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Thread: Saver Switch

  1. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    St Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    3,468
    Originally posted by craig1
    cycle the compressor for 15 minutes? what kind of BS is that. sounds like a super energy wasting system.

    think of it this way. the compressor runs for 15 minutes. during this time theres is little sensible heat removal, but alot of latent heat (humiditiy) removal. the humidity is building up on the coil, but not running down the drain yet. Now the Saver Switch shuts off the condensor, but the fan continues to run. All of the moisture collected on the evaportator, evapores into the air. now the next time the condensor comes back on it will have to re-remove the humidity before it starts cooling the house. so basically, the A/C is running longer to do the same job. don't forget the fact that the entire time the indoor fan is burning energy while doing nothing to cool the house while the condensor is off.



    but i have come up with a plan to make the saver switch worthwhile. I am going to get 10 broken condensors and "install" them in my backyard. then i will have the utility install install "Saver Switches" on all of them. at $3 each i'll be getting 30 bucks a month back on my bill The plan cant fail

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    St Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    3,468
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by craig1
    [B]cycle the compressor for 15 minutes? what kind of BS is that. sounds like a super energy wasting system.

    think of it this way. the compressor runs for 15 minutes. during this time theres is little sensible heat removal, but alot of latent heat (humiditiy) removal. the humidity is building up on the coil, but not running down the drain yet. Now the Saver Switch shuts off the condensor, but the fan continues to run. All of the moisture collected on the evaportator, evapores into the air. now the next time the condensor comes back on it will have to re-remove the humidity before it starts cooling the house. so basically, the A/C is running longer to do the same job. don't forget the fact that the entire time the indoor fan is burning energy while doing nothing to cool the house while the condensor is off.



    Looks like you are assuming that the unit was just started prior to the saver switch cycling. Not true in most cases.
    Power company states that they don't cycle that much...only in +90 temps.

    Some condensation runs down the coil and out soon after a residential unit is started. Only excessive air can overcome gravity and if you have that, you don't have humidity removal. But you are right about a constantly wet coil and perhaps readding humidity.

    Most people who pick a setting on the tstat in the morning are not affected by the above because the humidity has already been removed prior to any saver switch cycling and their unit probably isn't calling for cool at times the saver switch is cycling. Even if it is, they will not be affected as much by cycling.


    "don't forget the fact that the entire time the indoor fan is burning energy while doing nothing to cool the house while the condensor is off."

    I don't get this at all. Are you saying that running the indoor fan constantly burns energy? Many people use it to circulate air 24/7, plus with EAC's and better filters, it is recommended. Also, a motor starting frequently draws a higher current than one running but I don't want to get into this argument without statistics. I've heard it both ways and myself have decided it is about even or slightly tilted one way but not enough to worry. If I remove more pollutants from the air why not pay extra?

    I'm not a fan of the saver switches and I don't think new units need them. They are more energy efficient anyway and excessive starting and stopping of anything produced overseas can not be good for the unit. They breaks soon enough as it is.

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    St Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    3,468
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by markco
    [B][QUOTE]Originally posted by MikeJ
    [B]
    Originally posted by tpa-fl
    Originally posted by mr hvac41
    Makes me wonder how many no cooling calls are made b/c people (especially old people) forget they have these energy saver switches installed.
    Any time I go on a call that has a saver switch, I make a note on the invoice that they have one. That way, if we have a hot spell, where the power company is activating the switch, and the customer calls and says their outside unit isn't running, the dispatcher can look at their profile, and advise them that the power company is cycling it. Saves the customer a service charge. Hey MikeJ, how are things going at your present employer. Are you keeping busy? Ran into Larry a couple of days ago, said you guys were busy. I started at a new company two weeks ago, and they are looking for another tech. If you are looking for a change, give me a call.
    You must have better dispatcher than the Larry & Co. I don't seem them looking up anything. I was off for the longest time due to our cold spring and being in the wrong union for a svc tech. Found a new home tho. Been seeing OD from new heights instead of bsmts. Look up from 694 and you'll see me. And I don't have to mess with dye anymore.

    Try me at comcast.net Use first name.l.last name and I'll mail you back. Cant find your phone number on old list. Thru out most of the stuff from Dick and Joes. Dick and I didn't see eye to eye I guess so now I am with his competitor.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    12

    DTE (Detroit Edison)

    I don't think the power companies actually do what they say... Example: DTE (Detroit Edison) says with their A/C Switch, they will give you up to 10 minutes off per hour. What actually is the case is they have it on 10 minutes off 35-40minutes, on again for 10 minutes off again for 35-40 minutes! The house gets so warm and uncomfortable, you may as well not have A/C! Needless to say, a big NO to that option from DTE.

  5. #31
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    996
    just for the record, i did not state this quote:



    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by markco

    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by MikeJ

    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by tpa-fl

    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by mr hvac41
    Makes me wonder how many no cooling calls are made b/c people (especially old people) forget they have these energy saver switches installed.




    yeah, i think that was a simple mistake. now, instead of 10, why dont you do 20 condensers and sign up for the water heater save switch and have 20 h20 heaters in your basement all crammed into a corner. tell them you have designed your vairiable capacity water thermal temperature adjustment system that adapts to any and all needs and capacities of slightly subcooled water demands within .000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 degrees farenheight. also tell them that it also handles air thermal temperature adjustments that adapts to any and all needs and capacities of air demands within .000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 degrees farenheight.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    North St Paul MN
    Posts
    858
    What?
    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy.

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    4H: Hot, Humid Houston H.O.
    Posts
    3,304

    Serious allegation

    Dro1984 said:

    >>I don't think the power companies actually do what they say... Example: DTE (Detroit Edison) says
    >>with their A/C Switch, they will give you up to 10 minutes off per hour. What actually is the case is
    >>they have it on 10 minutes off 35-40minutes, on again for 10 minutes off again for 35-40 minutes!

    This would be dynamite information if you could prove it. Reason is, DTE is a regulated utility and they only got permission to cycle according to a certain plan. Certainly not what you reported. So if this could be proved, it could be at the center of a hum-dinger of a class action lawsuit.

    Best of luck -- P.Student

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    149
    Originally posted by tinknocker service tech
    i use to service those switches for power plus here in jersey. they do not save you anything they are so when there is a power demand thhey can turn you off and cycle you so the power thhe electric co saves can go somewhere esle. the program is very misleading. you are told you will save on electric and they will also give you another 3 dollars a month on top of you savings. this is not true.
    the power co. saves and sells it somewhere else
    this is why i do not service them anymore. if they were to tell the truth well maybe i would think differantly.
    Now that I have had mine for a while, I agree. The switch is a scam. It's not being used for emergencies (to prevent brownouts or blackouts) it's being used for peak load shavings by the utility. I'm going to bypass mine or have it removed. They turn the switch on at 11AM and off again at 8PM. That means my compressor is cycling on and off at 15 minute intervals all day (effecitvely turning my A/C off half the time). No wonder it's 80 degrees inside my house! I wouldn't mind if they used it only when they really needed it, but it seems to be that they are using it for economic purposes only, not technical ones.

    [Edited by zzyzzx on 08-04-2005 at 04:28 PM]

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