, you may end up with good enough, what might you end up with when good enough is your goal?"
    efficientcomfort.net

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    340
    Originally posted by Steve Wiggins
    This oversizing claim is a big load of crap.
    Hi Steve.

    Got a citation for that statement?

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    burlington county n.j.
    Posts
    9,763
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by tobnpr
    [B]Second tech came out this morning and found the compressor had grounded out.

    they will be installing a 3-ton, 13 seer Lennox compressor tomorrow, with replacement of the air handler next week.


    no way i would install a new unit on a system that shorted out a compressor then come back a week later to do air handler. any contaminants from old system start destroying new compressor from the start. if total system can't be done til next week, then come up with temp cooling or go on a vacation.

  11. #37
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Orlando,FL
    Posts
    226
    Hi tobnr,
    I have been doing installs & service on systems in central FL for 13 years.This contractor is not doing you right.First,never have the CU bigger than the AHU.Second,it is poor pratice to match a new high efficiency unit with a older low efficiency unit.It would be wise to go ahead & get a new matching AHU at the same time.Due to your existing ductwork & it being a zoned system go with the same size as your present equipment.I would advise getting more bids.

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Gold Coast of Connecticut
    Posts
    4,656
    Your ductwork needs to be replaced, i am ashamed the contractor did not take the time to look in the attic.

    I would pass on this contractor and look for another!

    The ductwork is driving up your electric bill big time!
    Aire Serv of SW Connecticut- Gas heat, dual fuel and central a/c systems installed and serviced

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    The customer should decide what indoor temperature they want,ie 75 versus 78°F,and then install the correct size to maintain that.Use Manual J/equivilent and you'll have the right size,assuming you use Man. S to selecct the system.


    Sized larger than that is ,just the wrong thing to do.

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